Is this where we can discussion the airport and rail and such?

Yep! There is enough interest and traffic around these subjects we felt they deserved their own forum.

I can see myself hanging out here often...

Fantastic addition! Thanks Pete. :-)

Maybe instead of the one gigantic WRWA thread, subjects related to WRWA can be posted subject-for-subject here, without disturbing (by having more topics related to the airport) and possibly confusing those who don't follow it as closely as some of us?

I can talk about my truck. :-D

I would like to see our local area local governments buy a few more snow plows.
Many northern cities equip their sanitation trucks with plows. Why couldn’t we do at least some of this?
When so much commerce is lost for several days after a major winter storm has ended the plows would easily pay for them
self’s many,many, many times over during their life.

I would like to see our local area local governments buy a few more snow plows.
Many northern cities equip their sanitation trucks with plows. Why couldn’t we do at least some of this?
When so much commerce is lost for several days after a major winter storm has ended the plows would easily pay for them
self’s many,many, many times over during their life.

The City of OKC has enough plows to clear the designated snow routes and that's all they need, surely you don't expect them to clear every neighborhood street in OKC.

The City of OKC has enough plows to clear the designated snow routes and that's all they need, surely you don't expect them to clear every neighborhood street in OKC.

No---- they clearly do not have nearly enough equipment to do the job in a timely way.

When a very high percentage of area population is unable to work or shop for several days unplowed roads cost our city, county and state governments far more money than the cost of removal.

When sanitation trucks are idled by a storm they could easily be equipped with plows until normal service can be restored.

No---- they clearly do not have nearly enough equipment to do the job in a timely way.

When a very high percentage of area population is unable to work or shop for several days unplowed roads cost our city, county and state governments far more money than the cost of removal.

When sanitation trucks are idled by a storm they could easily be equipped with plows until normal service can be restored.

Talk about a waste of tax dollars, spends 100's of thousands on snow plows for a once in 20 year snow storm, there's more practical ways to spend the money.

Talk about a waste of tax dollars, spends 100's of thousands on snow plows for a once in 20 year snow storm, there's more practical ways to spend the money.

Maybe you've been spending too much time at the lake rc, you're "once in 20 year snow storm" seems to be almost a yearly deal around here lately. As someone who can't take off work because the roads are too bad, I went out and bought a 4wd truck after the last couple of years of having to hitch rides with fellow workers who had one. Haven't felt the need for one since I was in my early 20's.

Talk about a waste of tax dollars, spends 100's of thousands on snow plows for a once in 20 year snow storm, there's more practical ways to spend the money.

You may spend a few hundred thousand to buy plows. But you already have the sanitation trucks and personnel who are typically doing next to nothing in a bad storm. You would easily save millions in lost tax revenue by getting a good size percentage of your population back to work and out shopping quicker.

Increasing very slow emergency response times and saving lives has its own value.

There is a OKC news conference going on as I type this.

They are talking about how emergency response times have been slowed and how people have shoveled out their own streets to help emergency vehicles pass down their streets.



We don’t have enough plows.

Let’s also not forget that ice and snow are very hard on our roads.
This cost tax payers millions if not billions.

The longer the ice and snow sits on pavement the more damage that’s being done to our roads and to our vehicles, caused by bad roads and accidents.

or maybe some salt and sand trucks instead of plows for some of the side streets... too many cars along non snow emergency streets for plows.

Maybe you've been spending too much time at the lake rc, you're "once in 20 year snow storm" seems to be almost a yearly deal around here lately. As someone who can't take off work because the roads are too bad, I went out and bought a 4wd truck after the last couple of years of having to hitch rides with fellow workers who had one. Haven't felt the need for one since I was in my early 20's.

Wrong again (some things never change), last year was ice (which snow plows and 4 wheel drive vehicles are useless), this time it was mostly snow. I drive a 2 wheel drive Tahoe and have yet to have any problems driving anywhere I wish to go, guess I'm not only more educated on City finaces, but also a better driver.

I have seen 5 4x4 vehicles stuck in front my house the past 2 winters including one today.
One of these was a Humvee. It will be tomorrow before a car can navigate this street.

I even put up a small amount of snow fence for this storm or it would have been worse.

It would be a lot more convenient if they plowed every single neighborhood but that would be extremely costly, especially in a sprawling city. A lot of cities that get way more snow than OKC like KC, St. Louis, Louisville, etc. basically have the same policy as us. Even Denver only plows residential streets if there is at least 6 inches. On average this place gets 8 inches in a single winter.

With the exception of this and the Christmas Eve snowstorm it is usually sunny and above freezing within 48 hours after one of our winter events. Freak events like this are something you just have to hunker down for.

Wrong again (some things never change), last year was ice (which snow plows and 4 wheel drive vehicles are useless), this time it was mostly snow. I drive a 2 wheel drive Tahoe and have yet to have any problems driving anywhere I wish to go, guess I'm not only more educated on City finaces, but also a better driver.

Wow junkie, nice to see you back to your old form and winning personality. I guess you got over getting your feelings hurt every time you got on here. Anyhoo, as someone who gets to respond to emergencies in this weather, I can assure you that it was way more than ice last year. Maybe you don't remember because you were sitting at the lake during last years storm, as I recall. And by the way, if you're as adept at driving as you are accurate about city finances, I'm suprised you still have a license.

Wow junkie, nice to see you back to your old form and winning personality. I guess you got over getting your feelings hurt every time you got on here. Anyhoo, as someone who gets to respond to emergencies in this weather, I can assure you that it was way more than ice last year. Maybe you don't remember because you were sitting at the lake during last years storm, as I recall. And by the way, if you're as adept at driving as you are accurate about city finances, I'm suprised you still have a license.

Oh crap, your working in this weather, that's just great, now all we'll hear for the next month is "how great we are, we need new and better equipment for the next storm, we need more money because we work in inclement weather and put ourselves in harms way, wah wah wah.

Oh crap, your working in this weather, that's just great, now all we'll hear for the next month is "how great we are, we need new and better equipment for the next storm, we need more money because we work in inclement weather and put ourselves in harms way, wah wah wah.

Have you ever worked for extended periods (as in all day) outside as an adult for pay in a blizzards where lives depend on your decisions?
And if so in what capacity?

Oh crap, your working in this weather, that's just great, now all we'll hear for the next month is "how great we are, we need new and better equipment for the next storm, we need more money because we work in inclement weather and put ourselves in harms way, wah wah wah.

You're letting that inferiority complex show.LOL

You may spend a few hundred thousand to buy plows. But you already have the sanitation trucks and personnel who are typically doing next to nothing in a bad storm. You would easily save millions in lost tax revenue by getting a good size percentage of your population back to work and out shopping quicker.

Increasing very slow emergency response times and saving lives has its own value.

There's probably a cost-benefit analysis someone has done somewhere. If it snows x number of times a year, you can justify spending x number of dollars. The biggest problem in Oklahoma is that we've had two bad snowstorms in two years, but there are years when it never snows. You'd also then have to factor in the life of plows, storage, maintenance, etc. You may be right.....it may be worth it and I think it's clever to add a plow to a sanitation truck, but it is also possible we could go a long time before needing them again.

You could do what I did and move downtown so you can walk everywhere when it snows! I just got back from the Ford Center and walked to Coffee Slingers this morning. If I didn't happen to have just finished my 16 day stint at work and have a couple of days off, I could have walked to work.

I would like to see our local area local governments buy a few more snow plows.
Many northern cities equip their sanitation trucks with plows. Why couldn’t we do at least some of this?
When so much commerce is lost for several days after a major winter storm has ended the plows would easily pay for them
self’s many,many, many times over during their life.

Evidently one of your northern cities isn't faring quite so well.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_localwbez/20110202/ts_yblog_localwbez/blizzard-blasts-chicago-shuts-down-power-schools-and-roads

Having trucks with plows only helps after a major snowstorm is over. There isn't much that can be done during the middle of a blizzard.

Betts:

Hope you have Yak-Tracks attached to your footwear. They have to be the one of the best purchases I have ever made (even w/s&h, were less than $20). in the informercial, they show people jogging on ice (not that you are ever going to see me jogging, ice or not...LOL)

And if you do decide to get out and walk, be extremely careful of any exposed skin

Evidently one of your northern cities isn't faring quite so well.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_localwbez/20110202/ts_yblog_localwbez/blizzard-blasts-chicago-shuts-down-power-schools-and-roads

Having trucks with plows only helps after a major snowstorm is over. There isn't much that can be done during the middle of a blizzard.

Not DURING the blizzard, by the time the plow gets out of sight (100ft or less) what they plowed is already covered back up again. In a fit of temporary insanity, I did that during this one, shoveled a small section of sidewalk (about 6 ft) wind was to my back and didn't think to much of it, turned around to walk back to my door and the bare sidewalk I had just shoveled was already covered with snow!

Not DURING the blizzard, by the time the plow gets out of sight (100ft or less) what they plowed is already covered back up again. In a fit of temporary insanity, I did that during this one, shoveled a small section of sidewalk (about 6 ft) wind was to my back and didn't think to much of it, turned around to walk back to my door and the bare sidewalk I had just shoveled was already covered with snow!

That was my point. Some people think the city should have all of the snow removed by the time the snow quits falling.

LOL

Got ya.

Better yet, have it all removed before any falls. Be proactive rather than reactive!

You're letting that inferiority complex show.LOL


No, your letting your Superiority Complex Show, as you always do. You just get upset because some refuse to bow at your presence.

Have you ever worked for extended periods (as in all day) outside as an adult for pay in a blizzards where lives depend on your decisions?
And if so in what capacity?

No, but if I did, I wouldn't pretend to be greater than thou and resort to name calling when someone disagreed with my opinion.

What station do you work at ?

No, but if I did, I wouldn't pretend to be greater than thou and resort to name calling when someone disagreed with my opinion.

What station do you work at ?


If you had worked outdoors preforming critical task during or just after a Blizzard you would be more likely to be more understanding of the need to have more snow removal equipment.

Among other things while working for an energy Company I have operated large snow removal equipment and helped keep the natural gas on to entire large cities during worse winter condition than we have ever seen in OKC.

While it’s been tempting,,,,, show me where I called YOU a name?

That was my point. Some people think the city should have all of the snow removed by the time the snow quits falling.

I don’t believe that.:ohno:

Except to reach an emergency snow removal during high winds is usually a waste of time.
Snow removal shouldn’t generally start until the visibility is sufficient to see well.

No, your letting your Superiority Complex Show, as you always do. You just get upset because some refuse to bow at your presence.

Tell you what junkster, I'll challenge you to show me where I've done this. Pull up the post and put it up here or admit that you're completely full of feces. You on the other hand continue to swipe at anything that any PS employees have to say as if it's a hobby for you. As I said before, it's nice to see you making your undeniable impression on a whole new set of posters. Keep it up.

There's probably a cost-benefit analysis someone has done somewhere. If it snows x number of times a year, you can justify spending x number of dollars. The biggest problem in Oklahoma is that we've had two bad snowstorms in two years, but there are years when it never snows. You'd also then have to factor in the life of plows, storage, maintenance, etc. You may be right.....it may be worth it and I think it's clever to add a plow to a sanitation truck, but it is also possible we could go a long time before needing them again.

You could do what I did and move downtown so you can walk everywhere when it snows! I just got back from the Ford Center and walked to Coffee Slingers this morning. If I didn't happen to have just finished my 16 day stint at work and have a couple of days off, I could have walked to work.

Good post
IMO It’s not so much the number of events as it is the time that it shuts down commerce.
How much does it cost the local economy when local business has unscheduled closures for days at time? Just a guess and I could be wrong but it’s got to be well over one hundred million for 3 days of lost work. It would be a good idea to ask our local business about how much they lost during this event.
In Norman where in live I can recall 4 snow’s where shut things down in the past 10 or so years.
If we don’t use the plows that often the life of plows without accident and with good maintenance is a very long time. During the off season many people put a thick layer of grease on their plows.
There is a blade on the bottom of a plow that needs replacement fairly often.

Evidently one of your northern cities isn't faring quite so well.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_localwbez/20110202/ts_yblog_localwbez/blizzard-blasts-chicago-shuts-down-power-schools-and-roads

Having trucks with plows only helps after a major snowstorm is over. There isn't much that can be done during the middle of a blizzard.

Yes…. I was aware of that situation
However because the have equipped many of their sanitation trucks with plows they will be back to normal much quicker than they otherwise would have been.
If OKC bought 15 to 20 plows for sanitation trucks it would help.
3 or 4 in Norman would help a great deal.

If you had worked outdoors preforming critical task during or just after a Blizzard you would be more likely to be more understanding of the need to have more snow removal equipment.

Among other things while working for an energy Company I have operated large snow removal equipment and helped keep the natural gas on to entire large cities during worse winter condition than we have ever seen in OKC.

While it’s been tempting,,,,, show me where I called YOU a name?

I can see you've not had the pleasure of conversing with the junkie before. The first thing you need to know is that if you disagree with him at all, you've automatically declared yourself to be his enemy. He doesn't deal well with opinions that differ from his own and his fall back is to start attacking. The up side is he's pretty easy to pick apart, even when he doesn't know your doing it.

Betts:

Hope you have Yak-Tracks attached to your footwear. They have to be the one of the best purchases I have ever made (even w/s&h, were less than $20). in the informercial, they show people jogging on ice (not that you are ever going to see me jogging, ice or not...LOL)

And if you do decide to get out and walk, be extremely careful of any exposed skinI have a pair of old Vibram sole boots that I put studs in.
I took a number 4 sheet metal screw and ground off the sharp edges on the head of the screw and then screwed them into the bottom of the boots. With them I can walk almost normal on a sheet of ice.
Cost was under $3

Betts:

Hope you have Yak-Tracks attached to your footwear. They have to be the one of the best purchases I have ever made (even w/s&h, were less than $20). in the informercial, they show people jogging on ice (not that you are ever going to see me jogging, ice or not...LOL)

And if you do decide to get out and walk, be extremely careful of any exposed skin

Larry, the word on the street (Colorado, where I moved here from) is that good after ski boots work just fine on snow. Nothing works on ice. And, I grew up in Minnesota, I know all about exposed skin. Just don't lick any light poles! I walked to and from the Ford Center last night and to and from Coffee Slingers yesterday. My dogs and I were out both yesterday and the day before. Where I come from, this was a snowstorm, not much of a blizzard. I actually love walking to Bricktown or the Ford Center in weather like this....it makes it seem a bit more like an adventure than usual.

Betts, I have it on good advice from some of the EMSA people that Bass Pro has some addons for your shoes that have some small studs on them that make a big difference on the ice. I'm going to have to check them out.

If you had worked outdoors preforming critical task during or just after a Blizzard you would be more likely to be more understanding of the need to have more snow removal equipment.

Among other things while working for an energy Company I have operated large snow removal equipment and helped keep the natural gas on to entire large cities during worse winter condition than we have ever seen in OKC.

While it’s been tempting,,,,, show me where I called YOU a name?

I never said it was you that name called, guilty conscience ?

Tell you what junkster, I'll challenge you to show me where I've done this. Pull up the post and put it up here or admit that you're completely full of feces. You on the other hand continue to swipe at anything that any PS employees have to say as if it's a hobby for you. As I said before, it's nice to see you making your undeniable impression on a whole new set of posters. Keep it up.


Don't you have someone to go rescue !!

I can see you've not had the pleasure of conversing with the junkie before. The first thing you need to know is that if you disagree with him at all, you've automatically declared yourself to be his enemy. He doesn't deal well with opinions that differ from his own and his fall back is to start attacking. The up side is he's pretty easy to pick apart, even when he doesn't know your doing it.

How funny, this from the man that thinks "How great thou Art" was written for him.

Don't you have someone to go rescue !!
Not at the moment. Since you obviously can't back up your suppositions, I'll bid you adieu, so we don't completely hijack the thread.

How funny, this from the man that thinks "How great thou Art" was written for him.
Like I said, show me some posts or admit what we all know, you're completely full of feces and continue to prove it with every post.

Not at the moment. Since you obviously can't back up your suppositions, I'll bid you adieu, so we don't completely hijack the thread.

Like I said, show me some posts or admit what we all know, you're completely full of feces and continue to prove it with every post.

Yawn!!!!!, good night little man.

betts (and everyone else) who think that nothing works on ice, give the Yak_Tracks a try. they work very well on ice. I prefer this type over the stud type as there is more surface area making contact/gripping the ice. it is a coiled spring wrapped around a rubber framework that slips on existing footwear.

As to the screw option mentioned earlier, aren't those screw heads uncomfortable on the bottom of the feet? how do you get the screwdriver far enough down into the shoe to attach the screws near the toe area and lastly, doesn't the holes caused by the screws cause leakage into the boots?

An advantage to the type I mentioned, they are removable (don't have to ruin a pair of shoes) and compact (easily fit into a jacket pocket). One caution though, while they work excellent in snow and ice and even carpeting, once inside and on a smooth floor (polished concrete, ceramic tile etc), they are slicker than snot (must be removed at earliest possible moment).

I never said it was you that name called, guilty conscience ?

It was implied since you made the statement in reply to ou84A's post, in your post #30

Originally Posted by ou48A

Have you ever worked for extended periods (as in all day) outside as an adult for pay in a blizzards where lives depend on your decisions?
And if so in what capacity?

Your reply:

No, but if I did, I wouldn't pretend to be greater than thou and resort to name calling when someone disagreed with my opinion.

What station do you work at ?

It was implied since you made the statement in reply to ou84A's post, in your post #30

Originally Posted by ou48A


Your reply:

My response was to Wambo36, he takes pleasure in letting everyone know "how great the Firemen are", and he will belittle and name call anyone that disagrees with him all mighty.

betts (and everyone else) who think that nothing works on ice, give the Yak_Tracks a try. they work very well on ice. I prefer this type over the stud type as there is more surface area making contact/gripping the ice. it is a coiled spring wrapped around a rubber framework that slips on existing footwear.

As to the screw option mentioned earlier, aren't those screw heads uncomfortable on the bottom of the feet? how do you get the screwdriver far enough down into the shoe to attach the screws near the toe area and lastly, doesn't the holes caused by the screws cause leakage into the boots?

An advantage to the type I mentioned, they are removable (don't have to ruin a pair of shoes) and compact (easily fit into a jacket pocket). One caution though, while they work excellent in snow and ice and even carpeting, once inside and on a smooth floor (polished concrete, ceramic tile etc), they are slicker than snot (must be removed at earliest possible moment).

Your solution is probably the best for most people but for me mine was cheaper and perhaps more versatile. These boots are 31 years old. They are not real warm but I can stay out in them for about 2 hours in the type of weather we have been having. I was going to throw them away but I found a new use for them.
They are Vibram sole boots. If you’re not familiar with that type of sole it’s fairly thick but very hard and stiff even for a boot. In order to increase the comfort, traction and wear factors I installed 10 studs per boot……4 on the heal and 6 on the sole. With the stiffness of this type of boot I notice no additional discomfort.
Mine are somewhat slick but because the studs are short if I take my time I have very little trouble wearing them inside a store such as Wal Mart. You do not want to walk on anything soft like wood or linoleum.
After gridding off the sharp edges on the head and pre drilling a small DIA 1/3 inch deep hole I used a nut driver to install the screw. It is important to note that I also ground off about .075 of the point of the screw so the sole would remain water tight.
I have work as a manual machinist; this experience helped me know how to take precise measurements and helped while planning how to do this.

But IMHO nearly everyone living in our area should have Yak Tracks or a studded pair of boots.

ou84A; gotya now, thought you were installing them from the inside of the show thru the sole. If you have the ability/time to achieve it and can recycle/reuse that's great!

For those of you who are interested there are several different types of snow and ice cleats on this link.
They stretch on under shoes or boots to improve traction & safety on ice or snow.
We have enough ice & snow in our area to make these a very good investment

http://cozywinters.com/ice-cleats/ice-cleats.html

ou48A, the yaxtracks extreme (pro) are what the EMSA people I talked to seemed to be wearing. They were very pleased with them as long as they remembered to remove them before stepping on a smooth tile or concrete floor. I believe I'll purchase a set of those before the next storm.

ou48A, the yaxtracks extreme (pro) are what the EMSA people I talked to seemed to be wearing. They were very pleased with them as long as they remembered to remove them before stepping on a smooth tile or concrete floor. I believe I'll purchase a set of those before the next storm.

It’s good to hear the reports of people who have used these types of products.
It’s good to know that we have so many choices.
Any of these products on this link would probably be better than nothing.
Again they are IMHO a very good investment.

http://cozywinters.com/ice-cleats/ice-cleats.html