When is this going to be redone? It is a nasty interchange with how busy I-235 is.

It looks like the railroad/vehicle bridges to the south will need to be rebuilt to allow for additional lanes, however I do not see any sign of that being done. To the north is perfect, to the south is good...it is like they forgot to redo that one area.

Does anyone know when this expansion is planned? Completion Date?

It will be done over several phases and take 8+ years. The ramp from Southbound Broadway extension to westbound I-44 is scheduled to start in the next month. Those good areas to the north and south you spoke of were earlier phases of the same project. The whole interchange is complicated because of the presence of multiple utilities, the Deep Fork Creek and a tributary winding through the project site and the railroad. I'll look later and try and post the phases listed in ODOT's 8 year work plan here in this thread.

P.S. Merry Christmas OKC

Here is a thread I posted almost a year ago about it:

http://www.okctalk.com/showthread.php?t=20659&daysprune=365

2 highway construction projects begin in OKC area in 2011

The Oklahoma Transportation Department says major Oklahoma City area highway construction projects will cause commuters to see more bottlenecking of traffic in north Oklahoma City and backed-up tractor-trailer rigs in the western metro area.

BY JOHN ESTUS jestus@opubco.com
Published: December 29, 2010
It could be another decade before daily traffic gridlock at one of Oklahoma City's busiest highway interchanges gets any better.

A rebuilding project at the Interstate 235 and Interstate 44 interchange in north Oklahoma City that begins next year could potentially last up to 10 years because much of it remains unfunded, state Transportation Department officials said Tuesday.

“We're looking at ways of speeding that up,” state Transportation Department Director Gary Ridley said.
Either way, Oklahoma City metro-area commuters are sure to spend more time hung up in highway traffic in 2011 because of that project and another major highway project beginning next year.

In the second half of 2011, the Transportation Department will begin the first phase of the $150 million rebuild of the deteriorating I-235 and I-44 interchange.

Ridley said the project, which will require several phases, is a priority because traffic problems continue to worsen at the interchange.

Bidding for the $24.8 million first phase of the interchange rebuild will begin early next year, and construction should be under way in the summer, department spokeswoman Brenda Perry said.

The ramp linking Broadway Extension southbound with I-44 westbound will close temporarily, and lanes on westbound I-44 temporarily will be reduced from three to two.

Other temporary road closures as a result of the project will be the access road linking I-44 with Western Avenue, the ramp linking NW 63 with Broadway Extension and parts of Grand Boulevard.

Once complete, the new interchange will be able to comfortably handle up to 170,000 vehicles a day.

That's a far cry from the typical day today, which sees at least 140,000 vehicles pass through the interchange — nearly double what it was designed to handle when it was built, the Transportation Department said.

The east and west lanes of I-44 at the interchange were rebuilt in the 1970s, and the north-south lanes of I-235 and Broadway Extension haven't seen many improvements since they were first built in the 1950s, according to the department.

As a result, rush-hour traffic almost always slows to a crawl at the interchange as the multilane Broadway Extension southbound and I-235 northbound bottleneck into fewer lanes at the interchange. The interchange work will worsen that problem.

Read the rest of the article:
http://newsok.com/2-highway-construction-projects-begin-in-okc-area-in-2011/article/3527488#ixzz19VazOKbx

Here's a rendering of the new interchange. Two ramps will be upgraded to flyovers but still two ****ty cloverleaf ramps for access to/from I-235 southbound. Still, this is a great improvement.

http://www.capitolbeatok.com/_webapp_3741845/Federal_and_state_taxes_finance_redo_of_city%E2%80 %99s_Broadway_Extension_ramp

Leaving the two "cloverleaf" ramps is ignorant. With what the project is going to ultimatly cost a redisgn to eliminate them should not be that much more. Typical OK road design penny wise and pound foolish. By the time it is finished I wonder how long before it reaches maximum capacity. Try again OK DOT.

Did someone say 10 years?

Locate low interest credit card, hire 500-1000 workers, work around the clock building the entire project at once (not stages) and be done in a couple months. ODOT likes to poor one bridge pillar a time onsite, stand around and wait for it to set, then wait again for more money for the next pillar..then pour that pilar. The repeat.

Pay for it later by charging each driver...raise tag fees 30%. Issue Resolved.

Exactly. I am usually not for financing but they should get a decent loan, pay it off over time, and get this thing done instead of waiting till we have all cash in hand. 10 years for that interchange is unacceptable.

Yeah leaving that cloverleaf is ridiculous - that's the entire problem with that intersection. How pointless.

The cloverleaves are not being "left" just rebuilt. Also, they will connect into a dedicated ramp, not the main flow of traffic like they are now.

The cloverleaves are not being "left" just rebuilt. Also, they will connect into a dedicated ramp, not the main flow of traffic like they are now.

My bad - I see what you mean - they don't connect right in to 235 there....I still hate cloverleafs...

Cloverleafs are very inefficient, you reduce traffic to 35 mph, then have them merge on to a flow of traffic trying to exit at 70 mph. Merging a slow stream with a fast stream, with one stream trying to complete a turn while merging. There is a reason you see so many wrecks at them.

I guess the I-240/I-35 interchange will take at least 20 years.

You get what you pay for. Until the public is willing to step up to the plate and provide more funds, ODOT's primary design criteria will continue to be minimizing cost rather than minimizing traffic disruption and there will continue to be terrible road design and long construction periods.

The cloverleaves are not being "left" just rebuilt. Also, they will connect into a dedicated ramp, not the main flow of traffic like they are now.

I had noticed the setup but it does not alter the basic premise that cloverleafs HAVE NO place in modern traffic operations.

You get what you pay for. Until the public is willing to step up to the plate and provide more funds, ODOT's primary design criteria will continue to be minimizing cost rather than minimizing traffic disruption and there will continue to be terrible road design and long construction periods.

Not sure that is as much as the problem as the fact that we are a donor state - the feds take our money and give it to other states for roads and such.

You get what you pay for. Until the public is willing to step up to the plate and provide more funds, ODOT's primary design criteria will continue to be minimizing cost rather than minimizing traffic disruption and there will continue to be terrible road design and long construction periods.

It isn't terrible road design. The two clover leaf ramps that are being reconstructed as clover leaf ramps carry much lower traffic volumes going from southbound Broadway Ext. to eastbound I-44 and from westbound I-44 to southbound I-235. Thus, the flyover ramps are for the higher traffic volumes going from downtown to NW OKC and from Edmond to NW OKC. However, I agree about the timespan.

Funding is one problem, but funding methods are another. ODOT is forced to be a pay as you go agency because the state is barred constitutionally from borrowing money to fund road construction. There was some flack about the money used to fund the expansion of Broadway Extension. Ultimately the courts ruled that GARVEE bonds cannot be used to fund road projects. That is why Broadway only took two years to widen.

TxDOT borrows to bridge funding gaps, but the debt load is mounting - according to the Houston Chronicle.

Not to mention the traffic volume removed from this interchange by being able to cross 44 on Santa Fe.

The feds probably want the Edmond commuters to pay for the interchange. I live just south of this interchange but drive to Edmond on a regular basis (outside of rush hour) and half the time I go through this area I see an accident waiting to happen with someone driving too slow trying to merge into traffic. If you are not driving a sports car, that cloverleaf is a pain in the rear to safely merge.

Recently Forbes Magazine compared the "Best Commuter Cities", Salt Lake City claimed 2, OKC, 4th in the country. After living near SLC, their rebuild of I-15 took a matter of months, not 10 years, maybe we need the Olympics to show up here.

I see the argument of "discouraging people to live in Edmond and work in OKC", however until the schools in the "inner city" are improved, I do not see many folks living in Edmond moving back to the Inner City Neighborhoods. Sure, you can enroll your kids in the private schools here, but what if you do not have the money for that? If I had kids, I would be moving to the Putnam/Edmond school district ASAP.

It is what it is, lets step it up a notch OKC and lets build the best freeway system in the country. I am fine with paying a little extra each year on my tag fees if it means I can feel safe driving on the interstates here. I am probably in the minority, and as "Mesta Parker" said "You get what you pay for" He/She is right however. If you need proof, just look at the "new" I-40.

Not sure that is as much as the problem as the fact that we are a donor state - the feds take our money and give it to other states for roads and such.

This used to be true, but recall reading that within the past couple of years, we have finally turned the corner on that...course we will probably never get back all of the money that has been "donated" over the decades.

While I certainly have to defer to those of you who have or claim to have expertise about how major interstate intersections might best be constructed, and about which I have no knowledge, I'll simply say that major highway construction is something akin to an art form from my own child-like eyes and I've always enjoyed seeing it and driving it.

From that perspective, the ODOT graphic of the I-235/I-44 exhcange looks pretty darned cool.

Click here for a larger view (http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/i40crosstown/i235_i44_intersection.jpg)

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/i40crosstown/i235_i44_intersection_1024.jpg

The major problem I'd have from this would be gawking and being inattentive to driving as I drove through the elements of this to-me gorgeous structure.

Is all of this connecting to the new I-40? Are they actually going to tear down the bridges here? How are they going to divert traffic?

If I am looking at the right area where people are complaining about the short distance to merge when coming off of I-235 onto westbound I-40, there is actually ...no... short distance to merge. After driving through the loop to get onto I-40, just keep driving straight. You will already be on a dedicated lane. Merge into the next lane at a later time. However, I can see the issue of people trying to get off of I-40 to go southbound on I-235, but that issue is only for dumb drivers. The drivers coming onto I-40 will need to just keep going forward and not to slow down, so that the drivers on I-40 will be able to get into the lane in time for the I-235 loop. Maybe a handy dandy traffic sign informing the drivers, "Do NOT Slow Down!"

I am seeing other roads beside I-40. No clue what those are... Is the future new blvd to also be connected to this interchange?

... Just noticed the North arrow on the picture. Is this correct? Looks like North is the other way?

Thunder, they are not discussing where I-235 and I-40 cross. They are discussing a different area that is a few miles north, where I-235 crosses over I-44 (north side of the city)

cough cough...hense the name of the thread....cough cough.

Anyway, I can't see far enough north on the graphic to see if they are taking out the 63rd st. exit and pushing it futher south? Would make sense with how squeezed in it is right now with north bounf merging traffic. If I'm looking at this correctly, then there is a split on the northbound onramp for either 63rd or 235 and you would "exit" 235 jusr barely north of 44 to merge with that other northbound "exit" traffic for 63rd as well as 63rd st traffic from the east bound exit from 44.

Am I reading that correctly? If so, that's a HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE improvement.

See picture....red is 63rd street traffic and blue is 235 traffic.http://www.flickr.com/photos/43309757@N05/5306011955/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/43309757@N05/5306011955/

and does anyone know how to get flikr pics to embed rather than be the stinking link....argh

Anyway, I can't see far enough north on the graphic to see if they are taking out the 63rd st. exit and pushing it futher south? Would make sense with how squeezed in it is right now with north bounf merging traffic. If I'm looking at this correctly, then there is a split on the northbound onramp for either 63rd or 235 and you would "exit" 235 jusr barely north of 44 to merge with that other northbound "exit" traffic for 63rd as well as 63rd st traffic from the east bound exit from 44.

Am I reading that correctly? If so, that's a HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE improvement.

That is my understanding of it. I think for those of us who drive here daily, it will be easy. But for those who visit, it might be confusing,

What about that Santa Fe Bridge? I thought they were supposed to do it before this other stuff - it is present in that picture but can't tell they've done much on it (besides move some utilities maybe).

Funding is one problem, but funding methods are another. ODOT is forced to be a pay as you go agency because the state is barred constitutionally from borrowing money to fund road construction.

This isn't a problem with the Oklahoma Turnpike Authority - when they identify a need and have the funds, the pull the trigger and get the job done all at once, not piecemeal like this.

This isn't a problem with the Oklahoma Turnpike Authority - when they identify a need and have the funds, the pull the trigger and get the job done all at once, not piecemeal like this.

Right, but the sole function of OTA is to finance construction and maintenance via bonds. They were created for that purpose. They have a revenue source independent from the state which are the tolls collected. Thus, they are exempt from the requirements attached to tax collections. No toll revenue is used to maintain state and federal roads.

I know this has already been said, but it would've been nice if they could've somehow replaced the cloverleaves on the west side with fly over ramps. I don't think the space is there though due to the Paragon Building being in the way.

While I certainly have to defer to those of you who have or claim to have expertise about how major interstate intersections might best be constructed, and about which I have no knowledge, I'll simply say that major highway construction is something akin to an art form from my own child-like eyes and I've always enjoyed seeing it and driving it.

From that perspective, the ODOT graphic of the I-235/I-44 exhcange looks pretty darned cool.

Completely agree Doug - I've been in awe a time or two coming across the huge flyover intersections in Texas - pretty impressive.

I know this has already been said, but it would've been nice if they could've somehow replaced the cloverleaves on the west side with fly over ramps. I don't think the space is there though due to the Paragon Building being in the way.

I agree. At least one piece of good news in the clover leaf ramps is they will be 50% larger in diameter.

Right, but the sole function of OTA is to finance construction and maintenance via bonds. They were created for that purpose. They have a revenue source independent from the state which are the tolls collected. Thus, they are exempt from the requirements attached to tax collections. No toll revenue is used to maintain state and federal roads.

So none of the money collected on the Turner Turnpike is used to maintain the same? Have wondered and asked this before, but how in the blazes did we manage to put a turnpike (toll road) on a federal funded, taxpayer paid interstate highway? (Turner Turnpike/I-44)

how in the blazes did we manage to put a turnpike (toll road) on a federal funded, taxpayer paid interstate highway? (Turner Turnpike/I-44)

The same way all the other states have? Ever been into Kansas on I-35?

So none of the money collected on the Turner Turnpike is used to maintain the same? Have wondered and asked this before, but how in the blazes did we manage to put a turnpike (toll road) on a federal funded, taxpayer paid interstate highway? (Turner Turnpike/I-44)

Turner Turnpike was completed in 1953 before the U.S. began nationwide construction of the interstate highway system. It was signed as Interstate 44 in 1958 but still possesses the Turner Turnpike name. The H.E. Bailey Turnpike opened in 1964 but wasn't signed as I-44 from OKC to Lawton until 1982. Will Rogers Turnpike was opened in 1957 but wasn't signed as I-44 until 1958. Thus, they are only signed as an Interstate highway. They were not federally funded nor taxpayer paid, but built with bonds that were repaid with toll revenue.

So none of the money collected on the Turner Turnpike is used to maintain the same? Have wondered and asked this before, but how in the blazes did we manage to put a turnpike (toll road) on a federal funded, taxpayer paid interstate highway? (Turner Turnpike/I-44)

The turnpike authority doesn't receive federal funds to maintain the interstate. It is a federal insterstate in name only. Upkeep is funded through the turnpike authority.

So none of the money collected on the Turner Turnpike is used to maintain the same? Have wondered and asked this before, but how in the blazes did we manage to put a turnpike (toll road) on a federal funded, taxpayer paid interstate highway? (Turner Turnpike/I-44)

Originally when it was payed of it was supposed to be a free road, however they were later able to amend that to use the tolls for building other turnpikes, upgrade existing facilities and maintaining the entire system, regardless of where collection was from.

Originally when it was payed of it was supposed to be a free road, however they were later able to amend that to use the tolls for building other turnpikes, upgrade existing facilities and maintaining the entire system, regardless of where collection was from.

they changed it by a public vote

Okay, so lets get back to the subject of an interchange that has absolutely nothing to do with turnpikes and is nowhere near a turnpike--at least 5 miles or more away.

yea, it is like they have not learned anything from the past failure on that location, get rid of the clover leaves now. If they would have given up on the complexity added by having exits and entrances from 63 it would be in the budget.

Are they going to do anything about that area under the railroad tracks that floods so badly?

Regarding flooding, probably not. This will only be to make the interchange able to handle higher amounts of traffic and not create a bottleneck.

Are they going to do anything about that area under the railroad tracks that floods so badly?

They are planing to eventually widen i235 from 36th to the interchange if that is the part under the railroad you are talking about but no idea of time on that. Since they will have to replace (at least part of) the bridges for the santa fe exit, 50th and the rail road due to them all being to narrow to do that it will be surprising if it does actually happens in the 8 year plan time frame since it looks like they want to do the interchange first.

They are planing to eventually widen i235 from 36th to the interchange if that is the part under the railroad you are talking about but no idea of time on that. Since they will have to replace (at least part of) the bridges for the santa fe exit, 50th and the rail road due to them all being to narrow to do that it will be surprising if it does actually happens in the 8 year plan time frame since it looks like they want to do the interchange first.

the plan is to do do the southboud 235 to west 44 ramp this year then do the 36st to the interchange bridges and road starting in 2017 then start the rest of the interchange in 2018 .... not on this list is the North 235 to east 44 ramp that i guess will come in 2019 outside of the 8 year plan

GRADE,DRAINING,BRIDGE & SURFACE
I-235: SOUTHBOUND TO WESTBOUND OFF RAMPS AT THE I-235/I-44
09033(40) FFY 2011 INTERCHANGE (PHASE 2A) REMAINING DIV 4 CIP FUND MATCH
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS235 0.050 Mi. Let 01/2011 $24,771,508

UTILITIES
I-235: NW 50TH AND BNSF BRIDGES AND APPROACHES (SEGMENT 4A) UT FOR
09033(12) FFY 2012 09033(16)
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS235 0.200 Mi. Let 11/2011 $257,500

GRADE,DRAINING,BRIDGE & SURFACE
I-235: NW 50TH AND BNSF BRIDGES AND APPROACHES (SEGMENT 4A)(100%
09033(16) FFY 2017 IM)
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS235 0.200 Mi. $7,760,267

GRADE,DRAINING,BRIDGE & SURFACE
I-235: MAINLINE FROM NW 36TH STREET INTERCHANGE TO NORTH OF NW 50TH
09033(25) FFY 2017 (SEGMENT 7) (S-48)(H-88,89)
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS235 0.500 Mi. $15,450,000

GRADE,DRAINING,BRIDGE & SURFACE
I-235: NBOUND TO WBOUND FLYOVER BRIDGE I-235/I-44 INTERCHANGE
09033(11) FFY 2018 (SEGMENT 2B)
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS235 0.500 Mi. $17,000,000

GRADE,DRAINING,BRIDGE & SURFACE
I-44: EAST BOUND TO SOUTH BOUND RAMPS AT I-235/I-44 INTERCHANGE.
09033(13) FFY 2018 (PHASE 3B)
OKLAHOMA Div. 4 IS044 0.100 Mi. $7,229,493

yea, it is like they have not learned anything from the past failure on that location, get rid of the clover leaves now. If they would have given up on the complexity added by having exits and entrances from 63 it would be in the budget.

I think the main problem is they're limited on space on the west side, with the creek in the way, and the Paragon building.

I don't know if it means anything, but Ive seen some construction signs starting to be placed around the interchange. even saw one that uses digital messages

I don't know if it means anything, but Ive seen some construction signs starting to be placed around the interchange. even saw one that uses digital messages

Guess it's time to turn over the decade long hourglass and play the ODOT waiting game.

digital signs all around the interchange that construction to start June 20th

Yeah, I saw some going westbound on 44 right before the Lincoln bridge. I was wondering it they were for that south to west ramp. That's the only thing they're going to be doing.

I think the main problem is they're limited on space on the west side, with the creek in the way, and the Paragon building.

They said the reason it is still has clover leafs is money, they would have preferred fly overs all four ways.

Lots of tree clearing already happening.
Man this is going to be a mess.. I already can't wait for it to be done!

Lots of tree clearing already happening.
Man this is going to be a mess.. I already can't wait for it to be done!

If they had the money to do it in bigger stages it seems like it might just be better to widen everything that is still 2 lane south of the bridge first; then close the ramps, make the bridge over i44 3 dedicated lanes and just do all the other work reconnecting the two.

While I certainly have to defer to those of you who have or claim to have expertise about how major interstate intersections might best be constructed, and about which I have no knowledge, I'll simply say that major highway construction is something akin to an art form from my own child-like eyes and I've always enjoyed seeing it and driving it.

The major problem I'd have from this would be gawking and being inattentive to driving as I drove through the elements of this to-me gorgeous structure.

i lived in dallas and drove through the high five project as it was being constructed. i had more than a couple close calls due to rubbernecking.

I noticed that last week ODOT had the State Troopers post a cruiser with lights flashing at the merge. This was very helpful. This week there was no cruiser and it has now become very dangerous. Lunatics are still flying down I-44 doing 70mph in the right lane of a construction zone. The merge distance for the drivers coming off of 235 is approximately 100yds. I would plead with the public to avoid this area. This is a perfect recipe for a deadly accident.

I noticed that last week ODOT had the State Troopers post a cruiser with lights flashing at the merge. This was very helpful. This week there was no cruiser and it has now become very dangerous. Lunatics are still flying down I-44 doing 70mph in the right lane of a construction zone. The merge distance for the drivers coming off of 235 is approximately 100yds. I would plead with the public to avoid this area. This is a perfect recipe for a deadly accident.

Police?!?!?!?!

x_wLVCLPx0M

Yeah the way they set up the Boradway Extension traffic merging onto 44 west is STUPID!!!!!! They had converted the outside lane to a merging traffic lane only for a reason, and now it's not and all you have is a concrete wall in front of you and no warning that you merge....there is a "limited merging area" sign, but no actual avatar of merging. I took the donut the other day and just about got ran into twice in 30 seconds from all sides.

They need to find a way to re-stripe the area for sure. If it means that each part gets 1 lane and 44 is reduced, then sobeit. Otherwise you're going to see a lot of wrecks and the situation will be even worse.

It's a big fail on ODOT's part for setting the construction zone up. Much like how when they repaved 35, they put the inside lane as an exit only lane to 44 west, and then magically made the outside lane appear out of no where instead of the intelligent way they used to where the exit lane apppeard out of no where and regular flowing traffic wasn't affected by exiting people and flow traffic didn't have to squeeze into 1 lane. Sounds similar to 235 between I-40 and 10th.....i see a pattern of bad striping here.

Can confirm that this is one scary intersection now. I take 50th, or 36th street to get to work at 50 Penn and avoid this mess entirely.

Yes.... A couple weeks ago, I was on 235, heading 44 westbound. Wasnt really aware how short of a merging distance I had and almost slammed straight into the concrete barrier things. But it was a Saturday morning with light traffic, so i was able to get to the lane. Ever since then, i've avoided using that interchange

I-235 / I-44 interchange is fully funded in the proposed eight year plan, 2017-2019.

I-40 and mostly boulevard, 2012-2015

I-240 / I-35, 2018.
http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/newsmedia/press/2011/11-059_eight-year_plan_approved.pdf

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/cwp-8-year-plan/cwp_ffy2012-ffy2019/pdfs/cwp_ffy2012-2019_division4_okc_metro-map.pdf

It appears that they are working on drainage issues in this area. I know the south side of I-44 is in a flood plain due to that creek, but they are also moving a LOT of dirt.

From the renderings it looks like they are going to keep it all a lot of the same but with flyovers.
I was hoping they would get rid of the clover style merges and straighten out some of the double dog leg from 50th to 63rd.

Yep Nick, only two flyovers (south to west & east to north). I've probably said this before but after the interchange is complete, the most interesting aspect of the Broadway Extension project will be where BNSF trains will go (obviously a temp flyover but WHERE?) when they are widening out that part between the interchange and north of NW 36th St.