Thank you! I use this segment regularly when in OKC. Its going to be a help to understand how work is going.

The piers for the flyover bridges are slowly coming along. I saw them lowering one of the rebar cages for a pier in the median of I-44 and it was huge. Not surprising since the northbound to westbound flyover bridge will be going up and over eastbound to northbound bridge.

It also looks like their about ready for concrete for southbound lanes north of the interchange.

Fantastic job Pete!! I know they have to be behind due to the weather so I was surprised hey weren't working yesterday as I passed through the interchange.

Looking at those aerial photos makes me think. I realize it's not possible or even practical, but if the whole area could be shut down for X amount of time, the project could probably be completed really quickly.

Looking at those aerial photos makes me think. I realize it's not possible or even practical, but if the whole area could be shut down for X amount of time, the project could probably be completed really quickly.

Hasn't exactly worked for the Boulevard, which is a much more straight-forward project.

Taking them years.

Yeah, It wouldn't get done any faster unless they added a lot more resources and worked day and night. The bottleneck in the process is the overpasses. It just takes time to bore out , form, and pour concrete for each of those piers.

Hasn't exactly worked for the Boulevard, which is a much more straight-forward project.

Taking them years.

Especially when you take in to account how long it took them to build the new I40 crosstown stretch.

Looking at those aerial photos makes me think. I realize it's not possible or even practical, but if the whole area could be shut down for X amount of time, the project could probably be completed really quickly.

Right .... not practical and not possible. Would still take a year or so to do.

Hasn't exactly worked for the Boulevard, which is a much more straight-forward project.

Taking them years.
If you take only the construction time, how long? Not design and redesign, but merely from start of construction?

If you take only the construction time, how long? Not design and redesign, but merely from start of construction?

About a year and a half for the western segment. The bridge took the longest amount of time. Everything else you can tell wasn't a priority due to the bridge not even being done.

There is still some paver, streetlight, and landscaping work that needs to be done for the central segment, but to be fair a lot of that is tied to park construction.

^

Right, but if you consider the full project, it's been several years of construction.

About a year and a half for the western segment. The bridge took the longest amount of time. Everything else you can tell wasn't a priority due to the bridge not even being done.

There is still some paver, streetlight, and landscaping work that needs to be done for the central segment, but to be fair a lot of that is tied to park construction.

Makes me wonder how much faster they could have gotten the overall project done without the stupid bridge.

Slowly but surely making progress on this. The piers are coming along and they got a lot of grading and roadbed work done for southbound lanes. A southbound bridge is being built of the creek. They are building up the grade within the northbound cloverleafs for the approaches for the new northbound bridge.

I just want it done so they can free up funding and get back to finishing the 240/35 junction.

I just want it done so they can free up funding and get back to finishing the 240/35 junction.

2 more years. So far its not been too impactful they kept posted speeds at 50mph whereas last just completed phase had posted speeds of 35mph.

But once school starts up it will get bad again. Right now lots of people on vacations so less traffic.

One quirk I’ve noticed is Wed seems to be a much bigger traffic load than other days. I wonder if a lot of home office workers report to company offices on Wed? Its a pattern I’ve noticed a lot.

Lets hope they get done early so can claim incentive money. Long ways to go though.

I just want it done so they can free up funding and get back to finishing the 240/35 junction.
Currently the interchange is scheduled to start in 2021 and everything go up at once. OkDOT shifted focus from phases to an all at once approach. Congress is debating a new freeway spending bill will provide about a 30 percent increase over the last passed several years back. Stitt has continually spoken of making Oklahoma a top ten state so maybe this next season some more money will be allotted for OkDOT. OkDOT should release an update to their 8yr plan in the coming months so stay tuned; maybe you'll be surprised.

I agree with you this interchange should be completed sooner rather than later. Hopefully we are surprised. In the mean time if you haven't seen it, OkDOT has released a new interactive map that has a tracker tool and each project given updates every month in terms of progress measured in percentages broken down by each phase along with letting dates, documentation, and up to date schedules. August update should be any day now. I have my beef with OkDOT but I applaud them for this great tool.

https://biappsrv.odot.ok.gov/apex/f?p=129:2:::NO:2::

Currently the interchange is scheduled to start in 2021 and everything go up at once. OkDOT shifted focus from phases to an all at once approach. Congress is debating a new freeway spending bill will provide about a 30 percent increase over the last passed several years back. Stitt has continually spoken of making Oklahoma a top ten state so maybe this next season some more money will be allotted for OkDOT. OkDOT should release an update to their 8yr plan in the coming months so stay tuned; maybe you'll be surprised.

I agree with you this interchange should be completed sooner rather than later. Hopefully we are surprised. In the mean time if you haven't seen it, OkDOT has released a new interactive map that has a tracker tool and each project given updates every month in terms of progress measured in percentages broken down by each phase along with letting dates, documentation, and up to date schedules. August update should be any day now. I have my beef with OkDOT but I applaud them for this great tool.

https://biappsrv.odot.ok.gov/apex/f?p=129:2:::NO:2::

I was skeptical about ODOT keeping up the new Project page but I've been pleasantly surprised. PluPan is right, it's a great tool to keep up with projects, especially when you don't have a call or JP number.

Currently the interchange is scheduled to start in 2021 and everything go up at once. OkDOT shifted focus from phases to an all at once approach. Congress is debating a new freeway spending bill will provide about a 30 percent increase over the last passed several years back. Stitt has continually spoken of making Oklahoma a top ten state so maybe this next season some more money will be allotted for OkDOT. OkDOT should release an update to their 8yr plan in the coming months so stay tuned; maybe you'll be surprised.

I agree with you this interchange should be completed sooner rather than later. Hopefully we are surprised. In the mean time if you haven't seen it, OkDOT has released a new interactive map that has a tracker tool and each project given updates every month in terms of progress measured in percentages broken down by each phase along with letting dates, documentation, and up to date schedules. August update should be any day now. I have my beef with OkDOT but I applaud them for this great tool.

https://biappsrv.odot.ok.gov/apex/f?p=129:2:::NO:2::

Aug is updated it shows project as 18% complete.

This is comments looks like big 44 impacts in Sep:

Oklahoma

Project Award Information
Contractor: Allen Contracting, Inc Construction Start Date: March 25, 2019 Project Duration (Days): 900
Scheduled Completion Date: Fall 2021
Traffic Impacts
Multiple bridges foundations and substructures are under construction. Storm drain and roadway construction are underway project wide. A major traffic switch on I-44 is expected in late September 2019

Those updates call for a major traffic switch in I44 in late Sept 2019.

Any idea what this means?

Those updates call for a major traffic switch in I44 in late Sept 2019.

Any idea what this means?

No idea. I don't think their touching the main lanes of I-44. My guess its shifting lanes on the westbound side to accommodate work on the northeastern part of the project.

Pete, when you can, could we get some drone aerials of the construction progress? Thanks.

Pete, when you can, could we get some drone aerials of the construction progress? Thanks.

I'll do that this week.

It's been so hot my drone is overheating!

I'll do that this week.

It's been so hot my drone is overheating!

When I asked, I wondered if the heat impacted drones. Thanks...look forward to seeing them.

In the first photo, note how the ramp from 63rd southbound to I-235 merges onto the highway... There is just a matter of feet and there is almost no way to see behind you and to the left to see cars coming up fast. It is insanely unsafe.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i235i44081719a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i235i44081719b.jpg

^^^^

Yes it is, especially in a low sedan. Earlier this week I took it and was in line between five or six cars completely stopped. When it was my turn, I just hit the gas and prayed.

I seriously will not go that way again. Only after I merged did I realize how incredibly dangerous that is.

I can't believe they set it up that way, even as a temporary measure.

Making a lot of progress but so much more to go. Lots of pillars going in.

Yes, in mornings that lane is stopped. Its a compact area but in my view they should have shut that lane off or at least in rush hour. It slows down both lanes of 235 as well because everyone is afraid of a wreck and ripple effect. Traffic flows pretty well overall except that spot messes it up. Due to how long it takes cars to get thru (the on ramp) it would be better time wise for them to go north a mile and over to 235 and get on there.

Still have 1.5 years left but on homestretch. Once done it will highlight another problem I’ve been saying. With no bottleneck at 44 (throttle) all traffic will get to turnpike faster yet the one long flyover ramp can’t handle the flow plus you end up rounding the curve ti TP with sun in eyes. So traffic is going to back up on 235 for a few miles. This in turn creates other hazards with oncoming traffic blending into stopped traffic and a complete mess.

TP and OKC needed to ID this long ago but won’t until its way too late. To get onto TP west you have to exit right which has on ramps and other off ramps backed up. Somehow need it to be left exit from 235 to west TP. But would require pillars and redoing lanes on TP to put you out in left lanes. But the toll plaza is so close then cars can’t get over to right. I say get rid of plazas and go all scanner. Then it would work

Given multiple other on ramps a mile from that on ramp, it almost seems like it would have been better to just close that ramp for a while and be able to build something non temporary there sooner

Given multiple other on ramps a mile from that on ramp, it almost seems like it would have been better to just close that ramp for a while and be able to build something non temporary there sooner

Right, and the plans call for NB 63rd ramp to close for up to 1 month so it's not like the end of the world. Hopefully, they will build that section of 235 here soon and merge further south with more merge space

Making a lot of progress but so much more to go. Lots of pillars going in.

Yes, in mornings that lane is stopped. Its a compact area but in my view they should have shut that lane off or at least in rush hour. It slows down both lanes of 235 as well because everyone is afraid of a wreck and ripple effect. Traffic flows pretty well overall except that spot messes it up. Due to how long it takes cars to get thru (the on ramp) it would be better time wise for them to go north a mile and over to 235 and get on there.

Still have 1.5 years left but on homestretch. Once done it will highlight another problem I’ve been saying. With no bottleneck at 44 (throttle) all traffic will get to turnpike faster yet the one long flyover ramp can’t handle the flow plus you end up rounding the curve ti TP with sun in eyes. So traffic is going to back up on 235 for a few miles. This in turn creates other hazards with oncoming traffic blending into stopped traffic and a complete mess.

TP and OKC needed to ID this long ago but won’t until its way too late. To get onto TP west you have to exit right which has on ramps and other off ramps backed up. Somehow need it to be left exit from 235 to west TP. But would require pillars and redoing lanes on TP to put you out in left lanes. But the toll plaza is so close then cars can’t get over to right. I say get rid of plazas and go all scanner. Then it would work

Plus 122nd on ramp. I don’t understand why they don’t just close exits that are too close to an interchange. Like 63rd on ramp, like sorry but you’re way to close to an interchange.

Plus 122nd on ramp. I don’t understand why they don’t just close exits that are too close to an interchange. Like 63rd on ramp, like sorry but you’re way to close to an interchange.
This! That on ramp is way too close and causes ridiculous issues.

I seriously will not go that way again. Only after I merged did I realize how incredibly dangerous that is.

I can't believe they set it up that way, even as a temporary measure.

The cloverleaf from NB 235 to WB 44 is horrible right now as well. Major visibility restrictions. Took it a week ago and will probably not be taking it again anytime soon.

Plus 122nd on ramp. I don’t understand why they don’t just close exits that are too close to an interchange. Like 63rd on ramp, like sorry but you’re way to close to an interchange.

The final 63rd ramp to SB 235 design wont be bad. It will share the dedicated lanes that the two clovers share.

The final 63rd ramp to SB 235 design wont be bad. It will share the dedicated lanes that the two clovers share.

Those are called collector/distribution (c/d) lanes. It's a way to get ramps up to speed without interfering with the main lanes. I35 has them at the I240 interchange

Those are called collector/distribution (c/d) lanes. It's a way to get ramps up to speed without interfering with the main lanes. I35 has them at the I240 interchange


Thanks for the info. Didnt know what the proper terminology was.

In the first photo, note how the ramp from 63rd southbound to I-235 merges onto the highway... There is just a matter of feet and there is almost no way to see behind you and to the left to see cars coming up fast. It is insanely unsafe.

Strangely, this is par for the course for ODOT workzones. They did the exact same setup on two ramps on I-35 in Norman a few years back. I got into two accidents there, fortunately both minor.

Someone needs to hold ODOT accountable for such dangerous designs. One of the local stations (want to say KFOR but I might be misremembering) did a story on the Norman ramps, and ODOT's response was basically "what are you gonna do? It's temporary, and we don't have much space to work with, so there." Eventually there's going to be enough speed involved in one of these situations that it turns fatal. I hope ODOT fixes whatever causes these boneheaded designs to be put up before that happens.

Strangely, this is par for the course for ODOT workzones. They did the exact same setup on two ramps on I-35 in Norman a few years back. I got into two accidents there, fortunately both minor.

Someone needs to hold ODOT accountable for such dangerous designs. One of the local stations (want to say KFOR but I might be misremembering) did a story on the Norman ramps, and ODOT's response was basically "what are you gonna do? It's temporary, and we don't have much space to work with, so there." Eventually there's going to be enough speed involved in one of these situations that it turns fatal. I hope ODOT fixes whatever causes these boneheaded designs to be put up before that happens.

Totally agree. My guess is when they bid the job it requires the contractor to keep all roads/ramps open except for certain designated weekends or nights. And this is the contractor “keeping it open” even though dangerous. If the contract is not specific enough about something dangerous like this there is little anyone can do.

Contractor has little incentive to do any more than is spelled out. So to me I would blame the folks who controlled the contract be it city or state.

Another sore point of mine deals with incentives. I love incentive built contracts, best thing ever. However, who decides what a normal completion time is to then come up with incentives? If the payer does this wrong then a massive amount of incentive money could be paid.

For instance, if this is called a 365 day contract and its done on day 360, the contractor gets additional money for early completion. If late they pat penalty (but are given weather days built in contract verbiage). If the folks who control contract before its accepted are off then there is a huge amount of money at stake. What if they get the job done on day 300? Then they get 65 days early credit and each day they are paid x dollars. I don’t trust those (on state/city side) who decide what is normal construction time and what is early. The last phase they got it done I think 2 or months early? Have to check on it. But this early incentive money is huge and no one ever talks about it they are just happy its done. I think there is high opportunity for this to be exploited.

If I know I can do a job in 335 days but I say I need 365, then who questions that? Millions are paid in incentives each year.

Totally agree. My guess is when they bid the job it requires the contractor to keep all roads/ramps open except for certain designated weekends or nights. And this is the contractor “keeping it open” even though dangerous. If the contract is not specific enough about something dangerous like this there is little anyone can do.

Contractor has little incentive to do any more than is spelled out. So to me I would blame the folks who controlled the contract be it city or state.

Another sore point of mine deals with incentives. I love incentive built contracts, best thing ever. However, who decides what a normal completion time is to then come up with incentives? If the payer does this wrong then a massive amount of incentive money could be paid.

For instance, if this is called a 365 day contract and its done on day 360, the contractor gets additional money for early completion. If late they pat penalty (but are given weather days built in contract verbiage). If the folks who control contract before its accepted are off then there is a huge amount of money at stake. What if they get the job done on day 300? Then they get 65 days early credit and each day they are paid x dollars. I don’t trust those (on state/city side) who decide what is normal construction time and what is early. The last phase they got it done I think 2 or months early? Have to check on it. But this early incentive money is huge and no one ever talks about it they are just happy its done. I think there is high opportunity for this to be exploited.

If I know I can do a job in 335 days but I say I need 365, then who questions that? Millions are paid in incentives each year.

It's likely that when bids are placed to be selected, the bidder is the one who gives the projected completion date.

Say company A says they can finish in 365 days, and company B says they can finish in 300 days. That will be a part of the selection process from ODOT. If a company thinks they can finish in 335, but bids 365 days then they are risking losing the entire job by trying to manipulate for incentives.

It's likely that when bids are placed to be selected, the bidder is the one who gives the projected completion date.

Say company A says they can finish in 365 days, and company B says they can finish in 300 days. That will be a part of the selection process from ODOT. If a company thinks they can finish in 335, but bids 365 days then they are risking losing the entire job by trying to manipulate for incentives.

Thanks. My concern is does the city/state have enough competent people to know what a standard completion date should be? Because we offer huge incentives to finish early I could see this as a way bidders could take advantage of system. These are complex projects and the lower bidder could take advantage of incentives unless we have competent oversight. So the cheaper bidder could end up costing more due to padding ending dates and collecting incentives.

Just curious: on the north side of 50th immediately east of the new bridge over 235 there's a kinda roundabout looking area. Is that a private thing or part of the overall rebuild project?

From Sunday:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i23544090819a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i23544090819b.jpg

So far I don't think this has been too bad on my commute, and it has been interesting watching the flyover pillars go up.

From Sunday:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i23544090819a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i23544090819b.jpg

So it appears the off ramp going 235n to 50th will double as a flyover ramp to 44w. Where the ramp ends appears could extend that over 44 and curve it then it will marry the pillars being installed. Is this right?

Lots of work going on daily. One thing I have noticed is going north cars all speed through zone. Going south it slows to less than posted speed. Just a random observation but it is strange

So it appears the off ramp going 235n to 50th will double as a flyover ramp to 44w. Where the ramp ends appears could extend that over 44 and curve it then it will marry the pillars being installed. Is this right?

Lots of work going on daily. One thing I have noticed is going north cars all speed through zone. Going south it slows to less than posted speed. Just a random observation but it is strange

There also is usually one or two cops parked along the south bound side too that seems to slow everyone way down.
15588

There also is usually one or two cops parked along the south bound side too that seems to slow everyone way down.
15588

Great point. All they do is mess up traffic and cause wrecks further back as cars bottleneck a mile back. Maybe they get a cut from tow and repair companies. They never stop anyone either just sit with lights on. To me it makes it more dangerous. It causes people to look at them vice work zone plus some panic when seeing cops and hit brakes.

It is better than I expected though. 1.5 more years to go.

One thing I have noticed are these cars scanning license plates to nab those with no insurance cause slow downs and arguably wrecks. People think they are cops of perhaps speed enforcement...

One thing I have noticed are these cars scanning license plates to nab those with no insurance cause slow downs and arguably wrecks. People think they are cops of perhaps speed enforcement...

Yeah, I'm not sure why they pick here of all places to setup shop.

Some of the slowdown is also caused by the amount of work that is going on. Its going to really peak people's interest when they start hanging beams over the interstate for the overpasses.

One thing I have noticed are these cars scanning license plates to nab those with no insurance cause slow downs and arguably wrecks. People think they are cops of perhaps speed enforcement...

I read somewhere I think they nabbed 3k or 7k so far. I do not like how they go about it, even though I agree the need was there.

Take those pesky bike cops and have them drive around to solely scan license plates would be better. I hate this suv parks on side of roads especially since new law says all cars must move over a lane for all cars on side of road. Technically this suv is on side of road and all cars must move over. Thats creating a dangerous situation with drivers making sudden lane changes to comply with new law.

If a uninsured car moves over and hits me while trying to comply with law I can take OKC to court over illegal parking or creating a hazard maybe?

I read somewhere I think they nabbed 3k or 7k so far. I do not like how they go about it, even though I agree the need was there.

Take those pesky bike cops and have them drive around to solely scan license plates would be better. I hate this suv parks on side of roads especially since new law says all cars must move over a lane for all cars on side of road. Technically this suv is on side of road and all cars must move over. Thats creating a dangerous situation with drivers making sudden lane changes to comply with new law.

If a uninsured car moves over and hits me while trying to comply with law I can take OKC to court over illegal parking or creating a hazard maybe?
I would suggest placing cameras as it would be safer than cars parked but I am against automated enforcement. I think these vehicles should be just driving around or sitting in legal parking spaces. I just don't see how it is acceptable for them to camp on the shoulder. There is a jeep that sits on the shoulder of I-240 near the I-35 interchange and someone almost smashed into the back of him the other day. It's good we are getting uninsured motorist but at what cost.

Great point. All they do is mess up traffic and cause wrecks further back as cars bottleneck a mile back. Maybe they get a cut from tow and repair companies. They never stop anyone either just sit with lights on. To me it makes it more dangerous. It causes people to look at them vice work zone plus some panic when seeing cops and hit brakes.

It is better than I expected though. 1.5 more years to go.

I think the purpose of the Highway Patrol car stopped in the work zone with it's lights on is to slow traffic. We don't like it, but the gov't has decided they have to do something to actually achieve lower speeds being driven in work zones. Appears this is effective. :mad:

So its great that there will be three lanes going northbound over I-44 on I-235, but what's the deal with it being reduced to two after crossing over I-44? I assume its because there are two lanes coming from I-44. What's interesting is that there are painted Chevrons where another lane could go.

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/246-0903327-SIGNING%20AND%20STRIPING%20(7).pdf

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/247-0903327-SIGNING%20AND%20STRIPING%20(8).pdf

So its great that there will be three lanes going northbound over I-44 on I-235, but what's the deal with it being reduced to two after crossing over I-44? I assume its because there are two lanes coming from I-44. What's interesting is that there are painted Chevrons where another lane could go.

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/246-0903327-SIGNING%20AND%20STRIPING%20(7).pdf

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/247-0903327-SIGNING%20AND%20STRIPING%20(8).pdf

Yeah, they only have four lanes going northbound to work with. So two will be dedicate lanes from i235 northbound, one will be from i44 headed east, one will be from i44 headed west & the merge zone from Lincoln. Unless they widen the road to five lanes, something has to give. Looks like it may be planned so that can be done without updating the junction, since with a redecking could be around for 100 years.

Yeah, they only have four lanes going northbound to work with. So two will be dedicate lanes from i235 northbound, one will be from i44 headed east, one will be from i44 headed west & the merge zone from Lincoln. Unless they widen the road to five lanes, something has to give. Looks like it may be planned so that can be done without updating the junction, since with a redecking could be around for 100 years.

Whats bad is that the 63rd street bridge is relatively new and appears to where the next bottle neck will occur. They could have at least did three NB lanes and two ramp merging lanes past 63rd street and then end the right hand lane.

Oh well, at least I-44 traffic and 63rd street traffic coming from I-44 won't be using the bridge anymore so that will provide some relief.

There will be 3 NB and 3 SB lanes on 235/Broadway Ext. when the project is finished. That is in addition to the aux and distributor lanes for the I-44 interchange.

There will be 3 NB and 3 SB lanes on 235/Broadway Ext. when the project is finished. That is in addition to the aux and distributor lanes for the I-44 interchange.


I posted the striping plans in my post above. looks like they reduce NB to two lanes before 63rd in order to have two lanes coming from I44 to I235 on-ramps. I understand that there is a project to reconfigure the lincoln ramp to i44, but I dont see how that would impact 235 lanes.

^^^^ you’re right yeah. Wow that’s shortsighted, IMO.

Westbound I-44 to northbound I-235 (segment 3A) now scheduled to be let in November 2021.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i44235102719a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i44235102719b.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i44235102719c.jpg

Looks like their planning the next nightmare of dangerous merges. This time involving I-44 ramps.

I'm a bit curious about why the NB to WB flyover piers are all single but the EB to NB ones that are starting to go up are double, Differences in height requirements, maybe?