All the stuff I looked at on their web site indicates they create open space in high density urban areas. In downtown OKC we need LESS open space. Sandridge and Rogers Marvel solved a problem that didn't exist in OKC.
Now this I can agree with. However, their job was site and job specific and not charged with fixing OKC's problems. Whether they should have or shouldn't have might be debated.

I've seen that rendering before. If I remember correctly, the building to the right of the current tower was not supposed to be the "new" tower. It was something else.

All the stuff I looked at on their web site indicates they create open space in high density urban areas. In downtown OKC we need LESS open space. Sandridge and Rogers Marvel solved a problem that didn't exist in OKC.

This

I think selling Rogers Marvel short is a bit of revisionism to make a point. They have a large portfolio that includes street-scaping, urban building projects, urban planning (including the Technology Merit Award on the The City of the Future Design and Engineering Challenge for NYC) and many international and national awards, most of which do not include specifically public greens, parks, etc.. Whether you have another notion as to what they needed to do here is fine and dandy, but to not recognize them for what they are would be silly. Sandridge hired a first class firm to handle this, and I am sure they are looking long term as to the interplay with all the current and future projects in mind whereas we are looking only at a point in time and judging. We are only at the starting point of what they are doing and everyone is already wanting to prove how stupid SR and RM is. LOL.

Rogers Marvel is teaming with Hoerr Schaudt landscape architects and they have a big body of work, including the Hyatt Center And Trump Tower in Chicago:

http://www.hoerrschaudt.com/main.php

I find it weird that the rendering does not show the new facade of the Dowell Center.

That rendering was obviously done at least a year ago because the canopy shown was completely redesigned some time ago.

So, they probably didn't have any idea of what Dowell planned to do at the time.

Rogers Marvel is teaming with Hoerr Schaudt landscape architects and they have a big body of work, including the Hyatt Center And Trump Tower in Chicago:

http://www.hoerrschaudt.com/main.php

They have 7 pictures on their home page - all showing open space, which makes sense considering they are "landscape architetcs". What OKC needs is some "streetscape architects".

They have 7 pictures on their home page - all showing open space, which makes sense considering they are "landscape architetcs". What OKC needs is some "streetscape architects".

Don't know what you are looking at but they have 23 projects (with photos) in their "Public Spaces" section alone. They have 31 more in their "Historic Preservation". They have five catagories of projects, most of which do not involve open spaces. You need to look at their entire offering, not just the ones you wish to point out. Thankfully, others on this board can go to their website to see a balanced and objective representation of their work and reputation, not just the one you give to try to promote because you hate SR and anyone associated with it. RM has an extensive streetscaping background.

Devon and SandRidge have brought world class expertise to this city. Even if you don't like the projects, you still have to respect the expertise of the people involved.

BTW, the landscape architects aren't chumps either. This is a list of awards the landscape architects have been bestowed with:

ASLA National Honor Award for UNC Historic Landscape Plan (2011)

ASLA Illinois Presidential Award for Uptown Normal Circle (2010)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award for Woodland Residence (2010)

ASLA National Honor Award for Gary Comer Youth Center (2010)

SCUP Design Excellence Award, UNC Historic Landscape Plan (2009)

Green Roofs for Healthy Cities Award, Gary Comer Roof Garden (2009)

AIA Chicago Honor Award for Chicago 2016 Olympic Bid Master Plan (2009)

ASLA Illinois Presidential Award for Harbor Springs, MI Residence (2009)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award for Chervon Trading Company, Nanjing China (2009)

ASLA Illinois Presidential Award for Urban Chicago Garden (2008)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award for Uptown Normal Circle, Normal IL (2008)

SCUP AIA/CAE Design Award, North Park University (2008)

Green Roofs for Healthy Cities Award, 900 N. Michigan Ave. (2008)

Nathan Phillips Square International Design Competition (2007)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Weekend Retreat, (2007)

ASLA Illinois Honor Award, Garfield Park City Garden (2006)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Gardens at Ball Horticultural Company (2006)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Manor Garden (2006)

ASLA Honor Award, Illinois Institute of Technology (2005)

ASLA Illinois Honor Award, North Burnham Park/ Soldier Field (2005)

ASLA Illinois Honor Award, North Park University (2005)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Formal Garden, (2005)

ASLA Illinois Honor Award, Illinois Institute of Technology (2004)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Country Estate (2004)

Green Roofs for Healthy Cities Award, North Burnham Park (2004)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Flossmoor Garden & Sculpture Walk (2003)

ASLA National Merit Award, Michigan Avenue Streetscape (2003)

ASLA Illinois Merit Award, Michigan Avenue Streetscape (2001)

ASLA Illinois Honor Award, Lakefront Property (2001)

Rover - I am not sure what is making this hard to understand.

Sandridge hired two companies that specialize in bring open space to urbanized space. Downtown OKC does not have a shortage of open space. What OKC needs are companies that specialize in creating urban space. We need help making open space look urban, not urban space look open. Sandridge claimed they want to improve site lines for their building. To do this they created open space between the tower and the sidewalk and used landscaping to fill in the void - that is what a landscape architect does. What I would have done is bring the existing building architecture closer to the sidewalk by re-cladding the existing building to look like they were part of the tower, thus creating a unified campus look that occupied the entire block. But that is just me.

I guess I am just not surprised that a landscape architect came up with a plan involving landscaping.

RM is not focused on landscape and urban parks, but keep saying it and maybe you can get people to believe it.

RM is not focused on landscape and urban parks, but keep saying it and maybe you can get people to believe it.

I was talking about the second design firm Sandridge is working with in conjunction with RM. Pete identified them in post #3267.


Rogers Marvel is teaming with Hoerr Schaudt landscape architects and they have a big body of work, including the Hyatt Center And Trump Tower in Chicago:

http://www.hoerrschaudt.com/main.php

Here is what they say about the site on their website.

"The site is comprised of ’recycled’ historically significant buildings, a corporate plaza and public park embedded in a resurgent downtown."

Personally I don't think tearing down the oldest building downtown and planting cedar trees as Recycling buildings?

WASTE OF MONEY!!! MILLIONS DOWN THE DRAIN!

To add to that we have this...


Hoerr Schaudt is collaborating with Rogers Marvel Architects to use the interstitial spaces to create a unified campus in the city that is open to the public.

Three building that we know of and all three are of different architectural styles. Maybe I don't know what 'unified' means. I'll admit, I did have to look up 'interstitial'.

An interstitial space or interstice is an empty space or gap between spaces full of structure or matter.

WASTE OF MONEY!!! MILLIONS DOWN THE DRAIN!

You continue to repeat this. Do you own stock in Sandridge? If so I suggest you raise this issue at the next shareholders meeting. Otherwise, what concern is it of yours? People waste money all the time. I would point you to the nearest Indian Casino for countless examples.

Now, understand, I was against Sandridge tearing down all those buildings. I think they had great historical value, and unlike every other poster on this board, I actually worked in the India Temple building for about a year back around 2006. I do not like what they have done, but your constant cries of "wasting money" are rather pointless.

Don't know how it will feel ultimately after it is all installed, but from that rendering it reminds me of the old Myriad perimeter.

Funny, Sid, my first thought on seeing that rendering was "did they just move the old Myriad?"

just a little update via sandridge on twitter ... they expect the parking garage to be fully torn down by the end of may

Wow, that's still almost three months.

I guess it's extra tough due to the proximity to Dowell Center.

Wow, that's still almost three months.

I guess it's extra tough due to the proximity to Dowell Center.

and remember that they are going floor by floor so dowell can redo that side of the building as they go ... once they get below 13 on dowel building i would guess it would go much faster

and remember that they are going floor by floor so dowell can redo that side of the building as they go ... once they get below 13 on dowel building i would guess it would go much faster

How long does it take to put up simulated metal windows? I guess 3 months.

Rogers Marvel's credentials are not in question. But that doesn't change the fact that what they've done with the landscaping of this project is pretty pitiful. I'm not sure if Sandridge used a Groupon or what, but for whatever reason they did not get this company's best work. There's no longer any relation to the street. At least with the original Kerr-McGee design, the plaza drew you in from the street despite the setback. Now that space is buried in trees with a diagonal sidewalk that completely ignores the south face of the tower.

The Kerr Park part of it looks better, but it's hard to tell what types of trees they are using. Those evergreens are awful. We have enough of those growing here naturally. We don't need to add any.

Any new pics of the Braniff building?

Here is what they say about the site on their website.

"The site is comprised of ’recycled’ historically significant buildings, a corporate plaza and public park embedded in a resurgent downtown."

Personally I don't think tearing down the oldest building downtown and planting cedar trees as Recycling buildings?

WASTE OF MONEY!!! MILLIONS DOWN THE DRAIN!

If that's what they say on their website, then that is truly one of the most asinine things I've seen in a while.

Rogers Marvel's credentials are not in question. But that doesn't change the fact that what they've done with the landscaping of this project is pretty pitiful. I'm not sure if Sandridge used a Groupon or what, but for whatever reason they did not get this company's best work. There's no longer any relation to the street. At least with the original Kerr-McGee design, the plaza drew you in from the street despite the setback. Now that space is buried in trees with a diagonal sidewalk that completely ignores the south face of the tower.

The Kerr Park part of it looks better, but it's hard to tell what types of trees they are using. Those evergreens are awful. We have enough of those growing here naturally. We don't need to add any.

Best post yet, and unfortunately so true. Just goes to show yet again Sandridge is clueless on anything not their core business, such as PR and urban design.

Best post yet, and unfortunately so true. Just goes to show yet again Sandridge is clueless on anything not their core business, such as PR and urban design.

I have yet to see anything that they have ever really been trying to follow urban design principles, they chose the location on what they considered a good price, proximity to downtown seemed like a plus to them but not their original intent.

If that's what they say on their website, then that is truly one of the most asinine things I've seen in a while.
From Hoerr Schaudt Landscape Architects's website

SandRidge Energy Corporate Headquarters (Oklahoma City, OK)The corporate headquarters for SandRidge Energy highlights the challenges of American urbanism in the 21st century. The site is comprised of ’recycled’ historically significant buildings, a corporate plaza and public park embedded in a resurgent downtown. Hoerr Schaudt is collaborating with Rogers Marvel Architects to use the interstitial spaces to create a unified campus in the city that is open to the public. Sculpted landforms are designed to evoke the varying topography of Oklahoma while defining spaces, framing views, and mitigating Oklahoma’s persistent winds. This project is a Pilot Project in the Sustainable Sites Initiative, which is being designed to transform land development and management practices with the first national rating system for sustainable landscapes..[/

How is anything they are doing sustainable? I don't think they know what the term Sustainable Sites means? They are making that SSI a joke!

Rogers Marvel's credentials are not in question. But that doesn't change the fact that what they've done with the landscaping of this project is pretty pitiful. I'm not sure if Sandridge used a Groupon or what, but for whatever reason they did not get this company's best work. There's no longer any relation to the street. At least with the original Kerr-McGee design, the plaza drew you in from the street despite the setback. Now that space is buried in trees with a diagonal sidewalk that completely ignores the south face of the tower.

The Kerr Park part of it looks better, but it's hard to tell what types of trees they are using. Those evergreens are awful. We have enough of those growing here naturally. We don't need to add any.

Personally I think they current Kerr Park is more welcoming than the forest of Cedar trees they have in the design. The original Kerr Park has a lot of character and actual seating! It is a gem that they are going to destroy! It did need to be revived but not destroyed.

Yep

Er yeah.... not surprised to see this project looking awful. If the renders had accurately reflected how ugly the landscaping was to be, I can only wonder if those buildings would still be standing and if SR would have compromised and allowed for a deal with some apartment redevelopers.

I seriously LOL'ed. That is good stuff.

Thanks, Sid!


Best post yet, and unfortunately so true. Just goes to show yet again Sandridge is clueless on anything not their core business, such as PR and urban design.

Thanks. To elaborate, it reminds me of suburban office complexes where there is an entrance on one side, while the other three sides are just kind of covered up by mediocre landscaping seen from the sidewalk and parking lots.

Drove past the Braniff building today. The back of it is almost completely torn off and you can see the individual floors. Anyone with a camera?

Do you think the new glass facade will give us any hint into the design of the new tower they are intending to build?

That's going to look so cool. And as for the new tower, i would imagine it would be glass. Maybe with a different tint though, i couldn't picture them building a "blue" glass tower. I would like to see some sort of see-through "white" glass, like the Devon rotunda.

Do you think the new glass facade will give us any hint into the design of the new tower they are intending to build?

GOOD question.

I'm sure there will be an attempt to marry the Braniff, amenities building and the new tower and I would think the glass used would be the easiest way.


BTW, I hear the deal with A Good Egg group is still moving along for the ground floor at the Braniff and we should know more soon.

I don't know about that. Good Egg would bring SR dangerously close to something resembling quasi mixed-use. That, as we all know, could be very damaging to their corporate image around the world.

The amenities building will also have a nice restaurant or two and the new tower is likely to have retail along Broadway. Braniff should have more retail/restaurants on the ground floor as well.

Give SandRidge credit... They are breathing tons of life into completely dead blocks right in the middle of our CBD.

Where are you getting that the new tower will likely have retail along Broadway? If that's true, then good deal.

I'll hold the credit for SR. This was a situation where any change would have been a positive, at least in the short-term, but don't forget that SR did everything they could to prevent private developers from coming in and putting the Braniff AND Kermac buildings to a much higher use. So, as SR matures and grows their presence in our community, hopefully they do a lot of things that earn them kudos from all of us. But the current phase of their headquarters project is not one of them, and I just can't give someone who's already burned us once in a big way "kudos" for something that isn't even on the boards yet.

Although i agree with you regarding Sandridge in theory, when you graduate and work in the real world, you'll see how things work in reality.

Fair enough. But shouldn't we at least have this debate, even if my side always com es up short?

Where are you getting that the new tower will likely have retail along Broadway? If that's true, then good deal.

I'll hold the credit for SR. This was a situation where any change would have been a positive, at least in the short-term, but don't forget that SR did everything they could to prevent private developers from coming in and putting the Braniff AND Kermac buildings to a much higher use. So, as SR matures and grows their presence in our community, hopefully they do a lot of things that earn them kudos from all of us. But the current phase of their headquarters project is not one of them, and I just can't give someone who's already burned us once in a big way "kudos" for something that isn't even on the boards yet.

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Thank you!

you act like everyone in okc hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in okc my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until i started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones i've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but it's a work in progress. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so i'll save my judgement until then.

Like pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Amen!

I wish I would have taken video about a year and a half ago when I walked around what is now the SandRidge complex.

I posted about it at the time because I couldn't get over that that entire area -- about 1/4 of all of our CBD -- was completely desolate. That entire block with the SR Tower was totally deserted; I mean not one light on in that entire sector. Then, you had the old Globe Life building and Dowell Center directly south, also completely empty for many years. To the north you had the old library, long shuttered and those AT&T buildings that give every impression of being lifeless. To the east is that grassy vacant lot, a drive-in bank (almost completely unused) and a parking garage with nothing at ground level.

I had walked over after parking in Deep Deuce and being energized by what was happening there... And became incredibly depressed. The realities of our central core were obviously still pretty dire when you have several blocks that look like something out of a post-apocalyptic movie. If I had been down there at night I would have been looking over my shoulder for zombies.

Worse yet was the realization that all those structures -- including the tower -- needed an incredible amount of work.

I'm frustrated by my inability to portray how incredibly bad that area was and felt.


I don't need to contrast that situation with where we are now and where we will be in just another year or two. Bad initial PR aside, what SandRidge is doing for downtown rivals the contributions of Devon -- and that's saying something.

Bad initial PR aside, what SandRidge is doing for downtown rivals the contributions of Devon -- and that's saying something.

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

I must agree. It is completely possible that 75% of the devon employees could go to work without setting a foot outside downtown and then by the same methods they by which they came in

I am going to adjust my JTF rating scale to factor in the number of retail/restaurant/professional service spaces that open directly to the sidewalk.

The block wouldn't have been dead for decades if The Braniff and Kermac had been converted into housing. And how do we know that an influx of residents wouldn't have encouraged Dowell to move forward with renovations on his building?

It might have very well been dead after Kerr McGee moved out but KM had more employees there then Sandridge does. The difference is that Sandridge is creating interacton with the sidewalk which will bring people to the area during the day and night who do not work at Sandridge. As Wschnitt pointed out at Devon, the vast majority of employees will arrive by car and park in a connected parking garage, walk into the building, stay there all day (even for lunch), and leave by car. At least the Sandridge employees will have to cross the street which might lead to a news/lotto/sundry kiosk at the corner.

And Yes, I know Devon restaurants will be open to the public but you won't see those restaurants from the sidewalk so they don't create a sense of place for the area. It's like the difference between sidewalk cafes and the food court at the mall.

The block wouldn't have been dead for decades if The Braniff and Kermac had been converted into housing. And how do we know that an influx of residents wouldn't have encouraged Dowell to move forward with renovations on his building?

Given the long and difficult road for the old library which is in infinitely better condition, we can't be sure that would have happened any time soon, if at all.

In fact, the only decent-sized housing projects that have been the product of historic renovation are the Montgomery and Park Harvey and both had received previous renovations and were in relatively good shape.

There are dozens of well-located older buildings around downtown that have been left untouched throughout this building boom because no one has been able to make them work financially.

It might have very well been dead after Kerr McGee moved out but KM had more employees there then Sandridge does. The difference is that Sandridge is creating interacton with the sidewalk which will bring people to the area during the day and night who do not work at Sandridge.

Wouldn't there be more people on the streets and even more people in the area though if those two buildings were housing as opposed to just more restaurants that Sandridge is adding?

As we are discussing this, SandRidge just filed a $750,000 building permit to erect the steel canopy between the tower and Braniff building.

Wouldn't there be more people on the streets and even more people in the area though if those two buildings were housing as opposed to just more restaurants that Sandridge is adding?

Yes there would be. Believe me, I am not happy about tearing down structures to replace them with corporate plazas - trees or no trees. Sandridge has said the corporate plaza is temporary so at this point all I can hope is that that is true.

Just to clarify, that large plaza at the corner of Robinson & RSK is permanent. None of their renderings or discussions have ever indicated otherwise. The proposed new tower would be east of the existing SR Tower on the site now occupied by a small parking garage.

Not only has SandRidge never indicated they would ever build anything west of SR Tower, they wouldn't be spending millions on this area if they had any other plans.

You act like everyone in OKC hates them because they tore down an ugly building. I guarantee that about 90% of the people who have a problem with them, post on this board. I've lived in OKC my whole life and never heard of anyone having a problem with them until I started reading this board. Like someone else said in another thread, the majority of the population has no idea what buildings you were trying to "save". While you might consider them historic, the majority of the city does not. Stop being butt hurt about it and move on.

And while you might not like the way their landscaping looks, why don't we take a look at some pictures of it from different angles? The only ones I've seen on here were taken directly from the side so that all you would see would be the individual rows of trees. Not the most flattering angle. What does it look like from the front? And why can't everyone just save their opinions for when it is finished? I don't really like the way it looks right now but IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS. I like the renderings of what it's supposed look like when it's finished, so I'll save my judgement until then.

Like Pete said, while you might not agree with what they're doing with their city block, they are revitalizing an area of downtown that has been dead for a long time. Would you rather have what is going on now? Or have it be a dead, concrete graveyard for another few decades?

Hey, could you tap your caps lock button for me one more time?

OK, since you work for SR, please post some photos of their landscaping from different angles, if you think it makes that much of a difference. But I think it's pretty telling when SR employees are getting on here and telling us that every photo taken is "not the most flattering angle" to quote yourself. Show us something that is flattering.

I also have a bit of news for you. Sometimes (gasp) finished construction does not always match the renderings. In fact, this happens a lot in OKC, because we have very lax building standards and frequently see a developer switch and bait in this town. It's usually a given that you can tell a LOT more about a finished product from how construction is beginning to shape up than from renderings.

I'm not going to argue the point on the Kermac and India Temple buildings with someone who doesn't understand that historic can be easily defined and proven, and I would also point out there were redevelopers who wanted to turn those buildings into apartments, which would have had a higher economic and revitalizing yield than..coniferous trees.

By my count: Sidewalk interaction - Devon 0, Sandridge 2 (with more to come).

NEBU opens to the sidewalk ... on the west side of the building

The Devon garage, which will eventually have store fronts, and the auditorium.

Also have to give Devon credit for redeveloping the Colcord as there will soon be a new restaurant (Flint) with outside tables and a new entrance directly from the street rather than through the hotel lobby.

Also, number of historic buildings Devon has torn down (so far): 0

Number of parking garages Devon has eliminated or significantly built onto: You get the point

Also have to give Devon credit for redeveloping the Colcord as there will soon be a new restaurant (Flint) with outside tables and a new entrance directly from the street rather than through the hotel lobby.
Yeah, really excited about this one. For the past 25 years or so I have squinted my eyes and imagined sidewalk dining under the Colcord canopy. Looking across the street on the re-worked gardens will make it that much better. I can't wait.