I heard an interesting rumor today from my mother-in-law. She has a friend whose husband is a manager of one of the local Homeland Stores, either the one along NW 122nd and May or Britton and May (MIL didn't remember).

According to this person, Homeland has purchased property around NW 178th & Pennsylvania and will be putting in a PREMIUM grocery there, along the lines of a Central Market.

I don't know which parcel they are talking about - my guess is it is on the NW quadrant, across Pennsylvania from LifeChurch, since that's really the only tract available large enough to accommodate a grocery.

Anyone else hearing rumors of this nature? Steve, what do your little birdies tell you?

When Whole Foods came to St. Louis and was immediately very popular, what we saw was that the other "regular" grocery store chains began dramatically improving their offerings to compete. Obviously if this does happen, it's been in the works for awhile, but it could be that the grocers in OKC finally see an untapped market. That's good. A little competition improves everyone's game.

I live in the immediate area so that would be fantastic if it's true. The county assessor website doesn't show any land owned by Homeland in the available parcels but I did see that CVS owns the southeast corner of 178th & Penn.

I wonder what people thought when HEB tried out their Central Market concept.

"HEB? Hmm..not quite Whole Foods. Yeah I dunno bout that one."

The property could be under a development company name, maybe a build to suit or turnkey situation. The sale might also not be registered with the county yet or updated on the website.

The property could be under a development company name, maybe a build to suit or turnkey situation. The sale might also not be registered with the county yet or updated on the website.

FWIW, Homeland has a mixture of stores, some in corporate owned property and some via leased property.

When Whole Foods came to St. Louis and was immediately very popular, what we saw was that the other "regular" grocery store chains began dramatically improving their offerings to compete. Obviously if this does happen, it's been in the works for awhile, but it could be that the grocers in OKC finally see an untapped market. That's good. A little competition improves everyone's game.

Saw the same thing in New Orleans area. New Orleans always had a small Whole Foods on Esplanade since the 80s (I think it was the first WF store outside of Texas). Once they opened a couple of larger store the local chains started to get much better. Homeland and Buy 4 Less are shockingly bad compared to the Louisiana chain Rouse's. Could this be compared to the so-called "Southwest Airlines Effect"?

Interesting... Can Homeland pull it off?

I heard an interesting rumor today from my mother-in-law. She has a friend whose husband is a manager of one of the local Homeland Stores, either the one along NW 122nd and May or Britton and May (MIL didn't remember).

According to this person, Homeland has purchased property around NW 178th & Pennsylvania and will be putting in a PREMIUM grocery there, along the lines of a Central Market.

I don't know which parcel they are talking about - my guess is it is on the NW quadrant, across Pennsylvania from LifeChurch, since that's really the only tract available large enough to accommodate a grocery.

Anyone else hearing rumors of this nature? Steve, what do your little birdies tell you?

That would be good news. Two things, what is a GC? and Steve is a downtown beat writer, not suburban OKC, although he might have heard something.

The NE corner is obviously out, as it's the Lifechurch.tv-OKC campus.

I work with the developer of the SW corner and he hasn't mentioned it...and probably would have if it was there.

I had a friend contact me a couple of years ago doing due diligence for a drug store chain looking to build on the SE corner, but it has yet to materialize...although I did notice a new pin survey on that parcel that was done in the last few weeks. Perhaps it's there.

No activity that I'm aware of on the NW corner.

That would be good news. Two things, what is a GC? and Steve is a downtown beat writer, not suburban OKC, although he might have heard something.

Metro,

1. Who referenced "GC" and where?

2. Steve is a Business Journalist for The Oklahoman. For example:
NewsOK: Whole Foods will open a store in Oklahoma City (http://www.newsok.com/article/3459103?searched=steve%20lackmeyer&custom_click=search) ...Is that specifically a "downtown" story?

You're such a s-t-i-c-k-l-e-r.

Forget the GC thing. I see it was in the subject title.

That would be good news. Two things, what is a GC? and Steve is a downtown beat writer, not suburban OKC, although he might have heard something.

GC = grocery store - I was trying to abbreviate in the subject line (too much time spent on twitter)

metro, do you really think me that stupid?

I am very well aware of Steve's position. I also know that for reasons not necessarily related to his downtown beat, he may very well have an interest in this particular project, which is why I asked whether he had heard anything about it. If nothing else, there may be some other staff at the Oklahoman to whom he could inquire.

Mike, GC is mentioned in the title of the thread. Yes I know Steve is a business writer, but his focus is on DT and Main Street. Do you honestly think he was going to pass up a scoop such as Whole Foods which has been highly rumored for years now??? Susan Simpson or Richard Mize who write more Business Real Estate stories could have easily done the story if they cared or actually used OKCTalk and Twitter. (not watering down the scoop for Steve, just making a point).

Mike, GC is mentioned in the title of the thread. Yes I know Steve is a business writer, but his focus is on DT and Main Street. Do you honestly think he was going to pass up a scoop such as Whole Foods which has been highly rumored for years now??? Susan Simpson or Richard Mize who write more Business Real Estate stories could have easily done the story if they cared or actually used OKCTalk and Twitter. (not watering down the scoop for Steve, just making a point).

Yes, Metro, I edited my post when I realized it was in the subject title. Thank you. So, Steve is the downtown beat reporter UNLESS he just can't pass up a big scoop? Is that what you're saying? Just chill. And before you say anything, yes, I know Steve's "beat" is downtown, but give Steve some credit for maybe knowing about more than several square city blocks. Jeeeezzzzz.

I wonder what people thought when HEB tried out their Central Market concept.

"HEB? Hmm..not quite Whole Foods. Yeah I dunno bout that one."

Yep. And now I actually prefer Central Market and wish we had one here in OKC.

I hope Homeland does go through with a "premium" concept market. I'd certainly give it a try.

Really I hope that Whole Foods coming to town causes some of our grocers to clean up their acts.

Homeland Stores (HomelandStores) on Twitter (http://twitter.com/homelandstores) Someone hit them up on twitter and investigate this latest rumor. Metro, you tweet don't you?

I wonder what people thought when HEB tried out their Central Market concept.

"HEB? Hmm..not quite Whole Foods. Yeah I dunno bout that one."

Interesting thought, but Homeland has never been near as good of a grocer as HEB, so I don't have the highest hopes for their "premium" concept.

Haven't heard this one. We'll look into it.

Not to change the subject but isn't Crest's new store at SW 104th and Penn going to be an upscale "fresh market" concept? I would have better hopes for them...their regular stores as it stands now are better than anything Homeland has to offer.

Not to change the subject but isn't Crest's new store at SW 104th and Penn going to be an upscale "fresh market" concept? I would have better hopes for them...their regular stores as it stands now are better than anything Homeland has to offer.

SW 104h and May.

I suspect there's a growing realization that the Oklahoma City market demands more options than Walmart, Target and Homeland.

Yep. And now I actually prefer Central Market and wish we had one here in OKC.
I prefer Central Market over Whole Foods, of course the Westgate Central Market is closer and not having to deal with downtown parking and the crowd at WF is a bonus. I only live about 4 miles south of Downtown Austin so it isn't that long of a trip.


Interesting thought, but Homeland has never been near as good of a grocer as HEB, so I don't have the highest hopes for their "premium" concept.
I know my dad wishes they would expand up there after being to the stores here.

Yep. And now I actually prefer Central Market and wish we had one here in OKC.

I hope Homeland does go through with a "premium" concept market. I'd certainly give it a try.

Really I hope that Whole Foods coming to town causes some of our grocers to clean up their acts.

Me too. I love the idea of Central Market. You get the great organics and high quality food of Whole Foods, and you can still get a a jar of Pace Picante Sauce at a good price. I would just be thrilled if there was something as good here as a regular HEB. Crest is as close as it gets, and that ain't very close.

Not to change the subject but isn't Crest's new store at SW 104th and May going to be an upscale "fresh market" concept? I would have better hopes for them...their regular stores as it stands now are better than anything Homeland has to offer.

I think it is going to be rather interesting as far as how Homeland is going to handle the new competition from Crest.

The Homeland at 104th and Penn is Homeland's flagship store. They always show that in their commericals and it was Homeland's first real attempt at a full scale grocery store. When they first opened the store had a restraunt inside the deli area. Today they are probably the best place to shop southside. They have a full scale deli and bakery, a fresh seafood and fresh cut meat counter. Lastly, they carry everything just about everything you would need grocery wise no section is skimped back like Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market. The only downside is that their prices are a little higher than most OKC grocery stores.

I thought Homeland's flagship store is now the one that took over the former Albertson's at May & Britton?

I suspect there's a growing realization that the Oklahoma City market demands more options than Walmart, Target and Homeland.

When I was living in Norman we always pretended to add French pronunciation to all of the chains we had available..lol (Tar-jay, etc). Demanding better options can be a mind game..if you convince yourself that an option is more sophisticated, that goes a long ways!

In other words..yes we're desperate for better. lol

I think it is going to be rather interesting as far as how Homeland is going to handle the new competition from Crest.

The Homeland at 104th and Penn is Homeland's flagship store. They always show that in their commericals and it was Homeland's first real attempt at a full scale grocery store. When they first opened the store had a restraunt inside the deli area. Today they are probably the best place to shop southside. They have a full scale deli and bakery, a fresh seafood and fresh cut meat counter. Lastly, they carry everything just about everything you would need grocery wise no section is skimped back like Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market. The only downside is that their prices are a little higher than most OKC grocery stores.

It has been my experience that Homeland is one of the day-to-day, high price leaders even with their dumpy stores (36th & N Penn etc). Can't even imagine what it might be in an "upscale" store.

Um, the Homeland at 104th and Penn was not their effort to be anything, it was built as an Albertsons. Albertson's built four stores on a new concept (104th and Penn, 29th and Sunnylane, 15th and Post, and Britton and May) about 3 years before they exited the market. When Albertsons left, they sold their stores off -- some to Homeland and some to Jeff Williams (out of Tuttle). Williams couldn't handle the new stores, and eventually sold the SW OKC and Del City stores to Homeland. All of those former Albertsons stores are run somewhat differently than the average Homeland, and tend to have better quality and selection.

It's a shame really that Albertsons left. Those newer stores were among the best in the city.

Um, the Homeland at 104th and Penn was not their effort to be anything, it was built as an Albertsons. Albertson's built four stores on a new concept (104th and Penn, 29th and Sunnylane, 15th and Post, and Britton and May) about 3 years before they exited the market. When Albertsons left, they sold their stores off -- some to Homeland and some to Jeff Williams (out of Tuttle). Williams couldn't handle the new stores, and eventually sold the SW OKC and Del City stores to Homeland. All of those former Albertsons stores are run somewhat differently than the average Homeland, and tend to have better quality and selection.

UM.... NO Wrong! It was actually supposed to be built as a Baker's. Baker's folded and sold their stores to Homeland while the store was under construction. It orignally opened as a Homeland store.

The weekend it opened Buchanan's and the Homeland at 89th and Penn both closed because AWG had purchased some of the assets of Fleming and Homeland.

I lived in that area at the time they opened the store as Homeland. Albertson's was still located at the corner of 104th and Western. A couple of years later, AWG was in the process of shedding Homeland of it's debt.

Albertson's bought the store from AWG and closed the store at 104th and Western (which has since been remodeled to Palagio Shops by PB Odom).

Albertson's closed the Homeland for a couple of days while they ran through and changed prices and signage. Albertson's never altered the appearance of the store. All they did was cover the Homeland logos.

Albertson's sold the store back to Homeland when they left the state.

I know this because my parents have lived in that area since 1981 and they are in that store almost daily. They shopped the Buchanan's and Homeland stores on 89th until they day they closed.

^^^

It does get a bit complicated doesn't it? Similar things happened with the Homeland (currently) at sw 74th & May. Over the years I think it was all of the following (in no particular order and may have reverted back to one of the prior names a time or two):

Skaggs
Skaggs Alpha Beta
Skaggs Albertsons
Jewel T/Osco
Albertsons
Williams
Homeland

Many of the above were at all part of the same parent company at one point or another, sometimes they started out as competitors but thru mergers etc. As you stated, rarely did the store itself change when the name changed...new sign and name badges for the employees...might clearance out the "store brand" stock of the previous name, change the prices and continue on. Somehow (esp when it was the same parent company) thought it was a tax write off or something...taking a losing store, shift it to another subsidiary to balance out what ever tax liabilities etc.

My grandmother still called it (and wrote the checks out to Skaggs). That's what she knew it as and she wasn't going to change. LOL

Like they say about Oklahoma (weather/banks/grocery stores) if you don't like it, wait 15 minutes....

Interesting thought, but Homeland has never been near as good of a grocer as HEB, so I don't have the highest hopes for their "premium" concept.

Have you been to their store on N. May and Britton? It's not a Central Market or Whole Foods, but it's probably the nicest in OKC.

It's a shame really that Albertsons left. Those newer stores were among the best in the city.

AGREED! When I lived near the Britton/May area, I used to go into that Albertsons all the time. It was a bit on the pricey side comparatively, but was especially great around the holidays, where I could find specialty items I couldn't find in many other places.

I haven't been into the Homeland there for two reasons:

1. Moved out of that area;
2. I always had a bad impression in my mouth from Homeland, having been familiar with the one on 122nd and May near my parents, so was not impressed with the stores, which always seemed dirty and grungy to me, and their selection, which was sparse comparatively.

It sounds as if Homeland did not change the model much after Albertsons left, and IF they are intending to build a store at 178th/Penn, I'm hopeful they will indeed make it a premium store.

The store at 178th (Second St) and Santa Fe, just 2 miles down the road, is certainly not a great example... another reason I tend to shop Crest these days.

Have you been to their store on N. May and Britton? It's not a Central Market or Whole Foods, but it's probably the nicest in OKC.

Yes, I go there frequently. It's not remotely like a Central Market.

Have you been to their store on N. May and Britton? It's not a Central Market or Whole Foods, but it's probably the nicest in OKC.

I agree that it is one of the nicest large groceries in OKC (I shop there regularly, partly because I enjoy the selection and atmosphere compared to other groceries, and partly because I work down the road), but would not dare compare it to an upscale grocery. Tis the state of affairs with groceries in this city. As others have said, I can't wait until WF comes but I also can't wait until WF ups the competition. There is no reason why Homeland can't better develop this concept, they just need a reason why they *should*.

AGREED! When I lived near the Britton/May area, I used to go into that Albertsons all the time. It was a bit on the pricey side comparatively, but was especially great around the holidays, where I could find specialty items I couldn't find in many other places.

I haven't been into the Homeland there for two reasons:

1. Moved out of that area;
2. I always had a bad impression in my mouth from Homeland, having been familiar with the one on 122nd and May near my parents, so was not impressed with the stores, which always seemed dirty and grungy to me, and their selection, which was sparse comparatively.

It sounds as if Homeland did not change the model much after Albertsons left, and IF they are intending to build a store at 178th/Penn, I'm hopeful they will indeed make it a premium store.

The store at 178th (Second St) and Santa Fe, just 2 miles down the road, is certainly not a great example... another reason I tend to shop Crest these days.

Yeah, they pretty much kept the same concept Albertsons had, only I'd say they added a few more offerings and made it slightly better ironically. I agree with Homeland's image, but this store is a good store for Homeland.

Homeland doesn't have anyone on staff currently that is capable of setting up and running a "Central Market" type store. It would just end up being a fancy Homeland.

We are sadly lacking a quality grocery shopping experience in OKC. Crest is good, with the best pricing, but they lack the variety of products one will find in a Central Market. Also the produce at Crest isn't always first quality.

It's a shame really that Albertsons left. Those newer stores were among the best in the city.
They closed the last few here in Austin a couple of years ago after closing the majority of them in the initial Albertson's store closings. There has been an interesting mix of things that have opened up in them. A few HEB and Randall's (Safeway) stores have opened in them but the majority of them have opened as other things, fitness center, artist market and some Goodwill stores that I know of.


^^^

It does get a bit complicated doesn't it? Similar things happened with the Homeland (currently) at sw 74th & May. Over the years I think it was all of the following (in no particular order and may have reverted back to one of the prior names a time or two):

Skaggs
Skaggs Alpha Beta
Skaggs Albertsons
Jewel T/Osco
Albertsons
Williams
Homeland

Many of the above were at all part of the same parent company at one point or another, sometimes they started out as competitors but thru mergers etc. As you stated, rarely did the store itself change when the name changed...new sign and name badges for the employees...might clearance out the "store brand" stock of the previous name, change the prices and continue on. Somehow (esp when it was the same parent company) thought it was a tax write off or something...taking a losing store, shift it to another subsidiary to balance out what ever tax liabilities etc.

My grandmother still called it (and wrote the checks out to Skaggs). That's what she knew it as and she wasn't going to change. LOL

Like they say about Oklahoma (weather/banks/grocery stores) if you don't like it, wait 15 minutes....
Much of that was corporate changes, I wirked at the Bethany Skaggs when I was in high school, when I started in 1980 it was Skaggs Albertson's, our checks came out of Salt Like City. Then in 1981 it changed to Skaggs Alpha Beta and the checks came out of Yorba Linda, California. Then different buyouts and mergers over the years was what drove the name changes. Then the debt from all of those transactions took its toll, it hit Safeway at the time of the Michael Milken junk bond scandal and why Safeway sold off parts of the company in this part of the country and why the stores became Homeland in OK. Seems business never learns about accruing an incredible amount of debt to acquire others.

I miss Safeway. I remember they had some of the best bakery items I have ever had from a grocery store. Not to mention their house brand items were pretty good.

Homeland says this rumor is not true - they have no plans for a store at NW 178 and Penn

Can I start the rumor that it is going to be the 2nd Whole Foods? (hehehehehe!)