Well I will try to keep it short and see if maybe I can get some insight and some much needed help or advice on how to handle my 5 yr old son. Lets go back to the begining, he has been through alot been removed from the moms for her own stupidity after I kept telling her to keep up the house or all it would take is a phone call, and well there came the phone call and they were removed, and for me I couldn't do anything for being a failure to protect. So at the time I was very upset with DHS but once that was done, I got smart and went with the flow did what they wanted me to and did more, makeing myself look good. Plus to be honest I learned alot, and later on if records had to be pulled again, my part of it would look good and shown that I took control and made things better. Once it was closed I could move on, I finally had enough with ex wife and then pushed for divorce. So then came alot of fights, court time, I am sure the kids knew what was going on and took a toll on them. In the meantime My son name is Nathan or Nate for short, started to act out. When is was and is with me, I try to keep a strict routine, and serious about everything, and don't not put with outburst, back talk, or bad behavior is not allowed at my house. He is now in kindergarten, he was real bad in pre school, we had in the crossroads place here in norman on main street across from walmart, and of course there lack of guideance for the kids made it worse, they even tested him for adhd and other stuff and it came back he was normal (at the time 4 yr old) and would work with him. Well he kept getting bad so I took control of the kids and moved them from the school they were in which was the mothers idea and push, so I out them in the school that was very close to me, plus I went there, and where I wanted them to go. Daughter did great, Nate started rough, but got better and started learning alot, so I chalked it up the preschool wasn't doing what they should. Now this is where he goes bad, pre-K he did ok at first then went downhill fast. At one point I had to take off work and go literally sit with him in his class to make him behave, and also it showed the teacher how we handle him at home. He did ok, then got worse, more calls, went from worse to really worse. Now the mother has them and put them in the school she wanted, he is now in kindergarten, he has not improved, acted out in class, there mother had to spend all day and everyday up at the school, and even still he didn't care. Then came the he may have to go to alternative school or face suspension. So he is now in a alt school which is the Lealand wolf school on main street, which is doing good for him but he is not doing good. Has had bad behavior, stick tongue out out, bows up at you, clenches fist, hits. He had been doing real well lately in fact had been great for past few weeks then all of a sudden friday was a day from hell. The teacher stop counting marks, they have deputy at the school he bowed up in him, and acted like he was shooting the deputy. So he couldn't go to sisters b-day party, and has to stay with me, and has got to do nothing but sit on the couch. At times he acts like he is stupid as a rock, but he is very smart, does great at school when does his work. He tonight pushed every button I have, told him get pj's on, later on he smelled weird asked did you pee yourself and he said yes, asked why, his response was I had my underwear on and didn't want anyone to see me go to bathroom in underwear so I peed my self, I was like aaaggghhhh! :doh::doh: what are you thinking. By this time I was ready to go ballistic, told him go to bath room take off clothes so we can clean you off, and he goes in there and gets in the bathtub with his clothes on waiting. By this time all I do was just stand there trying my hardest not to lose it. I am out of ideas and patience on what to do or even trying to figure out why in the world he is acting like this having behavior like this. Does anybody have any ideas, or advice to try? I have even been thinking about seeing of the police will do tour of the jail and show him this is where you will be if you keep up when you are older from having that kind of behavior. We are even thinking of military school, but I think he is too young for that. He can't really be tested for adhd till he is 6, I don't think he has that but the way he acts I wonder if he does. I am open to anything at this point, if you want to know more or have questions I will give more info. Sorry to long winded trying to give all I could to get good ideas. I am ready to pull my hair out, but don't want to give up on him.

Okay, breathe.

You described a ton of things going on in this young man's life and many of them aren't good. One thing I can tell you right off the bat is that the behaviors this young man is exhibiting don't surprise me given what he has been through. As a guardian ad litem, I saw this sort of thing on a regular basis and, frankly, would be surprised if I didn't see some of it under the circumstances.

The fact that DHS got involved suggests to me that they probably already ordered you to go to a parenting class. Yes? I don't mean to be offensive and I am not attacking you when I say that. I am just saying that is typical when they have a situation like this. If they haven't, I suggest you sign up for one right away. They do a great job of teaching about developmental stages for children and every parent probably can gain something from taking a class. In addition, I'd suggest you take a class or get some counseling on how children react when their parents are at cross purposes. That is hell on earth for a child. It is an impossible situation for them and when they see their parents at each other's throats, their whole sense of security falls apart. In a little one, that is extremely damaging.

Your son is exhibiting anger and fear. I would worry less about ADHD or ADD at this point than I would that he is reacting emotionally to the turmoil and drama in his life. Changing schools, changing residences, parents frustrated and angry - all those things are very traumatic. I'd get him in to be evaluated to see if he could use some counseling to help him to cope. And I would suggest you consider doing some family counseling along with him, yourself. You sound like you are at the end of your rope, practically willing to give up on him and send him to military school even though he is only five years old. The fact that he is acting out at school as well as at home suggests to me that it isn't just "you," - it goes deeper than that. Of course I don't know, but what I really believe you need at this point is a professional opinion as to what is going on with your young man.

I wish you luck and hope you reach out for some help. It sounds like you and this young man are going to need it. The good news is that you are already asking for help and your son is young. The wetting himself is a red flag we see but that isn't the end of the world - but it is a common symptom of a troubled child. Do consider having him evaluated and sign up for some classes, yourself, to help you to understand what he is going through.

I also strongly suggest that you work as hard as you can to avoid the conflicts with his mother. At this point, that is secondary. Your focus must be on your son and the drama is a distraction that will only make it worse for him.

Also, do you have someone there to help give you a breather if you feel like you are going to lose it, like your mother or someone? Single parenting is hard and the kids will try your patience on a good day.

I wish you luck and I hope you let us know how he is doing.

My two - five cents.

I know a child who was removed from her birth parents who also acts this way. Her adoptive parents are at their wits' end. Maybe try to get counseling for him? It couldn't hurt. I don't have any other suggestions because nothing really seems to work for this little girl.

Edit: Oops, I waited too long to post. PennyQuilts said a lot of good things!

Thanks for the reply, I don't want to give up on him, I want to work with him and get to the bottom of what is wrong so I can try and begin to fix the issues and get him guided right where it needs to be. I did have to go through parenting classes but there wasn't anything that covered this type of behavior, I could call the place I had to go to, but they told me before they really couldn't help cause they are more or less assigned cases from dhs. I still may call anyway and see if I can take the class if there is anything they have that will help with this.

I think some of the reason of this comes from being with his mother, I have thought of removeing him from his mom and have him stay with me so I cna work on him one on one and get the bottom of the problem, but don't know if that would be a good idea. He suppose gets counseling from his school, there is a group and he has one on one, and it seems like the days he has counseling he is bad. I wonder if he is doing this for attention in some sort of way. I know there is hope, and plan on trying know matter how frustrated I get.

Thanks for the reply, I don't want to give up on him, I want to work with him and get to the bottom of what is wrong so I can try and begin to fix the issues and get him guided right where it needs to be. I did have to go through parenting classes but there wasn't anything that covered this type of behavior, I could call the place I had to go to, but they told me before they really couldn't help cause they are more or less assigned cases from dhs. I still may call anyway and see if I can take the class if there is anything they have that will help with this.

I think some of the reason of this comes from being with his mother, I have thought of removeing him from his mom and have him stay with me so I cna work on him one on one and get the bottom of the problem, but don't know if that would be a good idea. He suppose gets counseling from his school, there is a group and he has one on one, and it seems like the days he has counseling he is bad. I wonder if he is doing this for attention in some sort of way. I know there is hope, and plan on trying know matter how frustrated I get.

The school counselor might be able to suggest a private counselor and she (she?) also might have some insight as to what she thinks is going on or if she thinks that would be helpful. Kudos for trying to make sense of it and not just reacting when he acts up. It sounds like you want to get a handle on the problem and are intuitive enough to realize that the last thing you want to do is take him from the frying pan into the fire.

I don't know, but the days he has counseling and is acting up may be days when he feels safe enough to show his feelings. But that may be way off so don't put too much stock in the comment. Did they ever remove him from the home? Is he being exposed to some bad characters from time to time? This has been a long winter - perhaps getting him into some physical activity with dad would help drain off some of the fear and aggression. You want him to feel safe with you and that means that he sees you being calm and strong even when he isn't. Especially when he isn't. Someone once told me that the best thing you can do for a child is to remain calm. I think there is a lot of truth to that.

I think you are asking a lot of good questions and clearly want to help your son.

They the school pointed us to a place to get him checked out for help, and they said it could be adhd, but couldn't test him for it till he was 6. So its like ok, what do we do till then and what can be done, how do we handle something like this. I hope there is somebody that has seen this or maybe experienced it and found some way to handle it and get him turned around. Even right now he is in his room playing and is content and doing great, but that could change at anytime.

They the school pointed us to a place to get him checked out for help, and they said it could be adhd, but couldn't test him for it till he was 6. So its like ok, what do we do till then and what can be done, how do we handle something like this. I hope there is somebody that has seen this or maybe experienced it and found some way to handle it and get him turned around. Even right now he is in his room playing and is content and doing great, but that could change at anytime.

Just because they wouldn't want to test for ADHD until age six doesn't mean you can't have him evaluated for an emotional disturbance. There are places that do that.

You might also want to press for a child study at the school if his behavior is affecting his performace and achievement. They will probably put you off but it is something you can try or at least get in motion. He may benefit from an IEP (individualized education plan) and they can determine if he needs one through a child study. Again, good luck. There is an underlying reason for his behavior and until that is addressed, you are probably going to have limited success in controlling or minimizing the behavior. Being involved in a calm way usually sits well with the school. My experience is that with separated parents, the teachers can be your best friend if they see you as a rational, caring parent who puts the child first. Tip - going off too much on the other parent is something that drives child advocates wild. Keep your focus on your son and his well being rather than try to figure out if it is mom's fault. It may be, but the important thing is helping your son because he sounds like he is suffering. Also, be sure you give him good attention when he is playing quietly. A lot of kids act up for attention, as I am sure you know. "Catch them being good" is always a good strategy. Oh, and I meant to suggest that you do the same with your daughter. The "good" kids are often overlooked when you have one acting out (although please don't hold her up as an example to Nate).

Didn't get to reading any of the first post.... No paragraphs!

They the school pointed us to a place to get him checked out for help, and they said it could be adhd, but couldn't test him for it till he was 6. So its like ok, what do we do till then and what can be done, how do we handle something like this. I hope there is somebody that has seen this or maybe experienced it and found some way to handle it and get him turned around. Even right now he is in his room playing and is content and doing great, but that could change at anytime.

My coworker has had some similar issues with her child. INTEGRIS Mental Health in Spencer helped her child through an inpatient program.

INTEGRIS Mental Health, Inc.: INTEGRIS Mental Health (http://www.integris-health.com/INTEGRIS/en-US/Specialties/H-N/MentalHealth/default)

Didn't get to reading any of the first post.... No paragraphs!

Really? You were worried about paragraph's to not take the time to read it and give some advice or suggestion, but rather give grammer lessons. There has been other reply's that took there time to read it and are trying to help out. If you didn't want to read it then say nothing and move on.

My coworker has had some similar issues with her child. INTEGRIS Mental Health in Spencer helped her child through an inpatient program.

INTEGRIS Mental Health, Inc.: INTEGRIS Mental Health (http://www.integris-health.com/INTEGRIS/en-US/Specialties/H-N/MentalHealth/default)

I will check into that some more and see if they can do or have anything that help out. Thanks for the link.

Really? You were worried about paragraph's to not take the time to read it and give some advice or suggestion, but rather give grammer lessons. There has been other reply's that took there time to read it and are trying to help out. If you didn't want to read it then say nothing and move on.

Dude's got a point, though: Those huge blocks of text are super-annoying to try to read.

As such, I didn't read any of it, either, so my advice would be to simply sell your son to some local gypsies and be done with it. Whatever the problem is, it's solved, and you've got a little spending cash in your pocket. Win-win.

Many times Kids will act out in ways they don't really grasp. many times it is because of divorce and family turmoil. Keeping discipline is exactly what the Ol' Doc ordered You have to just keep it up. Redirection, redirection, redirection, and when you are ready to just loose it something magical will happen he will show you that he has been listening.

When you have a divorced family it rally cranks up the frustration cause one parent will almost seem to defiantly do the opposite of what you are trying to do. Yet the key here is communicate with the other parent and keep it up they will eventually get so tired of hearing from you they will start helping. How yo pose that is beyond me, you know your ex better than any of us but approach them in as non-confrontational as you can.

Other than that Good luck.