View Full Version : The Downtown Schools- Emerson Alternative Middle and the Future Elementary



Urban Pioneer
01-13-2010, 05:52 PM
As a nearby property owner, I was excited to get a post card in the mail for the Maps for Kids first project meeting for Emerson Alternative Middle at N. Walker and NW 6th Streets.

The meeting is tomorrow night (Thursday) (Jan 14th) at 6-7 in the school.

Hopefully they will demolish those ugly mobile homes and clean up the block. The school itself is another grand ole "Cherokee Gothic" structure.

This is meeting one of four that are planned.

I also want to ask them about the planned downtown elementary.

Urban Pioneer
01-13-2010, 06:18 PM
Another thing that should be advocated for is the use of Project 180 templates for the surrounding streets and sidewalks. I am sitting outside the school now and the block really does need serious help.

PLANSIT
01-14-2010, 03:35 PM
Good stuff.

BTW, I didn't know you owned property downtown.

Urban Pioneer
01-14-2010, 07:53 PM
Well, the meeting was a bit extraordinary. I didn't think that many people were interested in the school. There was very little room for any more. And the crowd was diverse and fully engaged.

Basically, the crowd wants Option 2. That is the complete renovation of the existing historic school building and construction of a large addition.

There is a strong desire for the demolition and removal of the existing "temporary" buildings. Also a new drop off and parking areas planned,

The disappointing aspects if the plan is that there is little focus on the seamless integration needed with downtown and ammenities such as bike racks and basketball courts. Everyone there seemed to want these elements added.

Steve was there as well an can probably add more to the thread.

rcjunkie
01-15-2010, 01:39 AM
Well, the meeting was a bit extraordinary. I didn't think that many people were interested in the school. There was very little room for any more. And the crowd was diverse and fully engaged.

Basically, the crowd wants Option 2. That is the complete renovation of the existing historic school building and construction of a large addition.

There is a strong desire for the demolition and removal of the existing "temporary" buildings. Also a new drop off and parking areas planned,

The disappointing aspects if the plan is that there is little focus on the seamless integration needed with downtown and ammenities such as bike racks and basketball courts. Everyone there seemed to want these elements added.

Steve was there as well an can probably add more to the thread.

Any discussion about the Proposed Elementary school ?

Midtowner
01-15-2010, 06:26 AM
Emerson Alternative's mission is currently helping teen moms. Is that going to change?

Urban Pioneer
01-15-2010, 09:49 AM
The downtown elementary school was not openly discussed. However, a school representative told me that it is still on the docket and location could almost be any where downtown.

Have any ideas for a good location?

Emerson will still handle both the young mothers and the Alternative Students.

The students that attended the event claimed to need books and other necessities immediately. Apparently, the school needs dire assistance for basic materials now irregardless of the renovation.

fuzzytoad
01-15-2010, 10:33 AM
The students that attended the event claimed to need books and other necessities immediately. Apparently, the school needs dire assistance for basic materials now irregardless of the renovation.

I thought Maps4Kids was a huge success?? At least, that's what we were all led to believe..

Also, I hope you weren't quoting the school there, since "irregardless" was used...

Urban Pioneer
01-15-2010, 11:33 AM
I think MAPS 4 Kids, from what I have at least seen, has been a great success. But MAPS doesn't deal with school supplies and medical clinics. The situation at Emerson is dire. They need help today. They also need help beyond the typical. These are troubled young adults with real problems.

The school renovation will help return some dignity back to the property. However, they need books, paper, medical equipment for the young mothers, and support for creative programs such as music.

The biggest element I saw glaringly absent that I could relate to was athletics for the young men who need an outlet. The neighborhood is constantly vandalized because they have nothing to spend all of that energy. I remember what it was like in high school. Young people need support and dignity. Emerson needs a complete "re-thinking" on design layout and the tools within that design for the kids to use.

Midtowner
01-15-2010, 11:51 AM
I'm not really sold. We gave the kids at Douglass and John Marshall fine facilities and financial support and they haven't improved a bit. Maybe we should be looking to cut our losses before going all in when it probably won't matter what we do or how much we spend with these folks? Just give 'em a class on how to apply for state and federal benefits, stick 'em in section 8 housing and be done with them.

What's the average outlook for these kids anyhow? Would new books or anything like that really change things?

Urban Pioneer
01-15-2010, 12:26 PM
That's a pretty "Randian" perspective! Lol
I don't have kids and usually would not be interested in such matters. But it was the students in attendance saying they don't have enough books and asking for them.

If there weren't 40 year old "temp" buildings surrounding the school I might have a different opinion. But how do you expect kids to lean in buildings with leaky roofs, broken plumbing, and limited heating?

If you don't support the kids, fine. That's your business. But otherwise it is another opportunity to improve another downtown block.

fuzzytoad
01-15-2010, 12:31 PM
If there weren't 40 year old "temp" buildings surrounding the school I might have a different opinion. But how do you expect kids to lean in buildings with leaky roofs, broken plumbing, and limited heating?


Sounds like an excellent opportunity to learn about carpentry, plumbing and hvac.

Urban Pioneer
01-15-2010, 03:17 PM
Sounds like an excellent opportunity to learn about carpentry, plumbing and hvac.

lol

Spartan
01-15-2010, 04:24 PM
Sounds like these kids should have done their homework and they would have known MAPS 4 Kids isn't the funding source for their new books. They'd have been better served attending a school board meeting and trying to guilt them over the book situation.

And you know, I went to high school in the suburbs..at Westmoore High School..and we had crappy books too. You know what? Deal with it. Everyone in public schools has crappy books. In college you can either buy your books new or get used books, your call there. They say it's "dire" -- that sounds dramatic. Define "dire."

As for the elementary school, two scenarios. You can put it where there is residential density in the Deep Deuce area, and you'll have a good school location, but you deal a huge blow to Core to Shore developing into mass residential. Put the school in Core to Shore and you help C2S out a lot, but for the development period, you just put an elementary school in a crackhead homeless bombed-out area.

Urban Pioneer
01-17-2010, 11:25 AM
What I do hope is that we make the Project 180 a designated template for further downtown development.

Emerson and this planned downtown elementary school are prime examples of opportunities to expand the continuity of this quality urban overlay. If Urban Renewal wants to develop another superblock, the perimeter textures and ammenities should be of the same design quality.

Midtowner
01-18-2010, 12:15 PM
If there weren't 40 year old "temp" buildings surrounding the school I might have a different opinion. But how do you expect kids to lean in buildings with leaky roofs, broken plumbing, and limited heating?

Perhaps because I've seen it done year in and year out at Harding Charter Prep? Broken plumbing and limited HVAC are the norm there as well. In fact, assuming the absolute worst about Emerson, the fact that it's minimally habitable means it's on par facility-wise with Harding despite the fact that Emerson gets far more money per pupil than Harding does (Emerson is a public school and Harding is a charter school, so Emerson gets more state money).

Also, Harding's teachers get paid at the absolute bottom of the Oklahoma step-pay scale. Emerson's, I'm quite sure do not, so let's brush that concern aside as well.

If with Harding's budget, they're able to afford newer textbooks, then the problem is not that M4K isn't doing its job vis a vis Emerson, it's that the administration of the school is choosing to allocate money to other things than textbooks despite having a serious financial advantage.

That said, Harding is the #3 academic school in the state. You can't talk about huge differences between minority and lower-income students because those differences don't really exit.

The difference is that one group of kids and parents give a damn about their education and the other does not. The very thought that we need to funnel more money to people who do not care about their education is simply baffling.

Schools in India and China and all over the third world with even worse facilities and home conditions are still running laps around even Harding... and you think textbooks are the problem?

bandnerd
01-18-2010, 04:40 PM
One thing that Mid did not mention about Harding is that a lot of those textbooks were bought with grant money, a fact which he might not have known. However, these grants are available for any school, if someone is willing to put in the legwork to apply and jump through all of the hoops. I myself have raised well over $20K in grant money for my programs. It's how we manage the gap in state mandated funding since we only receive 75% of it.

Sure, we want our kids in habitable places. We have worked very hard at Harding to make it a much cleaner, safer place; but no one was around to help us from MAPS, the state department, or really anywhere. We had to go out and do the work ourselves, raise money ourselves, and be the grunts.

gracefor24
01-18-2010, 05:09 PM
I'd like to see the demographic comparison between Harding and Emerson in the area bolded below.


Perhaps because I've seen it done year in and year out at Harding Charter Prep? Broken plumbing and limited HVAC are the norm there as well. In fact, assuming the absolute worst about Emerson, the fact that it's minimally habitable means it's on par facility-wise with Harding despite the fact that Emerson gets far more money per pupil than Harding does (Emerson is a public school and Harding is a charter school, so Emerson gets more state money).

Also, Harding's teachers get paid at the absolute bottom of the Oklahoma step-pay scale. Emerson's, I'm quite sure do not, so let's brush that concern aside as well.

If with Harding's budget, they're able to afford newer textbooks, then the problem is not that M4K isn't doing its job vis a vis Emerson, it's that the administration of the school is choosing to allocate money to other things than textbooks despite having a serious financial advantage.

That said, Harding is the #3 academic school in the state. You can't talk about huge differences between minority and lower-income students because those differences don't really exit.

The difference is that one group of kids and parents give a damn about their education and the other does not. The very thought that we need to funnel more money to people who do not care about their education is simply baffling.

Schools in India and China and all over the third world with even worse facilities and home conditions are still running laps around even Harding... and you think textbooks are the problem?

Midtowner
01-18-2010, 05:27 PM
I'd like to see the demographic comparison between Harding and Emerson in the area bolded below.

It isn't income.

It isn't race.

It isn't socioeconomic status.

It isn't that the teachers aren't being compensated at Emerson.

It isn't location.

It isn't funding.

It isn't facilities.

And it isn't something in the water.

What would you suggest the difference is? Do you have a better hypothesis? This case calls for a simple application of Occam's razor. If you look at the types of kids each school attracts (alternative versus charter), one group of kids and parents value education more than the other, hence higher test scores in one group and lower in the other.

The world is made up of winners and losers. The group that tries and cares is going to win the vast majority of the time. No amount of funding or new textbooks will erase that.

Urban Pioneer
01-19-2010, 09:48 AM
Article published today by Steve.

NewsOK (http://www.newsok.com/article/3433056?searched=emerson&custom_click=search#comments)

Charles
01-20-2010, 08:04 AM
Mr. Lackmeyer's article shows that good things don't just happen -- particularly with regards to the public schools. A school needs involved, focused parents to make a difference. Emerson's problem is that its patrons -- young mothers and students with discipline problems -- are among the least able to push back effectively against a bureacracy.

Midtowner
01-20-2010, 02:04 PM
Mr. Lackmeyer's article shows that good things don't just happen -- particularly with regards to the public schools. A school needs involved, focused parents to make a difference. Emerson's problem is that its patrons -- young mothers and students with discipline problems -- are among the least able to push back effectively against a bureacracy.

And the story behind the scenes is that the administration doesn't appear to give a damn.

If they'd actually apply for grants (not difficult at all), they could get textbooks and whatever else through private money. Instead, they'd rather be public employees in kooshy jobs and they'd rather not have to do any more than the bare minimum to get by.

The young lady's pleas re: new books are emblematic of the issue here. These folks would rather bitch about other people not spoonfeeding them everything they need than put pen to paper and stamp to envelope and do what needs to be done.

Sometimes, it ain't so much 'ask and ye shall receive' as it's 'seek and ye shall find.'

Urban Pioneer
04-19-2010, 10:40 AM
The meeting on this issue is today. Time to get rid of these awful "temporary" buildings downtown.

Urgent News: Emerson School | OKC Central (http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2010/04/19/urgent-news-emerson-school/#comment-8238)

metro
04-19-2010, 12:00 PM
Good post Urban Pioneer, anyone who can make it please attend. Tonights meeting is integral towards the fate of how this school will go. I'd love to be there, but I have another meeting I can't get out of.

George
04-19-2010, 03:27 PM
I’m a bit confused about the focus of the meeting tonight. The Board agenda only lists one item regarding Emerson, and it is under the Consent Agenda:

“Recommend approval to negotiate a contract for design services with The Small Group, for architectural engineering services related to the design and construction of Emerson Alternative School, OCMAPS Project EB-0017, to be funded from the Bond Fund. (Terry Wolfe/Jim Burkey)”

I called the Board Clerk to ask her about this. She said the only agenda item tonight was to select the architect for Emerson. This seemed to be more of an administrative issue, which may be why the item is on the Consent Agenda. The Board Clerk added that Emerson is scheduled to be on the agenda for the May 17th Board Meeting under “MAPS Reports”, which is generally when the Board approves specific MAPS projects for specific schools.

Maybe there will be a larger and more substantive discussion on Emerson tonight, but the Board's agenda doesn't seem to give any strong hints that this will definitely take place. I would really appreciate confirmation that we will be able to address approval of “Option 2″ for Emerson at tonight’s meeting. Thanks!

Urban Pioneer
04-19-2010, 03:38 PM
George- Here is What I posted on Steve's blog...

I think that it is the “scope of work” that is relevant to presenting now. If The Small Group is directed towards design services for Option A, then it starts from the beginning with that being the understood goal by the professionals.

However, if the scope is directed towards Option B or some other broader context, this would be the moments to establish that goals with the planners, architects, and engineers.

The May 17th board meeting is probably worth attending as well just “to back it up.”


I do think that it is better to go in from the absolute very beginning with a understanding of where the architects should focus their energy and preparation. And the board should fully understand where the community stands before any commitments are made.

Spartan
04-19-2010, 09:24 PM
Is there anyway to oppose The Small Group getting the contract for the school?

ljbab728
04-19-2010, 10:29 PM
The meeting on this issue is today. Time to get rid of these awful "temporary" buildings downtown.

Urgent News: Emerson School | OKC Central (http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2010/04/19/urgent-news-emerson-school/#comment-8238)

That seems to be one of the focus areas for Maps for Kids. I have driven by quite a few of the schools affected where the old temporary buildings have been removed or replaced.

Urban Pioneer
04-20-2010, 12:04 PM
Thanks to all who came out last night. There is more about this on Steve's blog. It looks like the board is headed in the right direction.

Urban Pioneer
04-20-2010, 04:04 PM
From an e-mail I just received:

Recap of last night and news for the near future!!!

The Small Group will be the architectural firm that does our design plans. There will be community meetings that will serve as opportunities to voice our needs for these students.

We are also working with the OKCPS Foundation to hold community meetings with Possibilities© to facilitate a plan for our needs at Emerson. This is being worked on for some time in May so I will keep you posted!!

Our next challenge is ensuring the school board allocates ALL available monies to Emerson!! It is imperative that the district use all of the alternative school tax money they have collected since 2001 for Emerson’s MAPS renovation!!

May 17th will be the date of the next school board meeting where they will allocate this money to Emerson’s MAPS project! Please mark your calendar now and plan to attend! Please think about speaking on our behalf they need to continue to hear what Emerson’s needs are and how to better our community and city through this renovation.

We need to continue contacting our school board with calls, emails, and letters-they are the deciding board for the money the district has from the alternative school tax money that is necessary for our having Option 2 at the very least! I have included their contact information at the bottom. Emerson’s board representative Steve Shafer. However, we receive students from all over the district so each board member has students who are attending Emerson! The last contact on the list is Ron Millican who was sworn in last night!

Again thank you from the bottom of my heart for your support!! Please don’t hesitate to contact me with comments, questions, etc.!


Randa Pirrong
National Board Certified
Family and Consumer Science
Emerson High School
Oklahoma City Public Schools


School Board Contact Information:

Oklahoma City Public Schools
900 N. Klein,
Oklahoma City, OK 73106

Angela Z. Monson
Board Chairperson
Contact Information:
720 NE 42 Street
Oklahoma City, OK 73105
405.271.2390

Lyn Watson
District 1 Representative
2917 Prairie Rose Court
Oklahoma City, OK 73120
Contact Information:
405.209.7877
lynwatson@cox.net

Gail Vines
District 2 Representative
Contact Information:
1128 NW 55th
Oklahoma City, OK 73118
405.843.1527

Phil Horning
District 3 Representative
Contact Information:
3201 NW 18
Oklahoma City, OK 73107
405.946.3778

Steve Shafer-Emerson’s Rep
District 4 Representative
Contact Information:
10914 Hefner Point Drive, Suite 304
Oklahoma City, OK 72120
405.848.6999

Ruth Veales
District 5 Representative
Contact Information:
405.732.8122


David Castillo
District 6 Representative
Contact Information:
1126 SW 65
Oklahoma City, OK 73139
405.361.4518

Ron Millican
District 7 Representative
Contact Information:
2308 SW 81
OKC, OK 73159
685-7069

soonerguru
04-20-2010, 10:03 PM
Wow!!!!! That is a lot of exclamation points!!!! I wonder if this is an educator!!!!!

Still, I love the enthusiasm.

Larry OKC
04-21-2010, 02:05 AM
Is there anyway to oppose The Small Group getting the contract for the school?

Spartan, may have missed something here, but what is the opposition to The Small Group?

Urban Pioneer
04-22-2010, 09:55 AM
Yeah? I don't think there is a problem with the Small Group that I know of. It's just that the entire facility needs to be thoroughly evaluated and properly designed around the needs of the school.

It seems that this has started with "cookie cutter" type options for a "typical" high school whereas this is an Alternative Education for young adults and health facilities for un-wed mothers.

metro
04-22-2010, 10:59 AM
Don't argue with Spartan, he is our resident critic of OKC progress.. I'm sure he'll enlighten us from his post up North.

Steve
04-22-2010, 08:38 PM
FYI - it's the Small Group that did the Bricktown Police Substation

Larry OKC
04-23-2010, 12:52 AM
Steve, were there problems with their work on that (am unfamiliar with it)?

Urban Pioneer
04-27-2010, 02:40 PM
Here is an article that was on the front page top of the Oklahoma yesterday.

NewsOK (http://www.newsok.com/article/3456888?searched=Emerson%20School&custom_click=search)

Larry OKC
04-27-2010, 03:03 PM
St. Anthony Hospital President Joe Hodges said Emerson’s renovation is an important piece of the Midtown redevelopment effort that the hospital has poured $200 million into since 2003.

$200M (private money) has been poured into this school in the past 7 years (same length as the MAPS for Kids tax) and it still looks like this? That is almost half of the entire sales tax money of M4K that has built a few brand new high schools and promised at least $1M in renovations to the other 70 or so schools (not to mention the 30% of the tax that has gone to surrounding school districts)!

The two portable classrooms (trailers) were damaged in the bombing? That was 15 years ago. Weren't there federal disaster relief funds that supposedly took care of just this sort of thing?

Where has all of the money gone?

The picture caption says that the student is standing in a classroom. Really? Where are the desks, blackboard etc. It may have been a classroom at one point but it is now a storage room.

CuatrodeMayo
04-27-2010, 03:23 PM
$200m has been invested in the hospital campus, not the school.

I can understand the confusion though, that is a poorly structured sentence.

Larry OKC
04-27-2010, 03:30 PM
$200m has been invested in the hospital campus, not the school.

I can understand the confusion though, that is a poorly structured sentence.

Thanks, that makes a lot more sense. Still wonder why those portable buildings weren't repaired/replaced to the bombing damage. Undoubtedly there were federal funds for just that sort of thing.

OKC@heart
04-27-2010, 04:02 PM
Thanks, that makes a lot more sense. Still wonder why those portable buildings weren't repaired/replaced to the bombing damage. Undoubtedly there were federal funds for just that sort of thing.

This is just a guess but I would imagine like anything else that the federal funds are based on the value of the buildings damaged and that it was likely prorated based on the previous condition of the building and so the money was probably not sufficient to replace the facilities with new ones and so they used the money to patch up and then apply elsewhere to support the needs of the program.

Again just a guess on my part...

urbanity
04-28-2010, 07:34 AM
Planned downtown elementary school has yet to materialize from MAPS for Kids | OKG Scene.com (http://www.okgazette.com/p/12776/a/6143/Default.aspx?ReturnUrl=LwBEAGUAZgBhAHUAbAB0AC4AYQB zAHAAeAAslashAHAAPQAxADIANwAyADkA)

metro
04-28-2010, 07:54 AM
$200M (private money) has been poured into this school in the past 7 years (same length as the MAPS for Kids tax) and it still looks like this? That is almost half of the entire sales tax money of M4K that has built a few brand new high schools and promised at least $1M in renovations to the other 70 or so schools (not to mention the 30% of the tax that has gone to surrounding school districts)!

The two portable classrooms (trailers) were damaged in the bombing? That was 15 years ago. Weren't there federal disaster relief funds that supposedly took care of just this sort of thing?

Where has all of the money gone?

The picture caption says that the student is standing in a classroom. Really? Where are the desks, blackboard etc. It may have been a classroom at one point but it is now a storage room.

Poorly written sentence, but common sense would tell you that's $200million invested in the hospital. Yes, the school, especially the portable buildings are in HORRIBLE condition, even for old OKC Public School standards. I encourage you to drive by the school sometime and check it out for yourself and see the need for serious renovations. This school is down the street from me and is a major eyesore. It's embarrasing they'd let something get this bad downtown, even if it was abandoned, let alone a school for pregnant teens and teen moms and dads.


$200m has been invested in the hospital campus, not the school.

I can understand the confusion though, that is a poorly structured sentence.

Exactly.

Larry OKC
04-28-2010, 04:55 PM
Honestly I figured it was a typo as the numbers didn't make any since (when you look at all that has been done with M4K overall). Not suggesting that the school isn't in need of serious help. Am in complete agreement.