View Full Version : Does the "Emergency Snow Route" designation mean anything?



TheTravellers
12-26-2009, 05:10 PM
Just curious, since a lot of the streets marked that have had nothing done to them - 164th, 150th/33rd, May, all up in NW OKC. I really hope the other "Emergency Snow Routes" are better! Yeah, I know this was record-setting, etc., but it stopped snowing almost 48 hours ago, which I would've thought would've been *plenty* of time for the plows (how many does OKC have? I really don't know.) to finish at the very least the "Emergency Snow Routes". Really, it's sad how bad those roads still are if they have the equipment and drivers to do it (yeah, they'd probably have to work multiple ridiculously long shifts, but that comes with the job, and I've had to work ridiculously long shifts as part of my job too, so I sympathize). Once a road's plowed and the wind's not gusting to 50 MPH anymore, it's going to stay pretty much clear, but there are main "Emergency Snow Routes" out there that have 8-12" high snow and ice on them. Just completely baffling...

Monday morning commute is going to be g*d-f-ing-awful if they don't do anything more than they have, just so y'all that haven't been out are aware.... :ohno:

And yeah, in case anybody's wondering, pretty much all I do is complain, but by doing so, I hope to bring things to light and eventually make them better - I emailed our councilman about this, but it won't do a bit of good after what I read about him in the past few minutes. I'd really like to try to make things better here (in some way, but not sure how yet since I seriously doubt I could get elected to any office where I could make a difference (and that's not even a sure way to change things in this state/city)), but I fear I'm outnumbered and will just get the sh*t beat out of me by the status quo. :fighting3 How do you get things to change to the way they should be done here? Or should I just give up and be a good little sheeple and accept things the way they are? :tongue:

flintysooner
12-26-2009, 05:15 PM
I looked at the City site and downloaded the regional snow routes. I was a little surprised that they've apparently superseded the City snow routes or I guess that is so.

On the south end of town the City has done a fabulous job on S 134th Street. But I can't tell there has been a plow at all on any of the North-South streets. Beats me why.

The neighborhoods are still really bad.

Beats me what the deal is. In the old city snow route scheme I think South 119th was designated but if there's been a plow on it I can't tell it.

Steve
12-26-2009, 05:22 PM
Western Avenue in northwest Oklahoma City between Memorial Road and NW 178 was in VERY GOOD condition today (was out this morning and afternoon), and it was a huge contrast to Edmond roads which apparently are never plowed. I'm very curious which stretch of Western you were traveling today.

TheTravellers
12-26-2009, 05:32 PM
Western Avenue in northwest Oklahoma City between Memorial Road and NW 178 was in VERY GOOD condition today (was out this morning and afternoon), and it was a huge contrast to Edmond roads which apparently are never plowed. I'm very curious which stretch of Western you were traveling today.

Y'know, now that I think about it, we did not go down Western, we almost did, but decided not to and took May instead. My bad, I'll edit the original post. :doh:

TheTravellers
12-26-2009, 05:36 PM
I looked at the City site and downloaded the regional snow routes. I was a little surprised that they've apparently superseded the City snow routes or I guess that is so.

On the south end of town the City has done a fabulous job on S 134th Street. But I can't tell there has been a plow at all on any of the North-South streets. Beats me why.

The neighborhoods are still really bad.

Beats me what the deal is. In the old city snow route scheme I think South 119th was designated but if there's been a plow on it I can't tell it.

Neighborhoods I expect to not be plowed at all - that's about the way it was in the Chicago burbs, and I'm fine with that. They did *eventually* get plowed up there, but only after *all* the main routes had been plowed and been clear for a day or so, then they worked on the side streets, so sometimes it took 3-4 days to get to them.

Steve
12-26-2009, 05:42 PM
Expect neighborhood roads to be plowed when tax rates hit 70 percent.

Spartan
12-26-2009, 07:24 PM
Western Avenue in northwest Oklahoma City between Memorial Road and NW 178 was in VERY GOOD condition today (was out this morning and afternoon), and it was a huge contrast to Edmond roads which apparently are never plowed. I'm very curious which stretch of Western you were traveling today.

See that's funny.. down here the OKC roads are horrible, with the one exception of SW 134th which you can almost go full-speed on (50 mph). Once you get into Moore those roads are so well-plowed you can pretty much turn off the 4WD. I know that OKC is having problems, I want to shop/eat/movies/etc in OKC etc.. but the allure of the plowed roads in Moore as opposed to S. Ice Cap Ave (Penn) which has NOT been plowed (or Western, May, etc), I think I'll go over to Moore.

Being the only north/south thoroughfare in decent shape, I-35 in Cleveland County was pretty jammed all day.

I don't think that "snow route" means anything in OKC..

flintysooner
12-26-2009, 07:34 PM
See that's funny.. down here the OKC roads are horrible, with the one exception of SW 134th which you can almost go full-speed on (50 mph). Once you get into Moore those roads are so well-plowed you can pretty much turn off the 4WD. I know that OKC is having problems, I want to shop/eat/movies/etc in OKC etc.. but the allure of the plowed roads in Moore as opposed to S. Ice Cap Ave (Penn) which has NOT been plowed (or Western, May, etc), I think I'll go over to Moore.

Being the only north/south thoroughfare in decent shape, I-35 in Cleveland County was pretty jammed all day.

I don't think that "snow route" means anything in OKC..Yes there were plows on S 134th this evening and it is almost totally clear.

If the plows have run anywhere else down here in OKC limits I haven't seen the evidence.

Larry OKC
12-26-2009, 08:13 PM
The Emergency Snow Route disignation just means it is the ones the City will tackle first (or at all). Certainly doesn't guarantee they will be snow/ice free by any means but are probably your best bet. On one of the local channels they said the City crews were concentrating on the East (?) side of town and they had contracted the West side out.

Got out of my apt complex Sat afternoon/evening (after taking the patio gate off the hinges so I could leave my apt) across the street from Deaconess Hospital. Portland was passable but when you got to NW Expressway, it was rough going...dry spots but in the section I drove (from Portland to Meridian and back), it was like driving on a gully washed country road. Surprised I have any shocks left. Hopefully Sunday will be better (going to south side to my parents for delayed Christmas.

Larry OKC
12-26-2009, 08:15 PM
See that's funny.. down here the OKC roads are horrible, with the one exception of SW 134th which you can almost go full-speed on (50 mph). Once you get into Moore those roads are so well-plowed you can pretty much turn off the 4WD. I know that OKC is having problems, I want to shop/eat/movies/etc in OKC etc.. but the allure of the plowed roads in Moore as opposed to S. Ice Cap Ave (Penn) which has NOT been plowed (or Western, May, etc), I think I'll go over to Moore.

Being the only north/south thoroughfare in decent shape, I-35 in Cleveland County was pretty jammed all day.

I don't think that "snow route" means anything in OKC..

Hmmm, how was Shields? LOL Hope everyone is safe.

SOONER8693
12-26-2009, 09:30 PM
I looked at the City site and downloaded the regional snow routes. I was a little surprised that they've apparently superseded the City snow routes or I guess that is so.

On the south end of town the City has done a fabulous job on S 134th Street. But I can't tell there has been a plow at all on any of the North-South streets. Beats me why.

The neighborhoods are still really bad.

Beats me what the deal is. In the old city snow route scheme I think South 119th was designated but if there's been a plow on it I can't tell it.

SW 134th is also a state highway. Highway 37 I think.

brianinok
12-26-2009, 09:53 PM
I have lived off of Western and NW 164th for nearly 4 years now. NW 164th / S 15th has never been plowed, salted, or sanded east of Western Ave during that time. According to the Oklahoma County map, it is the responsibility of Edmond to do so. How does Edmond get away with not plowing any of their snow routes? Can't the county or state fine them for not following through on the emergency snow route designations?

rcjunkie
12-26-2009, 11:02 PM
I must say I'm very impressed, there's been 12 postings and no one has blamed MAPS3--yet, there was one smart ass remark about--maybe when the tax rate hits 70%.
I truly expected either the MAPS3 blame or "I bet the Mayor and his rich cronies have clear roads, come on somebody, don't let the MAPS haters down

max
12-26-2009, 11:29 PM
FWIW, I think the city's done very well with what they have. They have a massive area to cover compared to most cities, much relatively sparsely populated, a relatively low tax rate overall, and this was an historic snowfall. So in terms of this, I think the city, county, and whatever other agencies were involved have done a bang-up job to get as much done as they have.

On a tangent, I'm thrilled that I didn't lose power in extreme weather for once.

Spartan
12-27-2009, 03:19 AM
Hmmm, how was Shields? LOL

LOL :beaten_fi

gmflyer
12-27-2009, 04:31 AM
In the interest of going "Green", the city is relying on solar snow removal. They obviously don't want to waste their investment in this new technology by resorting to the old plough and sand methods.

LakeEffect
12-27-2009, 07:31 AM
rcjunkie, you're turning into a troll as bad as the former anti-maps OKCTalk members. Let it go already.

As for the County snow plan... This was a volunteer, combined effort that ACOG put together, not the County or the State. Each city agreed (on the surface) to plow the County plan first. In some cases, it went against what the cities had on their own plans, but in the interest of regional cooperation, the county-wide plan was agreed to. The information I know of indicates that the "Emergency Snow Routes" are old signs and should really be removed... the snow routes are evaluated yearly to ensure that the most critical points are being plowed.

rcjunkie
12-27-2009, 07:50 AM
rcjunkie, you're turning into a troll as bad as the former anti-maps OKCTalk members. Let it go already.

As for the County snow plan... This was a volunteer, combined effort that ACOG put together, not the County or the State. Each city agreed (on the surface) to plow the County plan first. In some cases, it went against what the cities had on their own plans, but in the interest of regional cooperation, the county-wide plan was agreed to. The information I know of indicates that the "Emergency Snow Routes" are old signs and should really be removed... the snow routes are evaluated yearly to ensure that the most critical points are being plowed.

My posting was in reference to some personal messages I received from frequent OKCTALK and MAPS3 opponets members, I've tried to ingnore them but when they turn personal, it's hard to do.

It is great to live in a free Country!!

flintysooner
12-27-2009, 08:22 AM
All the main streets in far southwest OKC were plowed overnight. Pretty good.

LakeEffect
12-27-2009, 08:44 AM
My posting was in reference to some personal messages I received from frequent OKCTALK and MAPS3 opponets members, I've tried to ingnore them but when they turn personal, it's hard to do.

It is great to live in a free Country!!

Ahh, message retracted. How sad that people are turning to PMs to wage personal vendettas. Sorry.

LakeEffect
12-27-2009, 12:57 PM
Ahh, message retracted. How sad that people are turning to PMs to wage personal vendettas. Sorry.

I retract my retraction. I think I was right... all Maps 3 sides need to reconcile and work to move Maps 3 forward properly and also work to fund the Fire/Police needs (not fund pay raises necessarily, but fund the needed positions/new fire stations).

Enough said... this post is supposed to be about Emergency Snow Routes.

Spartan
12-27-2009, 01:08 PM
Ahh, message retracted. How sad that people are turning to PMs to wage personal vendettas. Sorry.

I just thought junkie made an ironic comment. He wasn't rehashing the old MAPS 3 flame wars...sarcastic and witty comments are still appropriate, no?

LakeEffect
12-27-2009, 01:09 PM
I just thought junkie made an ironic comment. He wasn't rehashing the old MAPS 3 flame wars...sarcastic and witty comments are still appropriate, no?

Posting a Maps 3 comment is no longer witty, it's tired and used up. Let's move the discourse forward.

Spartan
12-27-2009, 01:13 PM
I don't think junkie is so much caught on MAPS as he is caught on anti-public safety. I myself am a little annoyed at the unions and the actions of the police dept in particular lately, but I didn't mention any of that during the campaign because I didn't want to make MAPS 3 about being "anti-public safety." Now that my goose is safe, I'm free to express other unpopular opinions I might have. That's just my take on the lingering feelings from MAPS anyway.

TheTravellers
12-27-2009, 01:24 PM
rcjunkie, you're turning into a troll as bad as the former anti-maps OKCTalk members. Let it go already.

As for the County snow plan... This was a volunteer, combined effort that ACOG put together, not the County or the State. Each city agreed (on the surface) to plow the County plan first. In some cases, it went against what the cities had on their own plans, but in the interest of regional cooperation, the county-wide plan was agreed to. The information I know of indicates that the "Emergency Snow Routes" are old signs and should really be removed... the snow routes are evaluated yearly to ensure that the most critical points are being plowed.

Ah, I forgot to actually specify the "Emergency Snow Route" designation I was referring to - it was the one on the front page of City of Oklahoma City | News (http://www.okc.gov), not the street signs. Sorry....

LakeEffect
12-27-2009, 01:33 PM
Ah, I forgot to actually specify the "Emergency Snow Route" designation I was referring to - it was the one on the front page of City of Oklahoma City | News (http://www.okc.gov), not the street signs. Sorry....

Ahh... well, the same rule applies. The routes are designated to give public knowledge, but I don't believe we have an ordinance that regulates them as northern cities do. Some cities or states have laws that make it a crime to be out on the streets unless in an emergency or to be working for emergency services.

bille
12-28-2009, 01:55 PM
I work at Tinker and routinely travel up and down Douglas to and from work and over the past several years have noticed how little attention this "snow route" gets. I've often wondered which (if any) do get attention. Seriously, what's the point of having an "Emergency Snow Route" if the road will only get cleared when they get to it?

Some that have commented here have experienced the roads in Moore and I can speak first hand on how quick they are to act. Moore has contractor (Silver Star) that is on top of things and get the roads cleared quick. Shortly after the snow stopped and the winds subsided they were out clearing the streets. In my experience and from what others are saying about OKC and Edmond I think these other towns need to take some notes from what Moore has been doing!

rcjunkie
12-28-2009, 04:48 PM
Oklahoma City as approximately 30,000 miles of paved road, the Street Maintenance Division has 30 dump trucks, all fitted with salt/sand spreaders and 15 have front mounted snow plows. It's impossible to clear and sand every street in OKC, and to spend the money for equipment just in case we have another storm of the century would be foolish.

LakeEffect
12-28-2009, 05:48 PM
Oklahoma City as approximately 30,000 miles of paved road, the Street Maintenance Division has 30 dump trucks, all fitted with salt/sand spreaders and 15 have front mounted snow plows. It's impossible to clear and sand every street in OKC, and to spend the money for equipment just in case we have another storm of the century would be foolish.

13,000 lane miles of road actually...

Spartan
12-28-2009, 05:50 PM
Oklahoma City as approximately 30,000 miles of paved road, the Street Maintenance Division has 30 dump trucks, all fitted with salt/sand spreaders and 15 have front mounted snow plows. It's impossible to clear and sand every street in OKC, and to spend the money for equipment just in case we have another storm of the century would be foolish.

Isn't that the whole point in having "emergency snow route" designations?

flintysooner
12-28-2009, 05:56 PM
I agree that the City of Moore's snow removal was very well executed on the west side of I-35 where I drove. Didn't go east so have no idea how it was over there.

I'm still surprised at the work on South 134th. Sunday evening there was a private contractor clearing the plowed drifts that extended too far into the outside lane. In years past I think 134th wasn't even plowed. I really appreciate all the good work on it but I am just surprised. It is nice to have all 4 lanes clear, too.

Spartan
12-28-2009, 06:08 PM
I think 134th is starting to build up some high traffic counts, so they may lower the speed limit from 50 mph, but I hope not. I noticed that they recently repaved it when the road wasn't even rough. That tells me that 134th has risen in priority for preemptive repaving before any wear even begins to appear.

okcmomentum
12-29-2009, 07:18 AM
I know this is a bit late in the game but last Saturday we were headed south down Council (which is a regional snow route according to the OKC website) in the NW part of the city and it was treacherous from 122nd until you hit 50th. But as soon as you hit 50th, which starts Bethany road responsibility, it was plowed and cleaned down to bare pavement across all 4 lanes, no snow, no ice. Kudos to Bethany! Yes, I know they have a very small area to cover but they sure got things done IMO. It was nice and clear until we hit NW 23rd and it went back to OKC responsibility and then it was terrible again.

I also heard a news story on Channel 9 I believe on Friday that said city crews were only working on the east side of the metro and they were contracting out the west side. We followed a road grader home back north on Council Saturday evening but they only plowed one lane.

LordGerald
12-29-2009, 07:54 AM
I agree that the City of Moore's snow removal was very well executed on the west side of I-35 where I drove. Didn't go east so have no idea how it was over there.

I'm still surprised at the work on South 134th. Sunday evening there was a private contractor clearing the plowed drifts that extended too far into the outside lane. In years past I think 134th wasn't even plowed. I really appreciate all the good work on it but I am just surprised. It is nice to have all 4 lanes clear, too.

I looked at the route map and South 134th is double-covered. It's a state highway, so it's under both ODOT's and Moore's clearing responsibilities. The way Moore's routes are lined up, it looks like they took their plow street to street until they were all clear, while ODOT probably did a sweep through on Highway 37. Good job to both entities.

Spartan
12-29-2009, 11:13 AM
SW 134th is in OKC city limits from Santa Fe all the way to the Canadian River. Most of the new neighborhoods being built along 134th are OKC limits.

LordGerald
12-29-2009, 01:48 PM
SW 134th is in OKC city limits from Santa Fe all the way to the Canadian River. Most of the new neighborhoods being built along 134th are OKC limits.

That's true. But the designated snow route of S.W. 134th is Highway 37 from Highway 62 on the west to Highway 77 on the east, and the bulk of that route is in the city of Moore.

Spartan
12-29-2009, 01:50 PM
So Moore is the one plowing the portions west of Santa Fe?