Here's a long article by Phillip Reese appearing in Golden State losing folks as old dust bowl beckons | Penn State News | Travel - Centre Daily Times (http://www.centredaily.com/living/travel/story/1344611.html), Golden State losing folks as old dust bowl beckons. The source is located in State College, PA of all places ... here's the version in the Sacramento Bee - Golden State losing folks as old Dust Bowl beckons - Sacramento News - Local and Breaking Sacramento News | Sacramento Bee (http://www.sacbee.com/topstories/story/1944947.html). The article in one form or another seems to be being carried in several papers around the country. It's a nice read.

Thanks for the article Doug!

I now see that the article originated in the Sacramento Bee. That article contains a great 5-minute video. So, best to use this link: Golden State losing folks as old Dust Bowl beckons - Sacramento News - Local and Breaking Sacramento News | Sacramento Bee (http://www.sacbee.com/topstories/story/1944947.html)

That's a great video- some beautiful shots. Better than some stuff that our tourism/chamber folks have put out recently.

that's awesome! because of that article, there will be even more people in california discovering how cheap it is to live in oklahoma and from hearing their fellow californians' testimonials, may want to move to OK. themselves.

Reminds me of the Will Rogers quote: "When the Okies left Oklahoma and moved to California, they raised the average intelligence level in both states."

With that logic, it doesn't bode well if they come back. ;)

I imagine we will treat them much better than some Okies were treated out there.

I've been living in Tulsa, OK for over 15 years, and I've noticed Californians moving to OK since 1996. The # of Californians in Oklahoma just kept growing each year since then. =)

Very cool to see how people from outside the state are starting to view OKC.

But an obvious point is there is almost exactly 10 times the number of people in California than Oklahoma, so there will always be more Californians moving just about anywhere than the other way around. At the same time, the state population is still growing like crazy.

I've never understood the millions that live inland in California; who effectively have all the disadvantages (high cost of living, high crime, bad schools, no rain, etc.) and few of the advantages (recreational opportunities, the coastal weather, the unlimited amount of things to do and see). I often ask them rhetorically: "Why don't you just move to Oklahoma?? At least it's inexpensive there."

I'd rather live in OKC than Sacramento, Fresno, Bakersfield or even the inland areas of SoCal (San Bernardino, Riverside, Palmdale, etc.). And for all the reasons mentioned on that video.

However, there are still many areas of California -- really anything within an hour of the coast -- that are worth every expensive penny and you couldn't blast most people out of there.

Reminds me of the Will Rogers quote: "When the Okies left Oklahoma and moved to California, they raised the average intelligence level in both states."

With that logic, it doesn't bode well if they come back. ;)

Maybe we aren't necessarily getting the same people back...:dizzy:

As a Californian that fled in 1990 I can say it is the best thing I ever did. I look at my kids, who were still 8 years from being born at the time, and my moving out of California is best thing I ever did for them. After watching the video I can give California refugees one word of advice. Stop using the word "like". I know many of them are products of California public schools (as was I) but it is crucial that they learn to use the English language as if it is their primary language.

Pete - you have been living in California too long. There are places as pretty as costal California at a fraction of the price. I grew up at the base of the Sierra Nevada's and on my way to school I could see Mt. Lassen and Mt. Shasta. When I left in 1990 you couldn't even see the foothills 5 miles away. 4 days a week I now enjoy the mountains of North Georgia and 3 days week the beaches of Florida. For what you pay for cost of living expenses in California you can have two homes in the Southeast.

Interesting to see this article.

I was having a conversation just yesterday with my brother-in-law. He and My sister just moved here from Reno (which according to him is "grasping onto California for dear life as California sinks") He talked to more than one family moving here at different stops along the way.

I have some friends that moved to Reno a few years ago. Not a pretty picture. Can't find work, losing their home and now don't know what to do or where to go. Horrible timing to have tried to start a new company there.

As much as I miss CA, I have to echo Kerry's thoughts (never thought I'd say it) but moving to OK was one of the best things we've done for our kids, financially and otherwise.

Yes, I missed out on the huge equity increase but most of those same people who were so ecstatic about a few years ago but those same people now are really struggling. It's pretty sad.

lol about 25 years ago the sacramento bee followed my family with a group of other californians moving to oklahoma tranfered to GM, a lot of my family now lives out here my oldest sister moved out here 5 years ago, my other sister is visiting and looking at houses right now, and my cousins are visiting in july and talking about moving for a better life for them and there kids.. Oklahoma is looking good right now minus the humidity.

My wife is in real estate and she has seen a jump in out of state investors and people moving here. I told her the best way to sell her listings is to advertise them in a California paper. :LolLolLol

I found this interesting in USA today, over the weekend. Especially for all of the Californians and Laker fans too.

Traveling with the Stars: Derek Fisher - USATODAY.com (http://www.usatoday.com/travel/celebrity/2009-06-08-derek-fisher_N.htm)

Traveling with the Stars: Derek Fisher

Q: What's the most surprising/unexpected place you've ever visited?

A: Being in the NBA, you are on the road and in a different city every few days. We have traveled to Oklahoma City, and I was very surprised to find such a sense of community, kind people and was extremely touched by the Oklahoma City National Memorial honoring those who were lost in the bombing of the Federal Building.

Great find!

I have a friend that just moved back to OKC from Austin. He said that a lot of Californians are moving to Austin. Austin is loosing's weirdness, he said.

I have a friend that just moved back to OKC from Austin. He said that a lot of Californians are moving to Austin. Austin is loosing's weirdness, he said.

My friend who has lived in Austin too recently said something along those same lines. I replied to him that it made perfect sense. Austin has that Hollywood B kinda feel, is what I told him.

Yep, there have been a bunch of Californians moving here, much to the lament of some of the old Austinites who want it to stay the same smaller town it was when they were in school at UT and smoking dope. EVERY city/town changes over time, that is the only constant.

The Oklahoman has now picked up on the story: http://www.newsok.com/article/3378178 and http://www.newsok.com/article/3378182, the latter being a truncated version of the Sacramento Bee article, sans video.

they used to have bumper stickers in Colorado in the mid 90's because of all of the California transplants that said


Colaroado sucks, go back to Califorinia and tell all of your friends

Seems like every few years there is a new city of choice for those looking to flee Cali's high cost of living...

Seattle was all the rage for a while, then Portland, Boulder and more recently Reno and Las Vegas. Sounds like Austin and OKC may now be joining those ranks.

ill agree that many californians may be leaving the golden state,.but im not so convinced that the sooner state is recieving a large influx of them.

i know that dallas/ft worth is recieving a large number of them, not to mention that many oklahomans are also relocating to dfw as well. there are many cars with texas plates that have silver metallic OU decals adjacent to the rear license plates.

The city of Lewisville is reknown for having a large Oklahoman transplant populous.

Seems like every few years there is a new city of choice for those looking to flee Cali's high cost of living...

Seattle was all the rage for a while, then Portland, Boulder and more recently Reno and Las Vegas. Sounds like Austin and OKC may now be joining those ranks.


whoa sally...check out your avatar. is that a true scale of how large the new devon skyscraper will be compared to the rest of the skyline? if so, that thing is mammoth. i only hope it serves as a beacon for economic renewal to the area as well.:fighting4

MIREAUX....Not to pop your bubble or anything, but I really believe that there are tons of metroplex people relocating to OKC as well, because I have seen tons of cars driving around the city that have Oklahoma plates, but have the DFW area dealership logo where they bought the car from. I've seen them from Ft. Worth, Dallas, Richardson, Arlington....pretty much every major area around there. Because the Metroplex is getting overcrowded with growth that is too fast, it makes sense that there is a huge influx of those folks moving here. Just something to consider.:)

ill agree that many californians may be leaving the golden state,.but im not so convinced that the sooner state is recieving a large influx of them.
They are and have been for awhile, most of the ones that I have known have been older, those 10-15 years from retirement age who had their house in California for awhile and made a profit on the selling of it. They are moving to where housing is more affordable and they can take a big chunk of the "profit" from the house sale and put it into retirement accounts. Most also have had some family ties back to Oklahoma as well.

whoa sally...check out your avatar. is that a true scale of how large the new devon skyscraper will be compared to the rest of the skyline? if so, that thing is mammoth. i only hope it serves as a beacon for economic renewal to the area as well.:fighting4
Indeed it is. Where have you been? :wink:

At least one long thread in this forum discusses it. My blog article on it is here: Doug Dawgz Blog: Devon Tower (http://dougdawg.blogspot.com/2008/08/devon-tower.html) and construction is supposed to begin this summer or fall, as I recall.

Here's a pic (click the pic for larger):


http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/devon_tower/presskit_06_skylines.jpg (http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/devon_tower/presskit_06_skyline.jpg)

I now see that the article originated in the Sacramento Bee. That article contains a great 5-minute video. So, best to use this link: Golden State losing folks as old Dust Bowl beckons - Sacramento News - Local and Breaking Sacramento News | Sacramento Bee (http://www.sacbee.com/topstories/story/1944947.html)

I've scoured that page and can't find any video content.

Indeed it is. Where have you been? :wink:





Dallas, since 2006.

MIREAUX....Not to pop your bubble or anything, but I really believe that there are tons of metroplex people relocating to OKC as well, because I have seen tons of cars driving around the city that have Oklahoma plates, but have the DFW area dealership logo where they bought the car from. I've seen them from Ft. Worth, Dallas, Richardson, Arlington....pretty much every major area around there. Because the Metroplex is getting overcrowded with growth that is too fast, it makes sense that there is a huge influx of those folks moving here. Just something to consider.:)

maybe they live in dfw, and got them tagged illegally in oklahoma. for a while, there were many who would get oregon plates for some sort of tax benefit. i think oregon did something about it though, cause i dont see that many oregon plates around. oklahoma doesnt require a state inspection like texas does, so there alone would be a benefit to tagging a texas ride in okla.

That's a valid point.:) I think OKC will definitely look more attractive to people wanting to get the heck out of that rat race down there, eventually. I believe there are 6.5 million down there right now, and it will be out of control as the years go by. Every time I talk to someone who lives in DFW(INCLUDING MY PARENTS), all they talk about is the traffic. I'm like.....what else is there to talk about around there? I'll take my OKC, which has character and is getting better all the time, to the sea of concrete and traffic that is DFW.:)

I've scoured that page and can't find any video content.
It is in the 2nd column immediately below the slide show. It's still there.

That's a valid point.:) I think OKC will definitely look more attractive to people wanting to get the heck out of that rat race down there, eventually. I believe there are 6.5 million down there right now, and it will be out of control as the years go by. Every time I talk to someone who lives in DFW(INCLUDING MY PARENTS), all they talk about is the traffic. I'm like.....what else is there to talk about around there? I'll take my OKC, which has character and is getting better all the time, to the sea of concrete and traffic that is DFW.:)
I lived in Dallas from 91-93, moved back to OKC and was there until 2003 when I moved down here to Austin. I had a chance to move back to Dallas in 2004 to work with my old firm (worked there for 4 months at that time commuting from Austin), it only took me a few weeks to figure out that I had no desire to move back to DFW. When I lived there the entire Stonebriar area in Frisco was nothing but a two lane blacktop and fields all around and McKinney was way out in the sticks, it didn't take long for all that to get developed. It's a nice place to visit, but that is about it anymore.

ill agree that many californians may be leaving the golden state,.but im not so convinced that the sooner state is recieving a large influx of them.

i know that dallas/ft worth is recieving a large number of them, not to mention that many oklahomans are also relocating to dfw as well. there are many cars with texas plates that have silver metallic OU decals adjacent to the rear license plates.

The city of Lewisville is reknown for having a large Oklahoman transplant populous.

I'll chime in on the bubble-bursting session here mireaux... during the mid-to-late 1990s when I was in high school in Edmond, Oklahoma, 4 out of 10 people I knew or was acquainted with was from California. Most of my friends were from California... Stockton, El Cajun, San Diego, Mission Viejo... the list goes on.

However, Oklahoma's largest annual importer of new residents is from Texas according to the IRS and the U.S. Census. Likewise, the number one state people move to from Oklahoma is of course Texas. Those are the facts.

whoa sally...check out your avatar. is that a true scale of how large the new devon skyscraper will be compared to the rest of the skyline? if so, that thing is mammoth. i only hope it serves as a beacon for economic renewal to the area as well.:fighting4

Devon Tower... 925 ft. tall, 54 floors
Chase Tower... 500 ft. tall, 36 floors
First National Tower... 493 ft. tall, 32 floors
UMB City Place... 448 ft. tall, 33 floors
Oklahoma Tower... 425 ft. tall, 31 floors
Sandridge Center... 393 ft. tall, 30 floors

Almost twice as tall, but a WELCOME addition to the skyline. It will serve as a beacaon for economic renewal.

That's a valid point.:) I think OKC will definitely look more attractive to people wanting to get the heck out of that rat race down there, eventually. I believe there are 6.5 million down there right now, and it will be out of control as the years go by. Every time I talk to someone who lives in DFW(INCLUDING MY PARENTS), all they talk about is the traffic. I'm like.....what else is there to talk about around there? I'll take my OKC, which has character and is getting better all the time, to the sea of concrete and traffic that is DFW.:)


well..yeah..it all depends on what part of this massive metroplex they live in. some areas have hellaciously congested highways..some dont. some highways are congested in one direction at one point of the day, while the opposite lanes are freely moving.

some of the more congested highways here would be 635/LBJ, 360 south during evening rush hour (north lanes normal), 35E north at evening rush hour (south lanes normal), 121 from ft worth extending into collin county (very congested)

but the difference is dfw is aware of its growing populous and is actually implementing steps into place to accomodate such. i dont see such actions being put into place in okc...not only to plan for a growing populous, but even to maintain its transportation infrastructure for its current populous.

another difference is that okc has the core of its best jobs located within oklahoma city proper while its suburbs are largely residential only, having scant few businesses that pay well in them..which means just about everybody is commuting into and out of a common financial epicenter.

dfw has two key cities: dallas and ft worth where the majority of its jobs are, but in addition to that, just about every suburb here also has major corporations located within its boundaries as well. so, not everyone is going in the same general direction for work..here the flow of traffic is more diverse and the highways accomodate the flow quite well.

the commutes are generally shorter distance-wise, but due to congestion can increase commuting time. but you can always move closer to work too as there are abundant living opportunities everywhere.

thats the key difference.

but the difference is dfw is aware of its growing populous and is actually implementing steps into place to accomodate such. i dont see such actions being put into place in okc...not only to plan for a growing populous, but even to maintain its transportation infrastructure for its current populous.



On the contrary, OKC has a VERY comprehensive plan in place for future growth, and actions are being taken to not only expand its infrastructure but maintain its current infrastructure.

Case and point... I-40 is planned to be widened to six lanes from east of Midwest City to the Oklahoma/Pottawatomie county line.

The I-235/I-44 interchange will be converted from a cloverleaf to a multilevel interchange. The widening of I-235 to six lanes, including reconfiguring the NE 36th interchange is now complete. The next phase is the interchange itself.

The Broadway/Memorial Road interchange is under construction right now to accomodate growing levels of traffic.

The I-35/I-240 interchange will also be converted from a cloverleaf to a multilevel interchange around 2012.

I-35 is currently being widened to six lanes in Norman.

The I-40 Crosstown relocation is currently underway.

The last leg of the Kilpatrick Turnpike will be completed beginning in 2011 or 2012, connecting I-40 with Mustang, OK-152, I-44 and I-35.

Lake Hefner Parkway in 2012 or 2013 will be extended from Memorial to the Oklahoma/Logan county line.

I-35 between NW 23rd and I-44 is slated to be widened to six lanes.

The concrete surfaces of I-44, I-235 and I-40 are being rehabilitated or has been rehabilitated as we speak. I-44 between I-35 and NW 39th is nice and smooth. Plus, all freeways are being restriped with the more visible black-white stripes.

Arterials north of Quail Springs Mall are being widened left and right.

And there is a lot of interest surrounding light rail right now in Oklahoma City, even among city planners.

I would say OKC is taking action on growth, just not out-of-control growth like cancerous DFW.

but the difference is dfw is aware of its growing populous and is actually implementing steps into place to accomodate such. i dont see such actions being put into place in okc...not only to plan for a growing populous, but even to maintain its transportation infrastructure for its current populous.
That's a joke, if that was the case 121 would have been built out before it became a nightmare to get around that area. When I lived there it was Central Expressway trying to get caught up. Part of the problem is TxDOT and the other is the nature of all of the burbs and CoG around waiting until it is a problem and then trying to patchwork a solution.


the commutes are generally shorter distance-wise, but due to congestion can increase commuting time. but you can always move closer to work too as there are abundant living opportunities everywhere.
Another fallacy unless you want to move often or rent. Most of the people that I have known living in DFW lived relatively close to their work at one time, then their offices moved. That is part of the problem of having employment scattered all over. My uncle lives in the Preston & Frankford area, when he bought his house his office was in the Galleria area, not a bad commute as I did it myself for 4 months when I was working up there and staying with him since my office was across 635 from Valley View Mall. Well, his office went and moved out north of DFW Airport a few years after buying his house. He was not happy about that, but he isn't changing since he is a few years from retirement.

I learned that place isn't all it's cracked up to be, when I was in my early 20's I thought it was, by the time I was 30 I had moved back to OKC.

Most of my friends were from California... Stockton, El Cajun, San Diego, Mission Viejo... the list goes on.

However, Oklahoma's largest annual importer of new residents is from Texas according to the IRS and the U.S. Census. Likewise, the number one state people move to from Oklahoma is of course Texas. Those are the facts.

So I'm not the only ex-Mission Viejo resident here. (Go Diablos) While I moved back to Oklahoma along time ago and not specificially for economic reasons it was a difficult decision. I just missed Oklahoma, family, football, and the seasons. Still love OC and go back every chance I get.

Are there any stats that show how many Oklahomans move to Texas and Texans moving to Oklahoma?

Case and point... I-40 is planned to be widened to six lanes from east of Midwest City to the Oklahoma/Pottawatomie county line.

Actually the plan is to eventually widen it to 8 lanes from east of Midwest City to Shawnee.

what happened to the the turnpike going all the way between norman and moore to connect with i-35? we need something to help the south side of okc out i mean moore, norman nad osuth okc is growing really really fast and traffic is a nightmare already heading into the city for work and going home

what happened to the the turnpike going all the way between norman and moore to connect with i-35? we need something to help the south side of okc out i mean moore, norman nad osuth okc is growing really really fast and traffic is a nightmare already heading into the city for work and going home

I mentioned that in the post above. It is still slated for construction, but OTA has that prject a couple of years out.

And there is a lot of interest surrounding light rail right now in Oklahoma City, even among city planners.


Why do you say, "even among city planners."?

The I-35/I-240 interchange will also be converted from a cloverleaf to a multilevel interchange around 2012.


:whiteflag Guess I'll be leaving for work at 6:30 starting in '12!