We haven't had any good information on how our local stations are doing in the ratings lately, so I'm posting in hopes that someone with that knowledge will step up and tell us how things went during March sweeps, and maybe tell us how May sweeps is going.

It's always interesting to see if the changes they make to a newscast have had any real impact on the ratings.

Of course I'm interested in the 5, 6, and 10pm ratings, but I'd also love to hear how the morning-show battles are going.

Morning shows channel 4 hands down and Rise N Shine following on channel 43

5,6 & 10 news in this order Channel 4 # 1 followed by channel 5 then channel 9

My favorites at 6 & 10 are (in order): 5, 9, 4. Although I liked 5 better when they had Maggie Carlo and Tyler Suiters in addition to Jessica.

I've also been watching KAUT 43 in the mornings for something local. I get tired of the same ole stuff from the national broadcasts.

Morning shows channel 4 hands down and Rise N Shine following on channel 43

5,6 & 10 news in this order Channel 4 # 1 followed by channel 5 then channel 9


Is that for March, May, or both?

Is that for March, May, or both?

All the time..

Morning shows channel 4 hands down and Rise N Shine following on channel 43

5,6 & 10 news in this order Channel 4 # 1 followed by channel 5 then channel 9

I could interpret your post two ways; which one is it?

Are you saying Channel 4 is number 1 at 5, Channel 5 is number 1 at 6, and Channel 9 is number 1 at 10?

OR

Are you saying Channel 4 is number one in all timeslots, with 5 and 9 trailing in that order? (If so, then I'm afraid the moon just fell out of the sky!)

I could interpret your post two ways; which one is it?

Are you saying Channel 4 is number 1 at 5, Channel 5 is number 1 at 6, and Channel 9 is number 1 at 10?

OR

Are you saying Channel 4 is number one in all timeslots, with 5 and 9 trailing in that order? (If so, then I'm afraid the moon just fell out of the sky!)

Your second answer is the correct one.

Wouldn't amazw me too much if 4 was on top. I'm not a fan of their news programs and I often find myself in a minority view of what's popular.

I would watch the one with the fewest commercials but they're all about the same, which is way too much. (so I read the paper instead)

I would watch the one with the fewest commercials but they're all about the same, which is way too much. (so I read the paper instead)
Of course, because the paper has so few ads... :ohno:

(newspapers have 60-70% advertising compared to 35-40% advertising in television)

yeah, but ad blindness in print works well, to the chagrin of retailers everywhere. on the telly, you have to escape audio and visual. That's why God led man to create bigger and better fridges with in door beverages and of course microwaves, so you could get what needs got and make it back in time for the program.

Of course, because the paper has so few ads... :ohno:

(newspapers have 60-70% advertising compared to 35-40% advertising in television)

I'm sorry but that's really weak.

The difference is that you have a choice whether you take the time to read the ads in the paper.
And I'd much prefer having my arms worn out turning newspaper pages than my hearing ruined by Billy Mayes shouting about Might Putty. (and after all those TV ads I'd be afraid my brain might turn to Mighty Putty!)

I'm sorry but that's really weak.

The difference is that you have a choice whether you take the time to read the ads in the paper.
And I'd much prefer having my arms worn out turning newspaper pages than my hearing ruined by Billy Mayes shouting about Might Putty. (and after all those TV ads I'd be afraid my brain might turn to Mighty Putty!)
You have a choice whether to watch the ads on TV as well... that is one of the benefits of a DVR or TiVo... and why I can easily and happily fast forward through those annoying ads, as opposed to having try follow a newspaper article weaving through the pyramid of ads on most pages (assuming, of course, that you make it past the front page).

The point is, there is more advertising annoyance in newspapers than on television. Turning off the local news because of their advertising and turning to a newspaper that has twice as much advertising is what's "really weak."

Well if you and everyone else is happy with the TV ads like they are now I might suggest that you prepare for even more of the same. As I remember when we got our first TV (in 1956) the ads were few. Now you get almost as many ads as programming. I watch mostly television from Korea as my Wife is from there and their programming quality and lack of ads has opened my eyes to the sorry state of US TV.

Turning off the local news because of their advertising and turning to a newspaper that has twice as much advertising is what's "really weak."

Well played...

Are you saying Channel 4 is number one in all timeslots, with 5 and 9 trailing in that order? (If so, then I'm afraid the moon just fell out of the sky!)


It's apparently personal opinion and has nothing to do with recent ratings.

It's apparently personal opinion and has nothing to do with recent ratings.

Do tell! I'd like to see some numbers, even if it's just how each station placed at 5, 6, and 10, and some indication of how close it was.

For me to believe that NEWS 9 suddenly lost its #1 10pm rating and fell all the way to third place, after building a virtual dynasty, is very hard for me to fathom.

It would be different if I had seen drastic changes in the stations, but I haven't. If anything, NEWS 9 at 10 is more enjoyable to watch than ever. We have enough people in newscasting that read this board, surely one of them will step up as they have in the past and give us some decent data.

Well, I can't believe it, but I actually heard a commercial for KFOR claiming they were #1 Morning, Noon, and Night! I guess that pretty much covers it! Since they are airing it now, that means they won May sweeps!

Now I know the moon has fallen from the sky.

Someone step up and explain this sudden reversal of fortune amongst the top three!

I wonder if this has anything to do with the early changeover to digital that KWTV did, and I also have to wonder if the same problem at Nielsen that miscounted the ratings might have crept into this ratings period.

It's so difficult to believe that viewers just decided to stop watching NEWS 9 at 10, putting them into last place. For me, the show has never been better.

You have a choice whether to watch the ads on TV as well... that is one of the benefits of a DVR or TiVo... and why I can easily and happily fast forward through those annoying ads, as opposed to having try follow a newspaper article weaving through the pyramid of ads on most pages (assuming, of course, that you make it past the front page).

The point is, there is more advertising annoyance in newspapers than on television. Turning off the local news because of their advertising and turning to a newspaper that has twice as much advertising is what's "really weak."

I completely disagree with that. I don't own a TiVo or a DVR. I watch the news when it comes on - live. The only way I'm going to miss the ads on TV is if I get up and walk away or change channels. And then I take the risk of missing part of the news if I don't come back in time. With the newspaper, I've been reading for so long that I'm really good at noticing only the stories and not even seeing the ads that are interspersed among the stories. In fact, if I'm in the market for something specific, I have to make myself look at the ads. But what I like about the paper is that there is often more room to give more details that the TV news can't cover in a sound bite. I do both. And I find it often takes both to get the whole story.

Newspapers may have far more advertising, but it is far more easily ignored by all readers.

Brad, you're forgetting something: you'll find news in the newspaper, while the television broadcasts are more infotainment at best. If you want to find out the latest slum apartment to be flooded by sewage or see fluff about mall shoppers getting makeovers, by all means, tv is your pick.
If you want to find out what's going on in your community, whether it be business, sports, government, etc., than I'd turn to the paper.
And yeah, I'm biased. But prove me wrong.

Brad, you're forgetting something: you'll find news in the newspaper, while the television broadcasts are more infotainment at best. If you want to find out the latest slum apartment to be flooded by sewage or see fluff about mall shoppers getting makeovers, by all means, tv is your pick.
If you want to find out what's going on in your community, whether it be business, sports, government, etc., than I'd turn to the paper.
And yeah, I'm biased. But prove me wrong.

To be fair, the networks do have small "news" segments where they do VOSOTs over video they've pulled down off of whatever wire they have access to.

Well, July sweeps are about over, so I'm hoping someone will step up and tell us how the local news stations did. I'm really curious to see if KFOR can continue to win "Morning, Noon, and Night" as they advertise. And what in the world happened to the 10pm ratings dominance of KWTV? Their show is more enjoyable from a content standpoint than it's ever been. Camera-work --- well, don't get me started. :-(

If you look at overall programing, whether Jay Leno or Conan O'Brien, the "Tonight Show" probably gives KFOR more viewers. When Jay comes on at 9 and Conan at 10:30 in September it will probably increase 4's ratings even more - Jay appeals to the crowd that actually watches the local 10 o'clock news as a daiy event (and goes to bed). 9 seems to have gone overboard on the flashy scene changes, posing, and weather drama - seems to be all about the personalities and not the news. However, it would be nice if KFOR would stop saying ...News Channel 4 HD. That's just my thoughts on 10pm news, not sure about morning and noon.

If you look at overall programing, whether Jay Leno or Conan O'Brien, the "Tonight Show" probably gives KFOR more viewers. When Jay comes on at 9 and Conan at 10:30 in September it will probably increase 4's ratings even more - Jay appeals to the crowd that actually watches the local 10 o'clock news as a daiy event (and goes to bed). 9 seems to have gone overboard on the flashy scene changes, posing, and weather drama - seems to be all about the personalities and not the news. However, it would be nice if KFOR would stop saying ...News Channel 4 HD. That's just my thoughts on 10pm news, not sure about morning and noon.

Good points about Jay Leno and the lead-in. I hadn't given it that much thought lately, and a ton of news people believe that lead-in is the holy grail of ratings.

You mentioned "weather drama". I think KOCO is the absolute worst when it comes to that. I give credit to KWTV for not opening 80% of their shows by tossing to the weatherman and trying to create drama when there really is none. The shots we get from KOCO where they are standing in the weather center are the most unattractive shots on all of local news, and they are trying to create such a sense of urgency when none is warranted.

I think KWTV has everything it needs to dominate the ratings --- they have great on-air talent, excellent content, and a state of the art set, but the people directing the camera-work need to fired. Since they installed the new set a few years back, I have not seen one show that I'd be willing to call visually stunning.

Their directors seem to think that running the anchor around the set and shooting them from ridiculous distances and odd-angles constitutes great art. I don't know what kind of Kool-Aid these people drank in school, but they should be forced to watch their own shows and see how cold and distant they feel.

The female anchors knock themselves out to be as beautiful and vibrant as possible, even to the point of having dedicated "hair and makeup" teams at each station, then the directors come along the throw it all away by shooting them in distant shots. The anchors might as well just put their hair up in a ponytail each night, wear a sweatshirt, and just throw on a touch of makeup, because the directors are seeing to it that we can't see them anyway.

We need better camera-work from NEWS 9 long before we need Hi-Def from them. Maybe if KFOR continues to win the ratings NEWS 9 will wake up and stop feeding us meatloaf and calling it steak.

... a ton of news people believe that lead-in is the holy grail of ratings. There's a reason for that belief. It's because lead-in IS the holy grail of ratings. It's like a relay race. When you've been handed the baton with a big lead on the competition, all you have to do is not screw it up.


...the people directing the camera-work need to fired. Since they installed the new set a few years back, I have not seen one show that I'd be willing to call visually stunning.

Sorry, but nobody really watches one station over another based on the studio camera work. It's a non-factor, basically.

There's a reason for that belief. It's because lead-in IS the holy grail of ratings. It's like a relay race. When you've been handed the baton with a big lead on the competition, all you have to do is not screw it up.

Sorry, but nobody really watches one station over another based on the studio camera work. It's a non-factor, basically.

I hear ya, but it seems like the stations are shooting themselves in the foot. They kill themselves buying expensive sets, all designed to look beautiful, they brag endlessly lately about the fact that they're broadcasting in Hi-Def (which is for the beauty of the show), they choreograph all the anchor movement thinking that it makes the show beautiful to watch, so someone out there is thinking about the visual art. They hire beautiful anchors (you'll never see a fat, snaggle-toothed female anchor in this market). The ONE thing that delivers all that hard work to the viewers is the quality of the camera work.

NEWS 9 has everything you could want in a newscast right up until they focus the cameras, then they blow it, and they've been blowing it for over two years. And this is why I abuse peanut M&M's, as a way to cope with this garbage! ;-)

I think KOCO is the absolute worst when it comes to that

Are you serious? Not even close. Mike "Harem Scarem" Morgan and Gary "We're All Gonna Die" England are practically built from the same Weather Terrorist DNA. KOCO is the low-key one of the bunch. It was England who got some national ridicule for a particularly asinine, over-the-top, weather terror commercial just a couple of years ago. Heck, I've lived in Oklahoma essentially all my life, and I saw England practically invent the concept of making people terrified of the weather in order to engender ratings from the time he left radio station KTOK AM-1000 to his early days at KWTV in the 70's.

Sorry, but the camera angle business, set jazziness issues are lost on me. I want quality local news. We haven't had that (and, in all fairness, very few local markets have) in a very, very long time, since the analysts and consultants took over and convinced the powers that be about 20 years ago (or thereabouts) that we all want to see Moronic Ken and Barbie ChitChat Under the Guise Of News...

What amazes me is all 3 networks run basically the same damn stories. (almost in the same order) I'm sure theres other newsworth events going on in this town.

Are you serious? Not even close. Mike "Harem Scarem" Morgan and Gary "We're All Gonna Die" England are practically built from the same Weather Terrorist DNA. KOCO is the low-key one of the bunch. It was England who got some national ridicule for a particularly asinine, over-the-top, weather terror commercial just a couple of years ago. Heck, I've lived in Oklahoma essentially all my life, and I saw England practically invent the concept of making people terrified of the weather in order to engender ratings from the time he left radio station KTOK AM-1000 to his early days at KWTV in the 70's.

Sorry, but the camera angle business, set jazziness issues are lost on me. I want quality local news. We haven't had that (and, in all fairness, very few local markets have) in a very, very long time, since the analysts and consultants took over and convinced the powers that be about 20 years ago (or thereabouts) that we all want to see Moronic Ken and Barbie ChitChat Under the Guise Of News...

I like your post Dave. I'm a big fan of creating names with embedded quotes in them, one of my favorite types of humor. :-)

I've lived here all my life too, but I guess it's a perception issue when watching weathermen who are in crisis mode. Last time I thought my house was going to be destroyed, it felt like Mike Morgan had the calmest broadcast. For me, it's Rick "I just can't shut up and return to regular programming" Mitchell that gets my goat. ;-) (See, I told you I loved embedded quotes.)

Quality local news --- hmmm, that's a tall order! I just want to watch a newscast that's interesting, nothing too Earth-shattering, but when they hire great anchors to star in a newscast, the least I expect them to do is showcase them properly. Otherwise, I might as well just listen to radio.

Obviously there are a lot of varied opinions, that's why our stations have different types of viewers.

Anyway, if you want to watch a station that kicks of lot of tail when it comes to journalism, try FOX25. They seem to be the only station that has a long enough show to do a full, investigative story and air it, while other stations run out of time at the 17-minute mark. They have Nick Winkler doing some cool stuff lately pertaining to the Medical Examiner fiasco. I think you'll find it beats other stations airing things like, "5 Ways to Lose Weight Before Swimsuit Season". :-)

Anyway, gotta run. I don't wanna miss Barbie at 5pm! ;-)

Use dvr, and speed thru the commercials.
Of course many dont even know how to set a old type vcr...
The Fowler commercials earn instant speed thru.
and if Soundtrak was still around them too.
FOX25 is a real news cast,minus Andrew Speno.

I hear ya, but it seems like the stations are shooting themselves in the foot. They kill themselves buying expensive sets, all designed to look beautiful, they brag endlessly lately about the fact that they're broadcasting in Hi-Def (which is for the beauty of the show), they choreograph all the anchor movement thinking that it makes the show beautiful to watch, so someone out there is thinking about the visual art.

You're right. The stations DO care about this stuff. But I think they over-estimate how important these things are to the viewers. Newscasts just aren't as central to people's lives as they used to be.

You're right. The stations DO care about this stuff. But I think they over-estimate how important these things are to the viewers. Newscasts just aren't as central to people's lives as they used to be.

The question then becomes, what is telling the stations that these things are important? It it focus groups, viewer feedback, or a bunch of pot-smoking consultants from New York? Somebody had to come up with this stuff, because a lot of it is flat-out ridiculous.

In 2006, NEWS 9 was a straightforward joy to watch. The two-shots were tight and enjoyable, and the close-ups were tighter than they are today. The show felt warm and friendly, and if you tuned in to see your favorite anchor, you actually got to SEE her face (OMG, what a concept!).

Then the FX Group came in and designed an architectural monstrosity that sapped all the warmth out of the show, and the directors lost their minds trying to show off every nook and cranny of that set to the detriment of quality face-time.

Other news stations began to copy what they saw on NEWS 9; I guess newscast directors are more related to sheep than independent thinkers. I still see stations stealing each others trick shots all the time. I trust you've seen the "Parting-shot shrunk into an image of the website " shot on both KWTV and KOCO?

Or how about one of my favorite worthless shots, the double-standing-shot, where both anchors stand on each side of a big-screen monitor to intro a story, shot from the knees up, their faces just tiny blips on the screen. Yeah, that's real quality and warmth! :-( I saw that one last night on NEWS 9, and today on KOCO.

The stupidity of that shot is only surpassed by placing the anchor behind a computer monitor in the weather center (obscuring half their body) while trying to create a sense of drama about the upcoming forecast.

Or how about the one where the anchor walks across the set through the maze of cameras and equipment as they take us into commercial? They're so tiny in shots like that you can barely see them, but the lights and the rafters in the studio are really showcased well! Yeah, I wake up every day hoping to see a good shot of the rafters at the stations I watch! :-(

And I'm supposed to go out and spend nearly a thousand dollars on a Hi-Def TV so I can see more detail in those rafters? Or maybe I can see more detail in Amy McRee's kneecaps in that double-standing-shot? What are these directors thinking? Gimme a break!

p.s.
I just found an article about May sweeps, which is something I wanted to know. Better late than never!

http://stage.newsok.com/kfors-late-newscast-tops-sweeps/article/3371918

I'm a public broadcasting junkie and have lately gotten into the Oklahoma News Report. It's not as sexy and slick as the network tv affiliates, but it's more in-depth. Overall, I prefer the long-form conversations of public television and radio to the shallow and sensationalist sound bites of commerical broadcasting.

The question then becomes, what is telling the stations that these things are important? It it focus groups, viewer feedback, or a bunch of pot-smoking consultants from New York? Somebody had to come up with this stuff, because a lot of it is flat-out ridiculous.


Eh...a large part of it is "we've always done it this way". Another factor is that tv stations are an isolated society. They get incredibly wrapped up into what they're doing and they make the assumption (incorrectly, IMHO) that the same things that matter to them also matter to the viewers. In truth....some of this stuff does matter. But not to the degree that they think it does. One of the things that always boggled my mind is that much of the visual presentation of a newscast is left up to people who really aren't that all that obsessed with visuals. So you end up with people who don't own a camera in their personal life and whose entire experience in composition consists of one class they took 10 years ago in college, determining how to frame shots.

Eh...a large part of it is "we've always done it this way". Another factor is that tv stations are an isolated society. They get incredibly wrapped up into what they're doing and they make the assumption (incorrectly, IMHO) that the same things that matter to them also matter to the viewers. In truth....some of this stuff does matter. But not to the degree that they think it does. One of the things that always boggled my mind is that much of the visual presentation of a newscast is left up to people who really aren't that all that obsessed with visuals. So you end up with people who don't own a camera in their personal life and whose entire experience in composition consists of one class they took 10 years ago in college, determining how to frame shots.

Thanks, interesting points and insights. It helps explain some of the insanity of what I'm seeing! Just last night, I channel-flipped and caught what I believe was Bob Barry Jr.'s last close-up of the show, and it was tighter than anything Amy McRee got on NEWS 9 at 10pm. If that's not insanity, I don't know what is! ;-)

(And Bob looked great in that close-up! Imagine how beautiful Amy would have looked!)

I like your post Dave. I'm a big fan of creating names with embedded quotes in them, one of my favorite types of humor. :-)

I've lived here all my life too, but I guess it's a perception issue when watching weathermen who are in crisis mode. Last time I thought my house was going to be destroyed, it felt like Mike Morgan had the calmest broadcast. For me, it's Rick "I just can't shut up and return to regular programming" Mitchell that gets my goat. ;-) (See, I told you I loved embedded quotes.


Thanks drums :smiley

I will agree that Rick will tend....to....drone....on....forever at times.

The real problem is that each station tries to outdo each other when a storm cloud passes, so if Morgan sees Mitchell is on the air, he gets all twitchy ...then if Gary "I'm Under Contract 10 years after I'm Dead" England sees ANYONE airing something, he has to run to the bridge of his own little Weathership Enterprise over there at KWTV, fire up the Getner, and start cranking out mesocyclone updates....at that point, its deadlock, and no one will go off the air until someone ELSE does first....it gets kinda ridiculous...finally, someone blinks (usually when the sun comes out and everyone realizes they're not really gonna die), and they go off the air.

Actualy, Brady Brus on KSBI does a pretty decent job of just relaying basic warning info without getting too hysterical...just don't watch him enough, tho...

Thanks drums :smiley

I will agree that Rick will tend....to....drone....on....forever at times.

The real problem is that each station tries to outdo each other when a storm cloud passes, so if Morgan sees Mitchell is on the air, he gets all twitchy ...then if Gary "I'm Under Contract 10 years after I'm Dead" England sees ANYONE airing something, he has to run to the bridge of his own little Weathership Enterprise over there at KWTV, fire up the Getner, and start cranking out mesocyclone updates....at that point, its deadlock, and no one will go off the air until someone ELSE does first....it gets kinda ridiculous...finally, someone blinks (usually when the sun comes out and everyone realizes they're not really gonna die), and they go off the air.

Actualy, Brady Brus on KSBI does a pretty decent job of just relaying basic warning info without getting too hysterical...just don't watch him enough, tho...

You got me again Dave, I laughed out loud.

Anyway, in just 3 hours, I look forward to seeing Kelly "Don't Touch My Emmy" Ogle, and Amy "Stop Dreaming About Me Because You Know You Can't Afford Me" McRee.

You got me again Dave, I laughed out loud.

Anyway, in just 3 hours, I look forward to seeing Kelly "Don't Touch My Emmy" Ogle, and Amy "Stop Dreaming About Me Because You Know You Can't Afford Me" McRee.

Now that made ME laugh out loud.

Good stuff, drums :congrats:

(p.s. and don't forget the weather with Gary "Nobody Touches my Doppler" England....sorry, but there are just TOOO many options open with a word like "Doppler...")

I can not stand Kelly Ogle,if given the choice who to run over between him and Mick Cornett i have to pick Ogle, i figured i can bash Mayor Micky on the backover

I've been on here all week complaining about the awful camera-work of NEWS 9, well, maybe they read this board, because the Saturday Jennifer Pierce show was just about everything I could ever want to see in a show. Too cool!

They dispensed with a large portion of the choreography and gave us good, old-fashioned, high-quality close-ups, not just at the tops of the hours like they usually do, but at the bottoms of the hours as well. They pulled in tighter than normal, and gave us those wonderful OTS graphics instead of making us look at a blurred monitor from a distance.

I hope this was not a fluke, a result of the regular director going on vacation or something, because this show rocked, just the way it should every weekend!

They pulled in tighter than normal, and gave us those wonderful OTS graphics instead of making us look at a blurred monitor from a distance.

A small point...a "pull" gets wider...a "push" gets tighter. You "push in" or "pull out".

blush

Lets not forget,truck left or right, tilt up or down or pan left and right.

A small point...a "pull" gets wider...a "push" gets tighter. You "push in" or "pull out".

Ah, so you're trying to confuse me with the facts! Point taken, but I'm thinking of it like "Pull me closer", "Push me away", but if I substitute the word "Zoom", I think we'll be on the same page.

So I like it when they zoom in tighter --- gives me more detail and makes the shot stunning.

Sadly, today the Jennifer Pierce show featured the same just-shy-of-anemic close-ups that I had been campaigning against for the longest time.

I guess the only solution is to win the lottery, buy the station, and make it look the way I want. A 200 pound Oprah Winfrey gets better close-ups than they're giving Jennifer Pierce --- now tell me, what's wrong with this picture!?

Lets not forget,truck left or right, tilt up or down or pan left and right.

"Trucking" is moving forward or backward. It makes the subject bigger/smaller, but you do it by moving the camera instead of zooming (which would be a push/pull). You "dolly" left or right...although I don't think I can recall any newscast director I ever worked with saying "dolly". Everybody says "truck".