View Full Version : Hill, The



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metro
11-14-2008, 07:43 AM
Area bounded by Russell Perry Ave, 2nd Street, I-235 (http://goo.gl/maps/Y2S6v)
owner=William Canfield
cost=$75 million
157 units

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/hillwiki1.jpg
Information & Latest News
2/7/09: Developer must climb financing hill (http://newsok.com/developer-of-the-hill-in-deep-duece-in-bricktown-oklahoma-city-must-climb-financing-hill/article/3344075)
Links
Sales/Ownership at County Assessor (http://www.oklahomacounty.org/assessor/Searches/SubdivSearch.asp?SubDivision=THE+HILL+AT+BRICKTOWN )
The Hill website (http://www.thehillokc.com/)
Gallery

DHXiVdEQ1HA

Pete
11-14-2008, 08:59 AM
Developers hope homes top a hill of downtown OKC rivals
STEVE LACKMEYER
Published: November 14, 2008

Bill Canfield admits he has kept pretty quiet about his contribution to downtown housing. But he says he’s ready to start talking about The Hill, which is the largest of the for-sale housing projects launched to date.

The first 24 residences at NE 2 and Russell Perry Avenue are set to be ready for buyers to begin moving in next month. Another 26 residences are in various stages of construction as Canfield continues his plan to build 150 upscale homes downtown.

"This is really a neighborhood,” Canfield said. "It’s been planned — the view won’t be obliterated by a low-end condo building going up between you and everybody else. The other projects are like outposts in the wilderness — this won’t be like that.”

Canfield said he shied away from marketing because of the lag in getting started — about two years — that stemmed from replacing early subcontractors who weren’t up to standards and site complications that faced all downtown housing projects the past few years.

"It’s hard to give people a list of features, construction quality, and then expect them to really know what’s it’s going to look like,” Canfield said.


Setting them apart

Model homes have been open for tours the past few months, however, and Michael Biddinger and First Source Real Estate have taken up the task of selling the residences. The first phase, which consists of smaller homes between 1,600 and 2,100 square feet, are selling for $420,000 to $559,000.
Larger units of up to 3,600 square feet include one unit, already reserved, selling for about $1 million.

Biddinger believes The Hill has a lot to set it apartfrom competitors — fully finished homes that feature granite countertops, 11-foot ceilings, seven-inch crown molding, wood floors, geo-thermal heating and air systems, and storm shelters.

The Hill also will offer 26 designs to choose from.

With residents set to move in, construction will start next year on a "town hall” that will feature a swimming pool, meeting rooms, exercise area and concierge services.

Canfield and Beddinger said they believe Oklahomans will take to urban living if given a chance to see what it’s like.

http://photos.newsok.com/2/showimage/515131/gallery_photo
Michael Biddinger, managing broker and Bill Canfield, principal in The Hill, stand in a home at 216 Russell M. Perry Ave. PHOTO BY JACONNA AGUIRRE, THE OKLAHOMAN

metro
11-14-2008, 09:01 AM
I'm pretty sure they sold a few. I know someone who has a deposit on one. Now, they may have sold a very low percentage for all I know.

Luke
11-14-2008, 09:09 AM
I'll look forward to affordable housing downtown.

wsucougz
11-14-2008, 10:23 AM
I can't imagine this is going too well for them.

betts
11-14-2008, 10:23 AM
The swimming pool is one thing that sets this apart, but it still looks more like an apartment complex to me. And, they may not be an "outpost in the wilderness", but they're closer to the freeway. I also think the interiors look more suburban than the others, but there will be people who like that. Luckily, there are different options for different tastes.

jackirons
11-14-2008, 10:26 AM
Looks very nice.

metro
11-14-2008, 10:38 AM
The swimming pool is one thing that sets this apart, but it still looks more like an apartment complex to me. And, they may not be an "outpost in the wilderness", but they're closer to the freeway. I also think the interiors look more suburban than the others, but there will be people who like that. Luckily, there are different options for different tastes.

I can agree somewhat, but even then, there are several other downtown properties with pools. Centennial, Deep Deuce Apartments, Sycamore Square, Legacy at Arts Central, Classen Glen are a few off the top of my head that have pools.

betts
11-14-2008, 10:43 AM
You're right. I forgot the Centennial had a pool. In my mind, I was comparing the Hill with new construction of downtown homes for sale, and was thinking of Maywood, Central Avenue Villas and Block 42 rather than some of the older options or rentals.

jbrown84
11-14-2008, 11:29 AM
They look pretty good on the outside, but I agree with betts that the interiors look more suburban. We'll see how this goes.

betts
11-14-2008, 11:41 AM
The one thing I can see people liking more than the brownstones is the fact that the first floor is your main floor, at least in the model. You've got your kitchen, living room, etc on the same floor as your garage at the Hill, whereas at the brownstones you've just got a guest bedroom and entry hall on the main floor, and you have to go up a floor to your living room/kitchen and up two to three to your family room/game room. That doesn't bother me at all, but I can see how the Hill feels more like a regular home to some people.

jbrown84
11-14-2008, 11:58 AM
The townhomes in Block 42 are also designed with the kitchen/living on the 2nd floor. I actually like that better, but agree some won't.

metro
12-09-2008, 09:30 AM
Took these Saturday. Looks like Phase 1 is almost done. The common areas/street entry looks suburban to me with the "subdivision signage."

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3223/3094991921_01b7cb937b.jpg?v=0

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3016/3095833510_903d1d9e28.jpg?v=0

supersooner
12-09-2008, 09:35 AM
does anyone have any pictures of the rear of these?

mecarr
12-09-2008, 12:03 PM
I keep hearing people complain that The Hill looks too "suburban". I don't really see that. Having each townhome attached to the other is not suburban at all. In fact, it is pretty urban. Whether it be urban or suburban, I do think they look really nice.

betts
12-09-2008, 12:49 PM
does anyone have any pictures of the rear of these?

The backs are either all stucco or siding (hard to tell) in a cream color. I don't think it looks good at all, and that's where the common areas are designed to be, so if you're out there that's what you'll be looking at. I don't know why they didn't make them brick as well.

soonerguru
12-09-2008, 02:12 PM
I think this is absolutely hideously ugly. Attrocious. I'll be frankly surprised if they sell anywhere close to the asking price.

soonerguru
12-09-2008, 02:13 PM
The Deep Deuce apartments are much more attractive, actually. The Hill is a bust, aesthetically. Not surprised, unfortunately.

jbrown84
12-09-2008, 02:24 PM
They aren't that bad.

Midtowner
12-09-2008, 02:29 PM
They ain't $250/sq. ft. good though :)

jbrown84
12-09-2008, 02:36 PM
Didn't say that, but "hideous" they are not.

Midtowner
12-09-2008, 02:44 PM
Didn't say that, but "hideous" they are not.

Oh I agree...

If the developer wants to sell them at a reasonable price, we'd probably be interested.

soonerguru
12-09-2008, 02:52 PM
OK, maybe hideous was a strong choice of words. Perhaps "extremely disappointing" would better describe my feelings about them when driving by to get a gander the other day. The design will NOT wear well over time, either.

PLANSIT
12-09-2008, 02:54 PM
This is how you entice the suburban minded. Build it to the potential client's taste. We are forgetting, loads of people like this style. There are endless subdivisions full of it. I don't think it is horrible, but it is definitely not what most other cities are building in their cores.

BDP
12-09-2008, 03:07 PM
I don't think they are that bad, until I remember where they are. This was a great piece of land to use to try and bring a real urban living flavor to downtown and they certainly do not do that. They may be positioned up against each other, but, just looking at them, I don't think they would be out of place on Memorial Road at all.

It would be nice to see a collection of mid-rise to high rise condos downtown that afforded every tenant a view of downtown, while creating more urban density. This space would have been perfect for that. I can't think of a better previously undeveloped tract of land that is left to do this on.

So, imo, the downside to this development is not limited to the suburban feel of the community, but more the opportunity cost of building this on a prime piece of land so close to downtown. It seems so many keep throwing core-to-shore around as the future of urban living downtown, but there really was no reason we couldn't have done it with the assets that were ready for development when these projects were proposed. In light of how developments have been approached to date, I see nothing to believe that core-to-shore won't end up resembling this more than real urban planning. No matter what is put on the table and no matter what people acknowledge would make downtown more urban and commercially attractive, that is density, this is what keeps getting built.

My real fear is that these projects will not be successful and people will point as say, "see, urban living doesn't work in Oklahoma City", when in reality no one has really tried it with new construction, yet, and any chance of a true urban option for people in Oklahoma City will die with these projects that seem to be trying to draw people out of the suburbs, instead of trying to provide an option for people who actually want to live in an urban neighborhood.

wsucougz
12-09-2008, 03:51 PM
Is there a chance The Hill will never be completed? If so, perhaps other small, urban developments will fill in around it and give that hill some flavor.

Pete
12-09-2008, 04:13 PM
The thing I've never liked about The Hill is that it offers absolutely nothing to the community if you don't happen to have a lot of money and buy one of their units.

Canfield's big argument -- one that was bought by OCURA -- was that there were all these highly-paid scientists and physicians at the OUHSC that would love such a development. But of course, it's not close enough for them to walk and there are plenty of similar places to live for a lot less money just a short drive away.

Considering this development is governed by a public body, I'd sure like to know how many units they've sold to date.

Midtowner
12-09-2008, 04:58 PM
What supervisory powers does OCURA have over these projects? Once the lot has transferred and dirt is being moved, is this a public-records matter anymore?

shane453
12-09-2008, 05:19 PM
You could try asking the developers how many units they've sold. I bet they wouldn't mind. In fact, at their website, The Hill at Bricktown - Home (http://thehillokc.com/), they encourage questions and give the number "405-2280-1099." Everyone assumes that anything related to OCURA is a vast conspiracy- let's be serious. Just ask.

I think the Hill is alright. It's made with quality brick and stone construction materials, no two units look the same, they're built to the street, it has a distinct style. Not saying it's the best of all possible alternatives, but it's being built and I think it's quality construction.

Midtowner
12-09-2008, 05:21 PM
Everyone assumes that anything related to OCURA is a vast conspiracy- let's be serious. Just ask.
.

Just about anything involving a public trust in OKC is a vast conspiracy. Bet on it :)

Pete
12-09-2008, 05:23 PM
The developer still has to report progress and abide by the timelines and restrictictions in their contract. I wouldn't be surprised if full ownership doesn't pass until the project is substantially complete.

If Canfield can't sell these units then OCURA needs to reassess the remaining phases.

Midtowner
12-09-2008, 06:08 PM
Considering the unbiased process and deliberation which led to the project's selection, wouldn't we have to be a bit insane to expect that OCURA will suddenly have the public's best interest in mind in its supervisory role here?

Pete
12-09-2008, 06:13 PM
Insane to expect it, yes.

But there's always hope. :)

okclee
02-28-2009, 02:44 PM
After seeing the Flat-iron video, I am even more disappointed in "The Hill". Everyday I drive by I-235 and see "the Hill", I think how cool it would be if those townhomes weren't there. That is sad to say because they are just getting started, but I think that the powers that decided to locate that project there really missed a golden opportunity.

I am hoping that the Hill decides to change things up a bit and for the next phase build a residential tower or something more like Flat-iron or Block 42. Building typical townhomes in that location is a shame and a waste.

I am not normally one to put down a project like this either.

But there's always hope.

mecarr
02-28-2009, 04:09 PM
I am hoping that the Hill decides to change things up a bit and for the next phase build a residential tower or something more like Flat-iron or Block 42. Building typical townhomes in that location is a shame and a waste.


I think you are being a little hard on The Hill. From what I can tell, the townhomes look really nice. I don't see what the big problem is. Each townhome seems distinct with its own unique character. Plus, it'll bring a lot of residents to downtown okc.

lasomeday
03-01-2009, 07:19 AM
I like the variety of concepts that are being built. It will attract different types of people. I do believe that once we get more retail/grocery into the Deep Deuce area that more taller buildings will be built.

The variet all over downtown in residential is nice but a new high rise residential is missing. And I hope that get the Sosa mess figured out soon and let them build the contemporary house and stop slowing development. That is just a petty squabble that is slowing development.

okclee
03-01-2009, 10:23 AM
Maybe I wasn't clear. I am not knocking the look of The Hill townhomes themselves, but I don't like the size of the project (157 units) or the location of the project. I think that a prime location like that, being right along I-235 would have been a prime spot for something with more density and more urban. I can see similar type of townhomes being built in other parts of Okc and they are nice, but really 157 of them. I am not so sure about that.

I know that this project is having financing problems, just like everyone else. Maybe during the down time the developer will rethink building all 157 units and make a drastic change by building a multi-story residence that would really give meaning to the name "The Hill".

mecarr
03-10-2009, 07:55 AM
I heard yesterday that they have stopped construction all new townhomes. Also, of the ones that have been completed, only 10-15% are being lived in.

metro
03-10-2009, 08:22 AM
Yes, as mentioned in an earlier article, construction stopped weeks if not months ago. They are trying to aquire a new funding source.

Pete
03-10-2009, 08:27 AM
Sycamore Square for the new millinneum.

Steve
03-10-2009, 09:57 AM
Don't be so sure.

soonerguru
03-10-2009, 11:09 AM
Don't be so sure.

About what? Sycamore Square for the new millenium?

I'm not really fond of the design, particularly the suburban-looking tower things on the fringes, but I hope this project does not fail.

Steve
03-10-2009, 11:10 AM
I'm not arguing whether it's a good or bad design, etc. But I'm not convinced the project is dead.

okclee
03-10-2009, 11:47 AM
So what will happen now that the project is dead?

Since this was an OCURA deal, can another developer with a new project take over the land?

I know I am dreaming but, I would love to see McDermids group step in and save this project, with rental units mixed in with for sale, and more overall density.

Pete
03-10-2009, 11:59 AM
Actually, The Hill has a long way to go before it even approaches the 'success' of Sycamore Square.

The latter built 118 units, all are occupied and half were sold.


But in terms of being comparatively suburban for their respective eras, not offering any sort of mixed-use (and thus nothing for anyone that doesn't live there) and struggling mightily, these two projects are eerily similar.

OCURA has sure come a long way in 30 years.

Steve
03-10-2009, 12:27 PM
Good points Pete.

wsucougz
03-10-2009, 01:03 PM
I've gone from being ok with the look and layout of this project to thinking it's downright god awful. Another failure for OCURA.

Hopefully it never gets completed and others can step in. Maybe they can leave the row of townhomes across the street from Deep Deuce and just level the rest. I'm not kidding. Reboot.

mecarr
03-10-2009, 01:52 PM
It definitely seems like things in downtown oklahoma city have stalled or slowed down quite a bit. Hopefully things pick up towards the end of the year.

jbrown84
03-10-2009, 05:35 PM
It's happening everywhere. Nothing we're doing wrong.

shane453
03-10-2009, 09:36 PM
I'm really not sure what makes the Hill so bad- Sure, it's 100% residential, but it's tucked on the edge of the Deep Deuce neighborhood, not at its commercial heart (which I believe could emerge around 2nd and Walnut). Urban doesn't have to equal mixed use- though it would help if they added one or two retail spaces and a spattering of more affordable homes somewhere in there. It has quality building materials, various facade designs, and lots that come right up to the street. I think it's a quality development, but maybe not the perfect ideal.

I guess the only thing that really makes it bad is the fact that it has to be compared with McDermid's rejected proposal for the site.

okclee
03-11-2009, 10:08 AM
I just think that the location deserved much more.

The townhomes themselves look good, but I think it was a bad location for them and too many of the same (157 units). That location should have had something taller, 10 to 12 stories. Oh well, it is what it is, maybe someday it will be completed.

BG918
03-11-2009, 10:54 AM
I just think that the location deserved much more.

The townhomes themselves look good, but I think it was a bad location for them and too many of the same (157 units). That location should have had something taller, 10 to 12 stories. Oh well, it is what it is, maybe someday it will be completed.

Still plenty of room in the Triangle for taller, denser developments in the future. All of the area roughly north of 4th to 10th is practically a blank slate with great views and sandwiched in between downtown, Bricktown, and OUHSC.

sdsooners
03-11-2009, 12:26 PM
I don't know the correct terminology but I believe there is an ordinance preventing anything over 4 stories (or a certain height) from being built in the area around Deep Deuce. A local developer said that is why Central Avenue Villas and the Lofts aren't taller.

metro
03-11-2009, 03:40 PM
Also known as height restriction

BDP
12-11-2009, 11:28 AM
What's going on with this "development". It looks like it hasn't been touched in a year.

Steve
12-11-2009, 11:29 AM
Um, yep ....

BDP
12-11-2009, 11:37 AM
Ha. Thanks for the update.

At what point can we send the members of OCURA out to finish the thing or tear it down?

Steve
12-11-2009, 11:58 AM
What - was my last comment too wordy?
Nobody is eager to take the next painful step ...

OKCMallen
12-11-2009, 12:01 PM
What - was my last comment too wordy?
Nobody is eager to take the next painful step ...

Surely it's not demo?

Steve
12-11-2009, 12:04 PM
Alright...
Here's what I know...
Folks involved with all this say the buildings, while open, are not beyond saving, sealing up and completing. But the rest of the hill - well, not sure anyone is eager to sit down and have a talk with Mr. Canfield... time will tell....