View Full Version : MWC has gone downhill



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Thunder
07-29-2008, 08:35 PM
I live in Del City for many years and I still do, Velvetaut. It is a fine place to live. Every city has a bad place. No need to put down Del City. I feel safe living here.

Del City got a WalMart and things is getting better business wise. There are constructions on 29th and Sooner, which I hope will be similar to MWC's shopping centers on 29th.

People tend to look at the negatives, I don't. I told mom about the house that Luke was selling and how I was interested and how Luke taught me some things involving purchasing a house. She right out said Lazy Lane is a bad area.

The apartment that you used to live, Velvetaunt, is Logan Point (i think) and people generally say it is a bad area. Well, I live just across the highway at Eagle Point and people say it is a bad area. I'm still breathing, right? The most problem I have is moronic kids pressing the doorbell and run off. Recently, destroyed all my flowers, which I have none left, except for one saved and given to mom.

Bottom line, every city has a bad side with moronic kids running around.

easternobserver
07-29-2008, 09:44 PM
The biggest problem facing both cities is a housing stock that was built in a half-assed, slipshod manner and then was never properly maintained. The flat top frame houses that comprise the cores of both cities were not made to be 60 year houses, and have reached the end of useful life. Some have been maintained and upgraded, but most have not. Now they are being bought by absentee landlords who are often more interested in the depreciation tax write-off than in putting money into them to ensure continued utility.

Make no mistake - a primary driver for the problems faced by these cities is are federal policies that haveencouraged building interstate highways for intra-city transportation and have kept gasoline costs unnaturally low, thus facilitating a constant move outward in a completely unsustainable manner. Now, these policies are continued by "bailouts" for all of the people who bought houses they could not afford and kept pumping money into a vicious cycle. The losers -- inner ring suburbs that were left with large amounts of rental property, and responsible property owners who bought houses they could actually afford and have paid their bills. Now, all taxpayers will pay for the excessive consumption that has decimated our center cities and inner ring suburbs.

Honestly, cities like Del City and Midwest City have an unfair disadvantage when it comes to continued growth and positive development.

bombermwc
07-30-2008, 07:24 AM
If that's all true eastern...then why has development in Choctaw never taken off? It's the next town out and it's still mostly country land. Same goes for all of the Carl Albert part of Mid-Del. All of the economic development is IN MWC.

Velvetaunt
07-30-2008, 03:55 PM
Intereting posts!

Well, if I were to become suddently wealthy I would come back to Del City and try to turn it around. In my dreams I could see building some retirement communities there (let face it the numbers for retirees in the near future are staggering), then I would buy my old family home, completely re-do it and eventually start buying up houses - fix them up and make them useful for young families to have a decent place to live. But before all that I would start with city hall - make them enforce ordinances that probably are already in the books about home ownership and the responsibilities of upkeep. I would also find a way to limit the amount of rental properties in the city that big real estate companies can purchase and rent out, and somehow make them responsibile for the condition of those homes.

Sigh - if only it were something as simple as money.

Vel

Thunder
07-30-2008, 05:16 PM
They are building a new retirement community in Del City on the north side of I-40, between Sunnylane and Scott.

Velvetaunt
07-30-2008, 07:21 PM
I know about that one, my sister and her husband were in the process of moving in when she died about a year ago. It cost them about $1,600 a month to live there. He moved in but since then has moved to a house for rent for much less.

My sister was a diabetic - had been for 35 years and needed to be where she could get help if she needed it. But, there at the end she was in and out of the hospital so much we knew it was just a matter of time. Anyway, that's why they moved there, for medical emergencies and meals etc. She could not do much by then.

But I do hope more is on the way because there will surely be a need for it soon.

Vel

Redskin 70
07-30-2008, 09:32 PM
Intereting posts!

Well, if I were to become suddently wealthy I would come back to Del City and try to turn it around. In my dreams I could see building some retirement communities there (let face it the numbers for retirees in the near future are staggering), then I would buy my old family home, completely re-do it and eventually start buying up houses - fix them up and make them useful for young families to have a decent place to live. But before all that I would start with city hall - make them enforce ordinances that probably are already in the books about home ownership and the responsibilities of upkeep. I would also find a way to limit the amount of rental properties in the city that big real estate companies can purchase and rent out, and somehow make them responsibile for the condition of those homes.

Sigh - if only it were something as simple as money.

Vel
Vel,
welcome back to Del City.
regarding the situation of the rental homes. By Federal law you could NOT limit hrental ownership. Part of the crisis regarding the rental properties has to do with the sub prime mortgauge institutions. DId you know that you cannot get a conventional home mortgage if you are going to rent the property so the slum lords have to go with secondary mortgages and they have grossly over extended to the point they cannot get sufficient rental income to do property maintenance.

Did you know that Del CIty has an aggressive policey for code enforcement going. In the last three years they have spent $57,000 in public money to condem, tear down, fine, and haul off trash on these rental propertys.

They have also condemned close to one hundred homes for habitation and evicted tenants because of the slum lords.
They budgeted $15,00 just this year for abatement and I understand they are already out of money and need more to continue the process.

In addition they have started a program of housing inspection on rental property's and are forcing the slumlords to fix up the propertys or they dont get to rent them out.

In addition the building codes have been seriously updated to current national standards and the home builders and re modelers are being forced to build them right. The contractors are screaming bloody murder over that.

Part of the problem is the contractor are doing their work on Saturdays and Sundays now to avoid being caught by the building and code officials. That problem is compounded with the property owners being complacient and not getting proper building permits. I know of one instance just down the street from me where a property owner buil an unsafe un-inspected and non-permitted garage in their back yard. They were forced to tear it down.
-
There have been several news articles in both the papers and on TV of houses that Del CIty has condemned and evicted tenants or spent several thousand dollars to clean up one property.

Do be aware of two facts, the Home builders association and the Rental management property's have very powerful lobby's at the state capital and they are constantly trying to change the laws to their benefit.
I am personally aware of a home owner who suffered damage from the 99 tornado. It was to his roof and when he had it re-roofed he did not get a permit nor any inspections. The roof failed on him and upon inspection by the city inspector it was determined that he had severe roo rafter and brace damage from the tornado. So he saved $25 bucks on a permit and lost several thousand dollars on the roof job because there was major damage. I know this as he is a personal fired.
:tiphat:

Thunder
07-30-2008, 11:19 PM
Redskin, interesting.

How much money is the city getting from taxes at WalMart a year?

New constructions is going up and the city will get more money.

easternobserver
07-31-2008, 11:54 AM
Bomber - the development you are speaking of is commercial development. This is part of the overrall problem. Choctaw and Harrah and even out to McLoud (and the same is true on other sides of the metro too - Newcastle was never meant for the type of housing additions going up there) have huge numbers of new houses, all large, all on large tracts of land. This is the unsustainable growith to which I am referring. The fact that the commercial development is happening closer in is only compounding the issue to an extent. In a sustainable community, people live close to where they shop and work. In the OKC metro, we have sprawl. Unsustainable housing growth keeps migrating out, away from the employers and the shopping. This leaves the central city and the inner ring suburbs decimated, with their housing stock left to be preyed on by the absentee landlords.

easternobserver
07-31-2008, 12:01 PM
Dont get me wrong -- sprawl is really a sort of twisted interpretation of the American Dream -- but dont overlook that it is not pure economic reality, and would not be possible without government interferance (building interstate highways, keeping gas prices low, now bailing out subprime mortgages). This interference is hurting our cities - the evidence is clear.

Velvetaunt
08-01-2008, 07:34 AM
Dont get me wrong -- sprawl is really a sort of twisted interpretation of the American Dream -- but dont overlook that it is not pure economic reality, and would not be possible without government interferance (building interstate highways, keeping gas prices low, now bailing out subprime mortgages). This interference is hurting our cities - the evidence is clear.

Yes, I agree easternobserver. It has happened here in Tulsa too. People are moving out of the city (and I don't blame them - like you said - the american dream). As a result businesses are closing, leaving local areas high and dry. Crime becomes out of control and business properties begin to deteriorate. Several areas where I have lived in Tulsa have had this happened to them.

Fortunately, where I live now the city took an aggressive approach to bring the area back up and now the shopping properties are at 99% occupancy again.

Even though I am not an advocate of "sustainable development", I do see that times are changing and we need go with the flow when we see our way of life in danger.

Tulsa is also on the move to condemn houses (mostly in the north). But I can see big business is wanting the property. I have to admit that North Tulsa is lacking adequate shops in this area and needs a shot in the arm development wise, but I don't like the idea of forcing independent land owners out of their properties. I guess there is no good option to the problem and it has to be done at some point.

Redskin 70,

Thanks for the update on the aggressive move Del City is taking to improve things. I am impressed indeed! Perhaps, if and when I do move back, things will be much better. I do hope so!

Eight more years to retirement!

Vel

mmonroe
08-04-2008, 02:14 AM
What about the fact that the largest employer in the state encourages you to live farther away with a monetary compensation?

bombermwc
08-04-2008, 09:15 AM
Eastern - I think you don't pay much attention to the residetnial development in MWC either. Did you know that MWC has one of the higher building rates of homes in the OKC area???? There is SOOOO much being built east of Douglas. AND, they are infilling in older areas as well. Maybe you missed the new homes south of 10th on Air Depot? Or maybe the ones on 15th near Soldier Creek. Like so many things in MWC...you don't see them from the main roads...and they are built that way on purpose. It's observation vs. knowledge. What you see isn't always what exists.

Check the new home numbers over the last say 10 years and I think you'd be surprised. MWC is FAR from going downhill.

Velvetaunt
08-04-2008, 12:15 PM
Yes, I have noticed it too. My youngest sister and her husband still lives in Midwest City. She keeps me up to date on things there.

Also, I think it would be cool if people would think "retro" and buy up the older homes, fix em up and make it a really cool thing for people to do. Recycle is a good thang!

easternobserver
08-05-2008, 08:42 PM
New development is great -- in fact, the type of development you are referencing is quite positive, it gives people a way to live and work in the same areas. Same goes for several new Del City developments. That said, they are a drop in the bucket compared to the outlying developments. Imagine if the money behind those development was being used to redevelop the inner suburbs -- as for going downhill, I never said MWC was going downhill. That said, all of the inner suburbs are feeling the wrath of the absentee landlords and a generally aging housing stock.

dimac01
09-19-2008, 07:31 AM
I have lived in MWC for almost 30 years and I stay because it is comfortable. I didn't have to stay here when my kids graduated from high school - I chose to. I live in one of those low rent (I call it affordable) apartments and it is clean, friendly and I can come home at any time of the night and not be afraid to walk from the parking lot to my door. I know my neighbors and feel safe here. It's small, quiet and nice to walk outside and have people say hello to you not just ignore you. I'm glad we finally are building up the city along 29th but wish they would do something with the empty corners at mw & reno. Why not put in a large book store in either the old wal mart or target? Every city - including Edmond - has its ghetto areas. That isn't going to change. People should really talk to the people that live here if they are considering moving here. It's a good choice.

bombermwc
09-19-2008, 02:34 PM
Remember the hospital has owned Target since it was vacated. That purchase is what spawned their move...otherwise they'd proably still be there. That's why you've never seen any "for lease" signs. Plus if you poke around here, I think I posted the rendering of what the new facade will look like after they start remodeling the place....which they said was supposed to be end of this year.

okcsince1987
11-24-2008, 08:16 PM
If you want to see real crime go to the southwest side of OKC. Come on. MWC is not that bad. From what I've seen it's doing alright but I haven't had a real chance to cruise the streets in awhile since I am living in New York now. Maybe things have got worse but I haven't seen anything on news9.com or anything lately. I remember watching a segement on gangs in that area about 7 years ago though. It looks as if it has cleaned up well.

oneforone
11-25-2008, 03:09 AM
MWC has a top notch police department in my opnion. We were driving down Air Depot near Traub Elementary. A little teenage girl threw a large rock right at our car. We turned around and pulled into Traub to see if she would come back out. Sure enough she did we shot down the road and pulled into the drive of the house she ran into. MWCPD was thier in a matter of seconds.

On another occassion I had to visit headquarters for do my fingerprint cards for work. Chief Clabes was passing through the lobby, he stopped shook my hand and chatted with me for a few minutes. I thought it was pretty cool the cheif of police was not immune to meet the public.

Bostonfan
11-25-2008, 02:25 PM
MWC has a top notch police department in my opnion. We were driving down Air Depot near Traub Elementary. A little teenage girl threw a large rock right at our car. We turned around and pulled into Traub to see if she would come back out. Sure enough she did we shot down the road and pulled into the drive of the house she ran into. MWCPD was thier in a matter of seconds.

On another occassion I had to visit headquarters for do my fingerprint cards for work. Chief Clabes was passing through the lobby, he stopped shook my hand and chatted with me for a few minutes. I thought it was pretty cool the cheif of police was not immune to meet the public.

:congrats: I would have to agree

mmonroe
11-26-2008, 11:11 AM
I've supported the MWCPD monetarily about every 6 months when I get some random ticket. Illegal lane change, Tag light out, etc... Trust me, when they pull you over for some random, not so important, reason, you know the crime rate has to be down. They're bored.


MWC. They are growing, I just wish they built to be sustainable.

route66gal
11-26-2008, 11:18 AM
MWC is fine. Lots of my family live there still and have kids in the schools too, no real complaints. Del City is getting better too than it was 10 years ago, agree. The only complaint I really have about MWC is trash mountain. Can they please stop changing the landscape looking north?

mmonroe
11-26-2008, 11:20 AM
Not to mention Mid-Del schools. They are one of the better independent school districts.

route66gal
11-26-2008, 11:23 AM
Not to mention Mid-Del schools. They are one of the better independent school districts.

100% better than the schools in OKC.

mmonroe
11-26-2008, 12:09 PM
Hands down.

Thunder
11-26-2008, 12:12 PM
Yes, the school district is one of the best. They accomodate deaf students. Now with the state law require interpreters to be at least a certified level 3 or higher, it is expensive to pay them.

Lauri101
11-26-2008, 05:23 PM
(snip)MWC has a top notch police department in my opinion.Chief Clabes was passing through the lobby, he stopped shook my hand and chatted with me for a few minutes. I thought it was pretty cool the chief of police was not immune to meet the public.

I was on the MWC Traffic and Safety Council for about 10 years. Chief Clabes would come to the meetings regularly - the first time I met him, he introduced himself with "Hi, Lauri - I'm Brandon" with that boyish grin. It wasn't until one of the other councilmembers said "Hi Chief" before I realized who he was!

Very down to earth and fantastic C of P. We're lucky to have him leading MWC's finest - and they are.

mireaux
06-09-2009, 05:48 PM
Source?


shattered glass in the residential streets at night should be a valid source. people in edmond are more finicky about the types of automobiles that they think that have to drive.

...and would be auto crooks also know this. foolish enough to leave in parked in the street outside your home and not in your garage leads to a crook's paradise.

ive seen many stories on KOCO, KFOR and various other news stations about rampant crime sprees in edmond.

if youre gonna be a crook might as well go where the gold is at, and edmond has it in droves.

i havent even touched home burglaries either...

Karried
06-10-2009, 03:29 PM
http://newsok.com/crimewatch

I can't really tell... Edmond isn't on this website.

And I can't tell from broken windshields source either.. no one parks on the street in this neighborhood.

I'm just feeling lucky that in 7 years I haven't been robbed.. knock on wood.. maybe the alarm and the dog helped?

bombermwc
06-11-2009, 10:36 AM
You know, actually I would feel safer about being robbed in the Origional Mile than in many of the neighborhoods in Edmond. Mireaux put it pretty accurately. You see a lot of robberies in places where the money is greater. MWC is very middle class average america. Edmond is more upscale and they attract the wrong kind of people because of it. If you're a burglar, are you going to go to MWC where the person may or may not be at home but probably does have an alarm but what they have inside will probably be more average than anything, or are you going to go to Edmond where your chances are that there is an alarm, but the person is at work and their stuff is more expensive?

MWC definitely has plenty nice neighborhoods with large and very expensive homes, but most people just don't know that. And I'm fine with them not figuring it out....it's a nice secret for those of us that grew up there. I was never robbed while I lived there, and no one I ever knew that lived there was. I'm sure there are people who have been robbed there, but it's not like it's a big problem. Now north of 10th.....whole other place there.

Lauri101
06-11-2009, 04:00 PM
I've lived in the Original Sq Mile for 25 years and never had one problem.

Well, ok - I did have a dog come into the yard and steal cat food, but I'm ok with that.

soonerfaithful
06-18-2009, 01:31 AM
My grandparents bought this house in the original square milk in 1964. I grew up in this house and after my grandfather passed a few years ago I'm back.
Having someone in this house for almost 45 years now we have never had anything happen.
Growing up we did have our one druggie house in the 70's. The most excitement then was when the police would do their "surprise" raid of the house. The a couple of years ago one of my daughters cars was parked in the street and broken into. Actually I can't say broken into since it wasn't locked. Other then that we've had nothing.
Looking at the crimewatch it seems we have a little area right around where I am that is a quite area.
I'd have to say compared to some other areas we've been pretty fortunate in our little mile over the years.

mmonroe
06-25-2009, 07:57 PM
square milk.