Hey guys I was hoping to get your thoughts on opening a liquor store in Bricktown? I know it would be risky now, but wanted to get some insight. Thanks!

I think an upscale wine store would be a much stronger concept to consider. Wine tasting, get distributors to host an annual event to which tickets are sold, etc.

Just went to a big wine tasting event at a hotel in St. Louis - OKC could totally pull it off, and would have the added benefit of highlighting local vineyards, etc.



www.unitedstatesofmichael.com

Is there a law against selling alcohol in certain areas Downtown or Bricktown? A dry zone if you will?

I seem to remember something like that, but I'm not really sure.

It depends on what kind of liquor store you're talking about. If it's a typical, hole in the wall, eyesore liquor store, than no. But, if it's an upscale wine store, I wouldn't have a problem with it being in Bricktown.

Karried, there aren't any dry zones downtown. However, the store cannot be built within 200 feet of any residences, schools or churches.

It needs to be an upscale wine store, and whatever you do, be sure and design it in a way that will be able to accomodate coolers and refrigerators for whenever the law changes.

Byron will fight that until his dying breath.

Wow, thanks for all the replies. If you call it a hole in the wall, then yes that was the original idea. I am currently waiting for an agent at ABLE to call me about the zoning restrictions. We were focusing on deep deuce as well as the hotels to keep us alive until more rooftops are completed downtown. The location is off the beaten path so to speak but with ample advertising we believe we could make it.

I'm not a big wine fan so these upscale stores you guys are talking about, is there one locally that I can look at?

There isn't currently an upscale wine store to my knowledge locally, thus an opportunity is there. Check out the web site for this store in Dallas:
Chateau Wine Market (http://www.chateauwinemarket.com/)

I think the last thing Bricktown needs is a downscale liquor store - there are plenty of those around downtown. A bit more creativity and vision, in my view, would be rewarded.


www.unitedstatesofmichael.com

There isn't currently an upscale wine store to my knowledge locally, thus an opportunity is there. Check out the web site for this store in Dallas:
Chateau Wine Market (http://www.chateauwinemarket.com/)

I think the last thing Bricktown needs is a downscale liquor store - there are plenty of those around downtown. A bit more creativity and vision, in my view, would be rewarded.


www.unitedstatesofmichael.com

That place mentions 1500 labels. The Cellar at May and Hefner has almost 10,000.

Bricktown definitly will need a Liquor store.
I agree with the Upscale wine store. That would be so awesome, especially since so many people will be living in the downtown area.

Is there a law against selling alcohol in certain areas Downtown or Bricktown? A dry zone if you will?

I seem to remember something like that, but I'm not really sure.

I could be wrong Karried, but I think the only law on the books is it can't be within 1000 feet of a church, well technically there aren't any churches in Bricktown "a few meet in clubs and coffeeshops, but that's not the church as the primary tenant", so they could probably get by with that. There is a church in Deep Deuce and other parts of downtown, but not a stand alone church in Bricktown as of yet. I agree with the idea above about having an upscale wine shop in Bricktown, I think one would do quite well.

The location is off the beaten path so to speak

East Reno, hopefully.

Is there a law against selling alcohol in certain areas Downtown or Bricktown? A dry zone if you will?

I seem to remember something like that, but I'm not really sure.

I was told once that certain old buildings in the downtown area have deed and platt restrictions that date back to the time the buildings were constructed. I am pretty sure that there was at least one mentioned that had a restriction against selling any kind of alcohol. I don't know of any specifics relating to Bricktown but I suppose it surely could be a concern.

I have thought through the Bricktown liquor store thing a few times. The thing that would worry me is that it is going to be an instant vagrant magnet. Many of them might end up being good customers -- but no one else is going to want to come near the place if that is all they see every time they stop by. So I'd spend some time thinking about how to deal with the uniqueness of your clientèle down there.

I have thought through the Bricktown liquor store thing a few times. The thing that would worry me is that it is going to be an instant vagrant magnet. Many of them might end up being good customers -- but no one else is going to want to come near the place if that is all they see every time they stop by. So I'd spend some time thinking about how to deal with the uniqueness of your clientèle down there.

Sell expensive stuff.

Or only sell the Mad Train and PBR out the back door.

Overhead and realistic accessability should be your biggest concerns. The margins for liquor stores are very small on the decent to good quality spirits. Escpecially when you are competing with Byron's just up the street. I looked at putting one in the storefronts at the Legacy downtown (that entire property is for sale for the bargain price of $45-million). Decided against it when they wouldn't budge on the rent and parking was a joke.

Tastings are great social events, but they historically do not mean much in revenue for the store owner except for a small spike that day/evening.

'Out of the way' means budgeting for a year of nobody knowing where you are.

And yes, you will attract vagrants. But, if you are strict with them, they will either behave or go elsewhere.

I would start VERY small. Hole in the wall is fine as long as it is clean and neat and allows for expansion. These guys will talk you into a high end wine and spirits and you'll be writing a check for $100,000 in inventory that is not going to turn over very fast.

Deep deuce is fun, but not my first choice.

I'd look to automobile alley area.

Stick it out long enough and don't go overboard and most liquor stores survive and some even thrive.

I agree with the Auto Alley idea. I think a nice shop like Seasonal Cellars would attract a lot of people on their way home to Edmond via the Broadway Extension. Plus it would be close enough for the people moving into the Triangle District to walk to.

I have thought through the Bricktown liquor store thing a few times. The thing that would worry me is that it is going to be an instant vagrant magnet. Many of them might end up being good customers -- but no one else is going to want to come near the place if that is all they see every time they stop by. So I'd spend some time thinking about how to deal with the uniqueness of your clientèle down there.

it hasn't hurt Byron's business.

I have thought through the Bricktown liquor store thing a few times. The thing that would worry me is that it is going to be an instant vagrant magnet. Many of them might end up being good customers -- but no one else is going to want to come near the place if that is all they see every time they stop by. So I'd spend some time thinking about how to deal with the uniqueness of your clientèle down there.


Hire them as clerks .. kill two birds with one stone and do a great communtiy service!

Hire them as clerks .. kill two birds with one stone and do a great communtiy service!

Riiiiiiggggghhhhttt! You do that, then get back to us with your "Going out of business sale."


it hasn't hurt Byron's business.

Not really a fair statement. Byron's is the Wal-mart of liquor stores in the area. Vagrants stick out even worse in much smaller locations. Not so much of a problem when they are customers, more so when they stand outside and beg for change so they can go inside and buy some Kentucky Deluxe.

Also, have you seen the commandos Byron's has working the front door?

I have thought through the Bricktown liquor store thing a few times. The thing that would worry me is that it is going to be an instant vagrant magnet. Many of them might end up being good customers -- but no one else is going to want to come near the place if that is all they see every time they stop by. So I'd spend some time thinking about how to deal with the uniqueness of your clientèle down there.

The location is directly across from the police substation so I'm pretty sure this wont be a problem. Hope so anyways!


Overhead and realistic accessability should be your biggest concerns. The margins for liquor stores are very small on the decent to good quality spirits. Escpecially when you are competing with Byron's just up the street. I looked at putting one in the storefronts at the Legacy downtown (that entire property is for sale for the bargain price of $45-million). Decided against it when they wouldn't budge on the rent and parking was a joke.

Tastings are great social events, but they historically do not mean much in revenue for the store owner except for a small spike that day/evening.

'Out of the way' means budgeting for a year of nobody knowing where you are.

And yes, you will attract vagrants. But, if you are strict with them, they will either behave or go elsewhere.

I would start VERY small. Hole in the wall is fine as long as it is clean and neat and allows for expansion. These guys will talk you into a high end wine and spirits and you'll be writing a check for $100,000 in inventory that is not going to turn over very fast.

Deep deuce is fun, but not my first choice.

I'd look to automobile alley area.

Stick it out long enough and don't go overboard and most liquor stores survive and some even thrive.

bailjumper - Thanks for your thoughts! Here is where i'm at so far.

Location wise we have a go from ABLE, the zoning commision as well as the Bricktown association.

We are currently negotiating rent. For Bricktown I believe it is very reasonable. Parking is our only issue, but I live in BT and would much rather drive around and look for a parking spot than drive to Byrons, Hopefully other people will as well.

For advertising we are planning a very heavy campaign for the first year.

In terms of it being a hole in the wall. I am very into appearance so it is going to be very modern. Hopefully you guys approve.

And to everybody who would like to see a high end wine market. This project is just going to be something to keep me busy. We will carry high end inventory but I believe catering only to that market would be over my head. Besides that I cant even tell the difference from a $10.00 bottle of wine compared to a $1000.00 bottle :tiphat:

Please keep the comments coming and I will keep you all updated!

It needs to be an upscale wine store, and whatever you do, be sure and design it in a way that will be able to accomodate coolers and refrigerators for whenever the law changes.

I searched on this but couldnt find anything. What law are you referring to?

I am wondering how long it will be before a strip club comes to Bricktown?

I am wondering how long it will be before a strip club comes to Bricktown?

"They" have tried hard to get in. One of the most successful owners owns a building in Bricktown.

There is no way the city will allow it.

"They" have tried hard to get in. One of the most successful owners owns a building in Bricktown.

There is no way the city will allow it.


I do not think the city's power has anything to do with it, I think nobody in the area has the tenacity, money and legal representation to fight the city.

I do not think the city's power has anything to do with it, I think nobody in the area has the tenacity, money and to fight the city.

Honestly, I know of what I speak.

The city has all the control it needs through zoning and licensing.

It certainly is not a matter of money and legal representation .

Good luck! Please think long and hard before committing to the location you speak of. Also, make sure your advertising budget is something you don't need to recover quickly. Most people actually in the liquor retail business will tell you it's all about location. Advertising in this industry is expensive compared to the return. Just for giggles, do yourself a favor and check prices and parking in Automobile Alley. Keep us updated!

bailjumper- please check your pm..

bailjumper- please check your pm..

DONE

viet-my-

Let us know whent it goes up. I'll throw a few bucks you way. Also, and this may have already been said, but check out places like Byron's or Joes in Norman. They sell liquor and beer at very competitive prices. Usually 2-4 bucks less per name brand. It's not a huge saver, but subconcsiously you think it's a great deal.

Sell expensive stuff.

Or only sell the Mad Train and PBR out the back door.

Nice.

I cannot stop laughing at the mental image I have of this.

Liqour stores close at 9. Alot of traffic doesn't come in until after that. That right there is very limiting as far as customers go.

Whoever has a liqour store in bricktown will have to have another business. The liqour store will probably just have to be a side thing for awhile.

And no one has mentioned the other things. When the customer buys the liqour will they have to walk back to their car to put it away because I sure don't think restaraunts will let customers walk in with their own liqour. And when they do take it back to their car do we see an increase in car break-ins (to get the liqour)? And the cops. Do they hang out by the liqour store and harrass patrons?

Liqour stores are too limited right now to support themselves in a high rent area like Bricktown. When Oklahoma gets higher point beer and sells them in the liqour stores then I think you might have a chance. But not now.

Since I'm planning on moving to the area, I'm excited about the idea of being able to pick up a bottle of wine nearby. Easy parking is a necessity, but hopefully there will be enough residents downtown soon to help make this a sucessful operation.

What is wrong with Byrons at 23rd and broadway??

Nothing wrong with competition. As I live downtown, if I needed wine or something, I'd probably go here as it's closer than Byron's.

OKCNDN, I don't think this would be marketing to people that are down there to eat, but mostly to people that live in Deep Deuce, The Centennial, and all the other housing developments going up.