View Full Version : Sonics Count Down



Kerry
10-01-2007, 03:22 PM
Can we get a Sonics count down inserted in the header at the top of the page?

PUGalicious
10-01-2007, 03:40 PM
Countdown to what? Counting the chickens before the eggs hatch?

Kerry
10-01-2007, 04:14 PM
Counting down to Oct 31. Have you not been paying attention? Just kidding on that last comment but I think everyone in OKC and Seattle knows they have to have an arena deal in place by Oct 31 or Bennett will apply for relocation. And yes I know he said he would hold off on the filling but he didn't change the deadline.

PUGalicious
10-01-2007, 04:22 PM
I just don't think anyone should get too confident about a move until David Stern weighs in. To me, Oct. 31st is just one more hurdle in a road with lots of hurdles and pitfalls.

Karried
10-01-2007, 04:33 PM
I think after what happened with the Hornets, we all are a bit jaded about Pro Sports.

At least I am anyway.

OU Adonis
10-01-2007, 04:40 PM
Can we get a countdown to at least the big legal fight? :)

I have no doubt we will file, which is more than what the hornets did.

betts
10-01-2007, 05:27 PM
I think after what happened with the Hornets, we all are a bit jaded about Pro Sports.

At least I am anyway.

I'm not the least bit jaded. It's no fun to have to go through the highs and lows of teams staying, not staying, moving, not moving, but I am incredibly eager to have our own team, and I'm not that picky about which team it is. I'm not counting my chickens, but I'll be first in line to buy season tickets if we get a team.

Pete
10-01-2007, 05:42 PM
How about once they have officially stated their move to OKC (and it's been approved) that we do a countdown to when they actually arrive in town or play their first game?? :)

SouthsideSooner
10-01-2007, 09:16 PM
I just don't think anyone should get too confident about a move until David Stern weighs in. To me, Oct. 31st is just one more hurdle in a road with lots of hurdles and pitfalls.


Considering the events that have led us to this point, there is no reason to believe that Stern or the BOG will support Seattle unless they agree to build an arena with lease terms that Bennett is willing to except.

It's funny reading thier message boards, especially Brians blog on the SOS website.They think their kicking Clays ass and in truth he holds all the cards.

They either build the arena he wants with the lease terms he wants or the team is leaving. Everything else is just a side show.

Matt
10-01-2007, 11:02 PM
How about once they have officially stated their move to OKC (and it's been approved) that we do a countdown to when they actually arrive in town or play their first game?? :)

Seconded.

This is nowhere close to being a done deal. Methinks some folks are just setting themselves up for a disappointment with this thing.

PUGalicious
10-02-2007, 05:00 AM
Seconded.

This is nowhere close to being a done deal. Methinks some folks are just setting themselves up for a disappointment with this thing.
:congrats: :congrats: :congrats:
That's been my point all along. Some in OKC are talking like it IS a done deal. There are still some hurdles to get past.

No one knows for sure what David Stern is thinking and all the politicking going on behind the scenes. Tradition weighs heavily in this whole scenario and I think it is conceivable that Seattle despite itself could possibly salvage the team. Despite what the naysayers and head-in-the-sanders may believe, it is a possibility the Sonics will never move.

Personally, as I've watched the ownership group bully the City of Seattle around, I've grown increasingly wary about what our desperate city government is going to give away to get them to come here and what it will cost this city in the long run.

metro
10-02-2007, 07:41 AM
How about once they have officially stated their move to OKC (and it's been approved) that we do a countdown to when they actually arrive in town or play their first game?? :)

I agree. I think this thread is a waste of time and makes OKC look bad. Just think if folks from Seattle or elsewhere in the nation are viewing this thread (happened before with the McClendon incident) how it makes us look. It confirms the stereotype of the few Oklahomans and fake Oklahomans who are ripping Seattle apart on the message boards. Let's quietly sit back and watch until a final decision has been made. Keep in mind, we were never promised the Hornets as some of you seemed to indicate. Yes, George Shinn is two-faced but everyone knew that already. We all know he'd of kept the team here if it was up to him, but the politics and politically correctness of the NBA forced him to go back to NOLA or it would have been a PR nightmare. We were never promised them and they were never our permanent team and we should respect that. Let's wait for our own permanent team before we get our panties in a wad.

HOT ROD
10-03-2007, 01:03 AM
I dont think it is bad for OKC to get excited about getting a team and certainly nobody will think bad of OKC just because there is a countdown or whatever on a OKC message board. And if they do, who cares???

Just like Seattle fans have a right to vent on the Seattletimes boards so should OKC people celebrate or whatever on OKCTalk. Sometimes I think you guys get way too caught-up on morality and/or what people think which usually ends up on OKC losing out.

think if Seattle were on the other shoe, would/do they care about what other people think??? The ONLY care if you agree with them.

Kerry (and others) can attest to this.

As for the lawsuits and such, those ARE sideshows which are meaningless. When Clay is ready to move the team, he will do so and there is nothing nobody aside from the NBA can do about it. And, judging from the 'non-action' of the NBA and David Stern's lack-of-siding-with-Seattle, it is a foregone conclusion that OKC is going to get the Sonics - unless an arena deal is in place by months end.

The ball is in Seattle's court until then, and I can tell you all of this legal this and that just undershadows the real issue like Kerry said - we AINT building a new arena for the NBA. So the Sonics are going to move to OKC!!!

Im not saying OKC should count your chickens before they hatch, but I am saying get excited and support your city's efforts to become a major league city (and drop the morality crap a bit/fight for what you want!!!!!!).

One. Two. Three. EVERYBODY!!!

28 DAYS LEFT!!!

betts
10-03-2007, 07:04 AM
For the lawyers here, this is an interesting turn of events. This is from an article in today's Seattle Post-Intelligencer:

City counters Sonics' motion to halt lawsuit (http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/basketball/334022_arena03.html)

"The city filed a lawsuit against the Sonics on Sept. 24, seeking to prevent arbitration and instead have a judge rule on whether the team is bound by the lease to fulfill its final three seasons at the Seattle Center site. Monday's motion by the Sonics raised questions about ambiguous terms in the lease, specifically a clause on "limitation of judicial relief" that appears to run counter to a prior clause outlining which disputes can be solved in court instead of arbitration.

The city's counter-motion attempts to dismiss that confusion by saying the "core promise" of the lease was to have the Sonics play at KeyArena for at least a 15-year period ending in 2010, which is why both sides agreed to exclude from arbitration any disputes over the basic issue of the length of terms.

The city says the ambiguous clause was clearly a mistaken paragraph left in during the rush to get the original lease approved by the City Council in 1994.

To support that claim, the city introduced a lengthy explanation from Gordon Davidson, the lawyer who initially drew up the lease for the city.
"In this hasty exchange of drafts to obtain City Council approval and begin construction, the parties mistakenly overlooked the fact that the 'Limitation on Judicial Relief' clause -- a holdover from the earliest draft, before the parties added specific exceptions to arbitration -- no longer made sense and no longer reflected the intent of the parties to exclude certain disputes from arbitration," the motion says."

Karried
10-03-2007, 07:10 AM
"In this hasty exchange of drafts to obtain City Council approval and begin construction, the parties mistakenly overlooked the fact that the 'Limitation on Judicial Relief' clause -- a holdover from the earliest draft, before the parties added specific exceptions to arbitration -- no longer made sense and no longer reflected the intent of the parties to exclude certain disputes from arbitration," the motion says."


And they say 'we' aren't playing fair?

Intrepid
10-03-2007, 07:45 AM
And they've known about this "mistake" since 1994? And never tried to correct it in 13 years?

Midtowner
10-03-2007, 08:03 AM
I think it all depends on the intent of the parties. There's not enough information in the article to even begin to guess as to what that might have been.

PUGalicious
10-03-2007, 08:31 AM
It's sloppy contract work nonetheless, especially for such a major transaction.

Karried
10-03-2007, 08:53 AM
I agree with that.

Frankly, I think if the Sonics make it here to OK, it will be nothing short of a miracle.. but I like to dream anyway.

We just really don't know what will happen.. but Oct. 31st should give us a much better idea of what to expect.

HOT ROD
10-03-2007, 11:43 PM
Karried, your dreams will come true, Im afraid :)

This 'example' of the blunders in the lease accurately depict Clay Bennett's superiour position here. The city of Seattle is just plain STUPID and they are doing this ONLY to placate Sonics fans. Enforcing this 'horrible' lease is ridiculous, but in doing so - it is in Bennett's favor anyways. Surely, this will not make it in court and the arbitrators will rule in CB's favor.

CB did Seattle a favour by staying in Seatle for 2007-2008. Next Season, look for the Sonics (or a name change) to be playing in downtown Oklahoma City - that's for sure!

Midtowner
10-04-2007, 07:27 AM
What hasn't really been mentioned here is the fact that in almost every jurisdiction, when cash damages are available as a remedy, equitable relief (i.e., telling someone to do something or not to do something) won't work. Equitable relief forcing someone to perform a job is almost never granted.

Unless the Washington courts can manage some magnificent home cookin', I don't think there's a chance in Hades that they can ask for specific performance on the lease.

I've never, ever heard of equitable relief of that nature being granted -- forcing a tenant to remain in a building they don't want to be in and perform a job they're not interested in doing.

It is slightly worrisome to me that the Washington judges may be swayed by the fact that there could be political consequences for an unfavorable ruling. I also find it worrisome that most arbitrators are not bound to actually use the law in forming their opinions.

Other than that, I give OKC decent odds.

HOT ROD
10-05-2007, 01:28 PM
I agree Midtowner.

Funny thing is, fallout from the community would be minimal - since most of us want the Sonics to "just leave already."

It is the 'slick' politicians in city hall who are trying to placate the Sonics fans, so they will show up at the polls. This is the ONLY reason why this all is happening, a tick-for-tack "legal" battle where the city is acting like it is 4 years old so the "idiotic/malliable" voters will REMEMBER that the council "tried."

Clay Bennett has acted like a businessman throughout this thing. Only one fault I have is that he rarely showed up and pitched anything, but I dont blame him - he lives in OKC and if we (Seattle) really wanted the team - it shouldn't have been too hard to make it happen:

given our 1) population, 2) market 3) economy, 4) history, 5) Bill Gates ... .... blah blah blah - all of these things Sonics fans keep BRAGGING about as superiour to OKC. I can't wait for little ole 1.3M OKC to finally wip the pants off of Seattle and give the city (and those idiot elitists) a HUGE reality check!!! It will do us (Seattleites) some good - we're not ENTITLED to anything, you have to want it.

OKC, please show (scratch that), ... remind us the way!