You know, I have been to many big cities and all have their share of panhandlers, so I'm relatively used to this type of thing. But the thing that really surprises me is how aggressive the panhandlers in Bricktown are. On a recent trip downtown a friend and I were hit up for money several times, and one guy in particular was really annoying. Up in our faces, following us around for a long time and would not leave us alone. Seriously, I was about to take a swing at him when he finally decided to move on.

I read in the paper today that the city is considering putting more police downtown. If anyone from the police force is reading this, please do this. Panhandlers I don't mind, but the kind of stuff like I mentioned above crosses the line and almost everyone I know who frequents Bricktown establishments thinks or at least perceives an increase in these kinds of incidents.

I have actually been considering moving downtown but no way am I doing that now until they take care of this problem.

We were hit up at the Valero on Classen and I-40 Saturday afternoon when leaving to go to Broken Bow...one guy in a wheelchair and his buddy.

"Man, our friends just stranded us here, you know? We need to get a ticket back to Tulsa, man...man...man..." and on and on it went...we just sat there, silent.

Finally, hubby said, "You know, every time I come to this gas station, I get hit up for money." (this is not an exaggeration)

"Man, those guys are the ones that give us good guys a bad name, man..."

Hubby got in the car, and for a second I thought we were going to hit wheelchair guy.

Another wheelchair guy goes around downtown but when he wants to catch up with you, he'll push with his foot. He had "the angle" on us on St. Patty's day...we hopped into a parking garage that he couldn't get up into without leaving the wheelchair!

They are annoying, and pushy, and relentless. I understand that sometimes life is hard, and that not everyone has it as good as me...but if you're in a wheelchair, most likely you are eligible for some benefits. Use them to your advantage and get back on your feet. Pun intended.

More police, please.

Let me tell you about my recent panhandler experience.

For two days in a row, as I came up to a certain intersection near downtown, I was approached by not one, but as many of 3-4 panhandlers. They were in the middle of the street, disrupting traffic and putting their hand out to everyone to try and make them feel obligated to give them money.

Oh, wait a minute, those were firefighters!


I don't care who's is begging on the corner (firefighter or homeless bum), I think it should stop.

Isn't there an ordinance that was recently passed to prevent aggressive panhandling?

We made a short film about this in a speech class a few years ago. The idea was to place them in a cardboard city and let them use aluminum cans as currency. It was pretty funny except the long speaking parts that were required.

Being a big beer fan myself I gladly hand them over a couple of bucks to help them get that 40 they have been dreaming of all morning

I think it has gotten worse in Bricktown as well. A few weeks ago, several friends and I were chatting right outside Bricktown Brewery after we ate. While my friend is talking, this guy comes up and just stands there, like he's part of our "circle". Finally he gets a word in and says he needs money for food. I had already given my change to another homeless man, but everyone else in my group offered a dollar or so.

So the guy holds up both hands with all the bills we just gave him and says that its not enough. YES, you heard that right. Apparently it wasn't enough for a footlong combo meal at Sonic. We told him that that was all we were giving him and that he could definitely get some food for that. After standing there for a couple more minutes, he finally walked away.

The only time a panhandler was more aggressive with me was in the East Village in New York.

One time my dad was in Philadelphia and a man asked him for some money. My dad doesn't give money but will buy food for people, and he offered as such. The guy said he didn't want food and asked again for money. My dad said he would only buy food. So they guy's like, "man, don't judge. Don't judge."

With as many safety nets and opportunities as there are, homelessness in today's world is a choice. One might not "choose" homelessness, but one does choose not to go for that last fast food job and an efficiency apartment before they lose everything.. they choose to do drugs, alcohol that they cannot afford.

Basically, I figure I owe them nothing, there's always the Jesus House. If someone really wants it, I think they can get off the streets.

With as many safety nets and opportunities as there are, homelessness in today's world is a choice. One might not "choose" homelessness, but one does choose not to go for that last fast food job and an efficiency apartment before they lose everything.. they choose to do drugs, alcohol that they cannot afford.

Basically, I figure I owe them nothing, there's always the Jesus House. If someone really wants it, I think they can get off the streets.

Agree! Amost daily in the classified 7-11 and Hobby Lobby advertise $9.00 jobs with benefits . The first requires basic math skills, the second is entry level warehouse work. Jobs are available.

I forget if I posted this or not, but during the Big XII Championships I was in downtown and Bricktown every day...

I'd get hit up by the same 'bum' every single day. He had no idea he was telling the same made up story to me over and over again. I finally told him on the last day that he'd come up to me the past 4 days... he walked away.

Started off by saying "Hey man, I'm not homeless or a bum, our car just broke down and we're trying to get back to (insert town name here, it changed every day)...."

Started off by saying "Hey man, I'm not homeless or a bum, our car just broke down and we're trying to get back to (insert town name here, it changed every day)...."

Sounds like a guy that came up to me at the Myriad Gardens during the day time a couple weeks ago. His car battery blew up all over him. Sound familiar? LOL

We had another encounter with a homeless guy the same day at the Myriad Gardens. Really seems like they have gotten aggressive, but I guess they go where the crowds are, and it was busy down there that day.

Sounds like a guy that came up to me at the Myriad Gardens during the day time a couple weeks ago. His car battery blew up all over him. Sound familiar? LOL

We had another encounter with a homeless guy the same day at the Myriad Gardens. Really seems like they have gotten aggressive, but I guess they go where the crowds are, and it was busy down there that day.

It was his serpentine belt and Auto Zone had it for $?.?? haha

Said the car broke down on Broadway Extention -- why are you hitting me up outside the Reniassance Hotel, Santa Fe Garage, Skirvin, or wherever else...?

It is annoying, and the police need to make sure people aren't harrassed. However, keep in mind that many homeless are mentally ill or suffer from addiction. Giving them money often just helps them feed the addiction, they need serious help from shelters/support systems, not cash. The community relations police officer assigned to downtown is Sergeant LoRuse, you can call him at 316.4525.

That's why normally we will only give them food.

It's really quite sad, I've been looking at the previous comments and until you've seen someone struggle with addiction close to you, you just really can't understand it. Most people think it's a "choice", the first time or two may have been but addiction is a terrible, terrible thing.

Are you saying that the begging is the addiction? Because it sure seems like they could get a lot more drugs with a $9 an hour salary and be in the air conditioning.

I love it when you offer them food and they ask what it is and turn it down...

Sorry buddy, didn't know you had so many options!

Are you saying that the begging is the addiction? Because it sure seems like they could get a lot more drugs with a $9 an hour salary and be in the air conditioning.
Are you kidding? Most of those panhandlers are doing better than $9/hour and it's all tax-free!

My nonprofit runs a homeless program in Los Angeles. I can assure you the huge majority of homeless have severe addction and/or mental problems.

You can't force anyone into a shelter or into treatment. Most can't/won't abide by shelter rules, so it's the streets for them.

The mayor recently started a task force on the homeless problem in OKC and seemed to have some real compassion around the issue. I hope things improve for everyone soon.

I don't think this is a "Bricktown" specific problem. In fact, I'd say it's more of a citywide problem, particularly west downtown where many of the local homeless shelters and agencies are. I live in west downtown and know about the problems bandnerd and Midtowner mentioned. That whole intersection at Reno/Classen/Western is a nightmare. You can't go to any of the fast food restaurants or the Valero gas station without getting hit up at least one time every time you go there. Often, you'll get hit up multiple times. The same goes for the 7-11 at NW10th and Western although it's getting better there since the police like to hang out there alot. As many of you know and should know, the city has been working on plans to tackle the homelessness issue in OKC, and budgeted for the next Fiscal Year about 4 times more than normal to help with the problem.


With as many safety nets and opportunities as there are, homelessness in today's world is a choice. One might not "choose" homelessness, but one does choose not to go for that last fast food job and an efficiency apartment before they lose everything.. they choose to do drugs, alcohol that they cannot afford.

I have to somewhat disagree with Midtowner's comments. This statement is pretty much U.S. specific. Just by living in the U.S. you're one of the wealthiest 2 percent of people in the world. We often take for granted that most of the world is living well below the U.S. standards of poverty and often don't know where there next meal, shelter, etc. is coming from. Look at many Asian and African countries as an example. But I do agree, there are too many agencies, and other public assistance, not to help one get back on their feet, but as Misty said, it's more of a simple solution. It's often a deeper issue at hand, addiction, mental illness, etc.

On the Bricktown note, I got hit up on Main street in a dark corner with my wife a few weeks ago after we ate at the Bricktown Brewery. He asked if he could have money to eat, etc. Honestly, I don't often carry cash in my wallet (many times for this reason since I get hit up living/working downtown daily), but I do offer to get them help and solve their real need. I offered him our leftovers from the Brewery and he gladly accepted. I let him walk off and went to my car and we got in. We waited a few minutes and drove in the direction he was walking off to. Sure enough he was vigorously eating the food and probably really needed it. It's people like this I don't mind helping. It's the scammers that do give the real homeless a bad rep. I've talked to several "homeless" downtown and offered to buy them lunch, once at the west downtown Taco Bell and the guy refused and refused, and then finally told me what combo meal and extras to order him. I said if you're hungry enough, I'll order you a few items but you can't demand all these things. He said okay, so I ordered and came out with his food. He was long gone a few blocks down the road. I said man why did you run off after hitting me up for food, money,etc. Anyhow I gave him the food and I ate it. I see this guy almost everyday. He won't be getting assistance from me again with that attitude.

Being a big beer fan myself I gladly hand them over a couple of bucks to help them get that 40 they have been dreaming of all morning

This is why I always travel with a 6 'er in the backpack. You know...For the good of the downtrodden.









Or long drives.

I'm glad you had food for the one in Hundreds that have come up to me in the last few weeks wanting money who actually really needed food. I haven't had anyone come to me telling me they were hungry or asking for food or diapers. I get those who give me the story about how their car broke down or ran out of gas around the corner and they just need $10 to get a cab to the south side. Then the next day the same couple of people will hit me up with the same story.
The problem is a big one and it is not only down town. I have had people start coming up to my door at all times of the night wanting $$. Men will stand in my neighbors bushes and pop out as I'm putting my kids in the car to go some where, or be waiting there when I pull up with my kids in the car. They are now lurking on my property and putting my family in danger. I can not even let my children play in our own yard now.
The thing is, I have NEVER given any of these people money and they continue to lurk around and beg. One of the women pretends to be in a wheel chair, ( I have seen her walking around the streets in the morn. while taking my kids to school), and if her target doesn't give her the money she begs for, she waits outside of the restaurant where I work and the businesses around it for someone to come out, and she positions her wheelchair by the car, where she is in the blind spot, and hits the car, and her accomplice comes running over saying he saw her get hit, and they try to bribe the target or guilt them out of money.
I think the police need to crack down on this. There are very few panhandlers actually needing food or real help. If no one gives them money and the law is more strick on them they will have no other choice but to get real help if that's what's needed, or GET A JOB.

I'm glad you had food for the one in Hundreds that have come up to me in the last few weeks wanting money who actually really needed food. I haven't had anyone come to me telling me they were hungry or asking for food or diapers. I get those who give me the story about how their car broke down or ran out of gas around the corner and they just need $10 to get a cab to the south side. Then the next day the same couple of people will hit me up with the same story.
The problem is a big one and it is not only down town. I have had people start coming up to my door at all times of the night wanting $$. Men will stand in my neighbors bushes and pop out as I'm putting my kids in the car to go some where, or be waiting there when I pull up with my kids in the car. They are now lurking on my property and putting my family in danger. I can not even let my children play in our own yard now.
The thing is, I have NEVER given any of these people money and they continue to lurk around and beg. One of the women pretends to be in a wheel chair, ( I have seen her walking around the streets in the morn. while taking my kids to school), and if her target doesn't give her the money she begs for, she waits outside of the restaurant where I work and the businesses around it for someone to come out, and she positions her wheelchair by the car, where she is in the blind spot, and hits the car, and her accomplice comes running over saying he saw her get hit, and they try to bribe the target or guilt them out of money.
I think the police need to crack down on this. There are very few panhandlers actually needing food or real help. If no one gives them money and the law is more strick on them they will have no other choice but to get real help if that's what's needed, or GET A JOB.

It would be great if they could smackety, but I would much rather they handle crimes instead of just plain annoyances...They are a nuisance, but hardly anything for the police to waste their valuable time on

You run them off from one corner and they are on another 2 blocks down within 10 minutes

I moved here 2 years ago. When moving to the "bible belt", I would think you would all be helping the homeless, not giving excuses like "I dont owe the guy on the street anything". I just dont get it. These are still PEOPLE that need help one way or another. Having police come stop panhandling isnt going to do anything. They just move down the street. Why don't we find a way to get them off the street one way or another.

I moved here 2 years ago. When moving to the "bible belt", I would think you would all be helping the homeless, not giving excuses like "I dont owe the guy on the street anything". I just dont get it.

A lot of us do. It's just that poverty in America and poverty as described in the Bible, in my opinion are two very different things. In Biblical times, if you were born a slave, a pauper, whatever, that's basically what you were going to be, thus, helping the poor was something which humanely, was the only choice. No matter what you did though, those poor folks would always be poor folks regardless of their choices in life.

On the other hand, in America, it's not all that difficult to go from the bottom of society to the middle. It's entirely possible to go from the middle to the top. Our society is replete with rags to riches stories. Every single one of those stories (except actors, they don't count) has something to do with hard work, discipline and determination.

The guy asking me for money for a "bus ticket" at the local gas station could have just as easily been down at the standby work lot, getting money for odd jobs, going through Workforce Oklahoma to find work, etc. Instead, he chooses to harass innocent people who are just trying to buy gas. This guy is not poor in the Biblical sense. His situation is not without hope. He's there either through his own stupidity or bad luck. This society, unlike other places in the world will still give such a person the choice to dig themselves out of that hole.


These are still PEOPLE that need help one way or another. Having police come stop panhandling isnt going to do anything. They just move down the street. Why don't we find a way to get them off the street one way or another.

Better question -- why don't THEY find a way to get themselves off the street?

I was approached by a guy last night in bricktown. He said, "Hey can you spare some money so a guy can get a bite to eat?" I said no, but that I would bring him out some chips and salsa if he wanted it (I was headed for Chelinos.) His response? "Nah, I don't like their salsa." and he turn around to walk away.

!?!?!?

Picky picky...:rolleyes:

I was approached by a guy last night in bricktown. He said, "Hey can you spare some money so a guy can get a bite to eat?" I said no, but that I would bring him out some chips and salsa if he wanted it (I was headed for Chelinos.) His response? "Nah, I don't like their salsa." and he turn around to walk away.

!?!?!?

Picky picky...:rolleyes:

A guy who isn't really hungry... just wanted some money for booze/drugs. Figures.

I am not talking about lazy people who dont want to work. It's been said that most homeless people are mentally ill. These people have been abandonded by their familes and cannot help themselves. Coming from the welfare capital of the US, I know all too much about lazy people.

I was approached by a guy last night in bricktown. He said, "Hey can you spare some money so a guy can get a bite to eat?" I said no, but that I would bring him out some chips and salsa if he wanted it (I was headed for Chelinos.) His response? "Nah, I don't like their salsa." and he turn around to walk away.

!?!?!?

Picky picky...:rolleyes:

Sounds like the same guy that got me outside Bricktown Brewery. Had to have a giant size coney value meal...

As much as this city is investing in cleaning up the city, they best investment would be to build a new city rescue mission SOUTH of the river to get rid of the panhandlers downtown. The homeless shelter is way too close to the upscale entertainment district.

I was approached by a guy last night in bricktown. He said, "Hey can you spare some money so a guy can get a bite to eat?" I said no, but that I would bring him out some chips and salsa if he wanted it (I was headed for Chelinos.) His response? "Nah, I don't like their salsa." and he turn around to walk away.

!?!?!?

Picky picky...:rolleyes:

Well...It DOES kinda suck. :D

Well here is my story. It happened a few years back when I worked downtown. I had gotten some meal tickets from the Salvation Army (Located just south of downtown on Robinson) to hand out to the panhandlers. I thought this was a great idea. One of the panhandlers approached my group looking for money. I gave him one of those tickets and looked at me and said "Hell, I know where to get a meal, I need cigarettes and beer."

Two of the ladies that worked in the office said they were actually threaten by a panhandler with getting their throats slit if they didn't cough up some money.

Two of the ladies that worked in the office said they were actually threaten by a panhandler with getting their throats slit if they didn't cough up some money.

Well you do have to give it up to the guy...That right there is quite a sales pitch :tiphat:

I beleive if we had decent resting and eating places for panhandlers, they would slow down. I have gone to school downtown and worked within seven blocks of reno for 52 years. No matter what reason they give you, most of them spend the money on alcohol or drugs as they can eat free at saint anthony's, salvation army, jusus house and other places. Give them an alternative then enforce it.

I beleive if we had decent resting and eating places for panhandlers, they would slow down.

What? We have clean shelters and food pantries all over the downtown area. Qhat would you suggest, a 5-star hotel and restaurant just for panhandlers?

I like the cops approach on I-35. I see him all the time pulling up on panhandlers and giving them a hard time until they leave.

This is my first post on this board, but I was reading this discussion about panhandlers, and noticed that there wasn't anyone stressing that this is a very important economic development issue. There was a poster saying that they wouldn't consider moving downtown until the problem is solved. Trust me, there are many other people thinking the same thing, and as this continues to keep individuals out of the downtown housing market it filters through to supermarket and retail interest in the area, and further on to midsize to large companies relocating to the downtown OKC area. This is an economic development issue as well as a safety issue, and it needs to be addressed with typical Oklahoma compassion, but with authority and continued focus on enforcement.

I agree that this issue needs to be addressed correctly, but a few things of note:

1.) The problem isn't so much in Bricktown as it is west downtown (near the shelters)

2.) Anyone using that excuse isn't completely serious about wanting to be downtown. Look at any other major city, I can show you alot more homeless. Ever been to Miami?? Heck you have homeless living on the street sleeping on mattresses and all sorts of things 1 block away from American Airlines Center and Bayside Mall. I was in Philly and New York recently and saw homeless there as well. Last time I checked, those places weren't hurting for people to live in the core of the city.

The real problem is "Perception" or "perceived problems". Just like the whole "parking problem" we supposively have. The data shows there is nowhere near a problem, but many people say there is a problem. These people are the infrequent visitors of downtown, the vocal minority if you will, yet the stupid OKC media often listens to them instead of the frequent visitors or workers/residents of downtown.

metro, I think different places carry different expectations for interactions with the homeless. While Philadelphia or Portland may be places where the populace are naturally okay with homeless roaming the streets, keep in mind, most Oklahoma Citians are suburbanites at heart. We want all of the cool things about downtown and none of the bad.

Also, it is worth mentioning that the homeless on the west side of the city are found in greater numbers and concentration than what you'd find in many larger cities.

"Perceived problems" become real problems when they forestall growth.

-- or do you actually think that the only reason downtown hasn't expanded south of I-40 is because the highway is some sort of impassable barrier?

I agree Midtowner, but it seems like you're agreeing with me just in different words. You call it "suburban mindset" I call it "perception", really it's the same thing. I agree most OKCitians (including ones who have come from more urban places have adopted the attitude you describe). Personally it does annoy me but I'm okay with it and I deal with it and don't let it stop me from wanting my downtown lifestyle. Heck, I even help them out when I can buy them food and such. I don't give them $$$ however.

I do strongly agree with your point that sadly and unnecessarily it has stalled growth in OKC. We hear all the time that I-40 is stalling south downtown growth which is total B.S. in my opinion, you're right it is the blight. Personally if enough developers had the balls to just develop some things south of the current I-40 it would progress naturally, but OKC is to new of a city to have the urban mindset other peer cities have.

I drove around south of I-40 yesterday just checking things out. If anything were to be developed down there, it would have to be done on a massive scale. It appears that law enforcement doesn't even patrol that area as I saw one spot where a homeless person had apparently pitched a tent right off of Robinson. I'd be a little wary about investing in property when my neighbor lived in a tent and was unchecked by police.

-- maybe he's homesteading?

At any rate, I have no clue what land values are south of I-40, but right now, I'd have to assume that land is relatively cheap. Were investors to buy and develop all or most of that land, I think it could be extremely successful. The city needs to start NOW so it can ensure there will be adequate green space, corridors for rail, etc. Drive down there sometime -- what a tremendous opportunity this city has to build something really special down there.

You making fun of my tent jerkface?

Got a dollar?

Oh gawd

Put the spray paint can down and walk away

Gold just ain't your color :drunk:

You making fun of my tent jerkface?

Got a dollar?

No dude.. seriously.. nice tent.

(it was actually a pretty decent tent.. I suppose I would invest a lot of money in a tent I called "home" as well.)

No dude.. seriously.. nice tent.

(it was actually a pretty decent tent.. I suppose I would invest a lot of money in a tent I called "home" as well.)

Well..I DID spend a bit of money on it.

http://members.cox.net/nukeim/tent.jpg