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Thread: Friends for a Better Boulevard

  1. #1726
    CaptDave is offline Gold Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by hoyasooner View Post
    I really like this one as it runs right down Exchange, next to the old Farmers Market building. That makes it much more likely that that area will be redeveloped.
    That is one of my favorite attributes of the simple orientation of Option 'D'. Essentially we end up with two boulevards with outstanding views as you drive into town from the interstate - the Crystal Bridge on California and the Farmer's Market on 3rd.

    I know there is a lot of industrial facilities in the area around the Farmer's Market now, but it would be nice to see if some sort of feature such as a roundabout could be used at Exchange and 3rd. The city actually proposed this in an earlier meeting and it might be a great way to kick off redevelopment in the FM area.
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  2. #1727
    jedicurt is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    i really like this Option D. my only questions is the western half... when does it hit ground level instead of being elevated? i know that it will be elevated at the far western end but want it down at normal street level as soon as possible

  3. #1728
    Just the facts's Avatar
    Just the facts is offline Kerry Decker
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by OKCisOK4me View Post
    If alternative D is chosen, then the grid also needs to be restored west of Western (at ground level).
    I agree 100%. There is no reason to elevate that portion either. That would provide 10 more intersections to disperse traffic.
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  4. #1729
    hoyasooner is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    You can't create the kind of value that buildings like the Farmers' Market have with new construction. That's the kind of architectural site that serves as an anchor for a whole neighborhood, by giving character and a sense of history. There is no reason at all that you couldn't have development similar to Midtown and Deep Deuce in that area in 10 years. Angling the Boulevard down that path virtually guarantees it. Creating another elevated barrier between those areas virtually guarantees that it won't happen.

  5. #1730
    jn1780 is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by jedicurt View Post
    i really like this Option D. my only questions is the western half... when does it hit ground level instead of being elevated? i know that it will be elevated at the far western end but want it down at normal street level as soon as possible

    Well, unless there is a movement to have the western segment design changed it will be still be an elevated berm all the way to klein with ramps added at Virgina. Everyone is fixated on Western to Gaylord though so I'm pretty sure nothing will change here since ODOT is pushing out this design for letting next month.

  6. #1731
    Snowman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by jn1780 View Post
    Well, unless there is a movement to have the western segment design changed it will be still be an elevated berm all the way to klein with ramps added at Virgina. Everyone is fixated on Western to Gaylord though so I'm pretty sure nothing will change here since ODOT is pushing out this design for letting next month.
    Even if they do the grid, I would be shocked if it was not still incorporating a bridge over western, with Fred Jones being the first street it might intersect at grade with.

  7. #1732
    CaptDave is offline Gold Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by jedicurt View Post
    i really like this Option D. my only questions is the western half... when does it hit ground level instead of being elevated? i know that it will be elevated at the far western end but want it down at normal street level as soon as possible
    The western section reaches ground level a little west of Klein.

  8. #1733
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowman View Post
    Even if they do the grid, I would be shocked if it was not still incorporating a bridge over western, with Fred Jones being the first street it might intersect at grade with.
    It is possible to be at ground level before Western. More to come on this Snowman.

  9. #1734
    jn1780 is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowman View Post
    Even if they do the grid, I would be shocked if it was not still incorporating a bridge over western, with Fred Jones being the first street it might intersect at grade with.
    I think it would be better if the boulevard went under Western and the first intersection was at Classen. People can branch off to three different routes from here.

  10. #1735
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by jn1780 View Post
    I think it would be better if the boulevard went under Western and the first intersection was at Classen. People can branch off to three different routes from here.
    Grade would be way too steep for that. Not enough distance between Western and Classen.

  11. #1736
    Tier2City is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard


  12. #1737
    Tier2City is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Steve writes "Final thought: the new boulevard won’t open in 2014. Write it down now." Not sure this is new. Michael McNutt wrote this in The Oklahoman on January 7th this year:

    Downtown OKC boulevard completion won't be until 2016 | News OK

    I guess at that time ODOT thought things might get delayed.

  13. #1738
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    ODOT mentioning they may still considering shifting from California with the grid, I hope they consider shifting to/from Sheridan along with all the shifting it south plans.

  14. #1739
    jn1780 is offline Participating Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by Tier2City View Post
    Steve writes "Final thought: the new boulevard won’t open in 2014. Write it down now." Not sure this is new. Michael McNutt wrote this in The Oklahoman on January 7th this year:

    Downtown OKC boulevard completion won't be until 2016 | News OK

    I guess at that time ODOT thought things might get delayed.
    Depends on what option they go with. Their about to get started on the east and west ends and it wont take long if it is decided to go with the grid.

  15. #1740
    Just the facts's Avatar
    Just the facts is offline Kerry Decker
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Downtown Boulevard Back to Four Options | News OK

    Answers to Steve's four questions.

    1) California Ave will not change in length because of what is happening at the Stage Center site. That section of street is already close.
    2) 20 years ago all of downtown was a homeless shelter. California Ave will improve just like the rest of downtown has improved, which should help Film Row 1 block away.
    3) The convention center, Union Park, and the arena will still have a boulevard running by them with ample access to 4 interstate ramps.
    4) I actually can't believe this is a serious question so I won't bother answering.
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  16. #1741
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    I have also heard some rumblings of tying the I-40 West portion into Sheridan instead of California. There are two ways to do that. One would be to create flyovers - which we are trying to avoid, and the second way is to make a signalized intersection with left turn lanes. I ask why do that. Making everyone go from the I-40 ramp to Sheridan at a single intersection would cause significant rush hour back-ups and probably play right into ODOT's hands. Just leave the connection at California Ave and the drivers will have 7 different routes to transition over to Sheridan. Remove the elevated portion west of Western and there would be 10 more ways to do it. 17 ways for cars to go is better than 1 way.

    on edit:
    Sorry, my counting is off - it is 20 ways. 20 is better than 17 which is better than 1.
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  17. #1742
    CaptDave is offline Gold Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    It makes no sense to replace one diagonal shift to the south for one to the north to Sheridan. The Two Boulevards on the Grid is all about restoring as many connections as possible - this is accomplished by eliminating the diagonal section between Western and Lee. By doing this, maximum flexibility in routes is attained along with a very large area of land for redevelopment. This option also eliminates the right turn only slip lanes from the other options providing even more connections for people to go north or south to their destinations rather than limiting their options needlessly. Simple solutions are generally better - direct, at grade connections to California and 3rd Street are the most effective (and least costly) ways to meet every goal of the boulevard project.

  18. #1743
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by Just the facts View Post
    I have also heard some rumblings of tying the I-40 West portion into Sheridan instead of California. There are two ways to do that. One would be to create flyovers - which we are trying to avoid, and the second way is to make a signalized intersection with left turn lanes. I ask why do that. Making everyone go from the I-40 ramp to Sheridan at a single intersection would cause significant rush hour back-ups and probably play right into ODOT's hands. Just leave the connection at California Ave and the drivers will have 7 different routes to transition over to Sheridan. Remove the elevated portion west of Western and there would be 10 more ways to do it. 17 ways for cars to go is better than 1 way.

    on edit:
    Sorry, my counting is off - it is 20 ways. 20 is better than 17 which is better than 1.
    Amen! You may have more intersections with the grid option (which I'm for), but people have more choices and traffic will disperse! much better than pushing everyone 1 way in/out
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  19. #1744
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    Quote Originally Posted by treyingram90 View Post
    Amen! You may have more intersections with the grid option (which I'm for), but people have more choices and traffic will disperse! much better than pushing everyone 1 way in/out
    And heaven forbid there is an accident at that 1 intersection.
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  20. #1745
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just the facts View Post
    And heaven forbid there is an accident at that 1 intersection.
    However it is done, there is just one street that it will line up with at first, which will have queueing no matter what when the light is red. While I like it just connecting with California, I would take connecting Sheridan verses any of the options connecting it further south (which they seem stuck on 3rd) that causes a major disruption in the grid and makes itself a worse option to ever use the boulevard to access large parts of downtown verses using Shields/Gaylord exit coming from the west or the Western exit coming from the east.

  21. #1746
    CaptDave is offline Gold Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    ^ I agree with that. Connecting to Sheridan is far less disrupting to traffic patterns than the Western to Lee section in the "old" plan. But my personal preference is still the straight, simple connection to California from the west and building the grand boulevard we have all heard about along the 3rd Street right of way.

  22. #1747
    Hemingstein is offline Formerly OnlyOne
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptDave View Post
    ^ I agree with that. Connecting to Sheridan is far less disrupting to traffic patterns than the Western to Lee section in the "old" plan. But my personal preference is still the straight, simple connection to California from the west and building the grand boulevard we have all heard about along the 3rd Street roght of way.
    I agree with connecting to California from the west and building along the 3rd St. ROW. They could make SW 3rd the Grand Blvd. from Bass Pro all the way to Klein, where they could have the roundabout/traffic circle. It would be awesome. Then they could go about reconnecting the grid along the way, everybody wins. Except for Lower Bricktown.

  23. #1748
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by OnlyOne View Post
    Then they could go about reconnecting the grid along the way, everybody wins. Except for Lower Bricktown.
    It is too bad ODOT didn't try something different on the I-40 east connection.
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  24. #1749
    BoulderSooner is offline Platinum Member
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by OnlyOne View Post
    I agree with connecting to California from the west and building along the 3rd St. ROW. They could make SW 3rd the Grand Blvd. from Bass Pro all the way to Klein, where they could have the roundabout/traffic circle. It would be awesome. Then they could go about reconnecting the grid along the way, everybody wins. Except for Lower Bricktown.
    the blvd connection at the east end will be above grade until about half way past harkins theatres with a turn into bricktown at hopefully oklahoma

  25. #1750
    Hemingstein is offline Formerly OnlyOne
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    Default Re: Friends for a Better Boulevard

    Quote Originally Posted by Just the facts View Post
    It is too bad ODOT didn't try something different on the I-40 east connection.
    I was thinking that exact thing when I was looking at Google Maps this morning. They really butchered that interchange. Of course, that's nothing new for ODOT.
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