How do we get you back?

[downtownguy]

Today's "Project Next" meeting was pretty interesting. Some of you posting on this board are big Oklahoma City boosters, but have moved in recent years to Portland and elsewhere.

One of the big themes today was "how do we get you back?"

So I'm asking... how do we get you back? And why did you leave?

- The Downtown Guy
www.downtownguy.blogspot.com

[okcpulse]

Well, I haven't left yet. The move to Texas won't take place until October 2005. My wife and I will be leaving Oklahoma City for family reasons. She hasn't been close to her immediate family for seven years. In any case, Oklahoma City won't be losing us for economic reasons. We will miss living here. We will miss the vibrancy, the change, many controversies that in my personal opinion make living here quite interesting. Oklahoma, despite its conservative laws and lawmakers, is the only state I know of in the nation that is not politically boring, and perhaps being born and raised here might have something to do with that.

I won't lie. I'm looking forward to moving. After all, I've never lived out of state before, and it is exciting to taste life in a different state. But to answer your question... what will it take to bring us back should we consider doing so? If I had the opportunity to return to my home city in the future, I'd do so in a heartbeat. In any case, while in Texas, I will be planning many return visits to Oklahoma City, and that includes film projets I have planned for the future. Film an Oklahoma City story in Texas? No way!

I do, however, have some suggestions as to what would make Oklahoma a bit more attractive to others, especially those in the creative class that love beer and wine. Change the retail alcoholic beverage laws!

Oklahoma is one of two states that can't sell cold beer in a liquor store, one of two states that do not have regular 5% a.b.v. Coors, Anheuser-Busch and Miller beer brands in a liquor store (the other is Utah), and one of fifteen states that can't sell wine in a grocery store. Imagine living in Illinois all your life, and as a regular beer drinker (not an alcoholic, there is a difference) you always picked up a case of MGD at a retail liquor store, then moving to Oklahoma where no sign of MGD exists except in the 4% a.b.v. version (3.2% a.b.w.) in the grocery store. Yes, these laws do not solely drive people away from Oklahoma, however, it gives us a bad reputation. Oklahoma is also one of only 5 states that force grocery stores and gas stations to sell low-point beer (the others are Kansas, Colorado, Utah and Minnesota). Oklahoma is also the only state in the nation where tattoo parlors are against the law.

Put it in this perspective, these laws aren't the main reason why people chose not to live in Oklahoma. However, if you're a visitor from the majority of states where the afore mentioned "vices" are just an everyday thing, Oklahoma's contrast can sour your taste. Oklahoma has to make sense to people, otherwise, he or she will not consider moving here.

[Patrick]

I'm sure floater and Hot Rod will have some good stories to tell on this topic!

[floater]

Well, at Patrick's nudging...

The chamber is so correct in its focus on attracting back people. Many have departed OKC but still are in an Oklahoma state of mind. Read the Letters section of Oklahoma Today and you'll see that. My friends can tell you that OKC has never left my consciousness, and having spent time outside the state, I can appreciate its advantages (and witness to its disadvantages). I'll take OKC's compact skyline plus its gorgeous blue skies any day to the manmade canyon that is Cleveland's monolithic downtown. I left with the full intention of coming back.

Some will leave and never come back. That's just the hard truth and we can't do anything about those people. But I know several who want to return. They left to pursue career opportunities that Oklahoma doesn't offer. But they'll come back once 1) they're satisfied with what they've achieved and want to settle down 2) they've reached a desired income and savings level 3) the right OKC opportunity comes along. I'm sure many expatriates want to return and bring what they've experienced and learned back to OKC. Among this group could be next Louisa McCune (editor of Oklahoma Today) or Carolyn Hill (director of the art museum).

Improved shopping and leisure options will help some (remember, they're coming from an area where places like The Cheesecake Factory are a given). What will compel them them to take a second look at OKC, though, is vibrancy and this message of a new OKC. If they see that the city wants their contributions, that it is taking steps to be more attractive (literally) with events and beautification, that it is hell bent on moving forward, they'll probably even start looking at Daily classifieds.

Ultimately, opportunity and salary will convince people to come back. We need to offer career and leisure opportunities that are exciting. A competitive salary would make a huge difference. But alas, these are factors that are long-term objectives. They are much easier said than done.

So what can we do in the mean time? We need to tell them that we'll help them create their own opportunities. We need to encourage them to use current employers as a base to contract their services and talents, or to start a new business or nonprofit. This is where an expanded "organizational infrastructure" can help -- as a support system for those who want to make things happen. It's composed of groups and nonprofits that offer venues to demonstrate talents and effectively market them.

Thus I say, let's get the word out on print and TV that OKC is a different city and put it to the Dallas, Houston, Kansas City and Denver markets. "Come back. It's not your father's OKC."

[okcpulse]

Well said, floater. Well said. It's definitely not your father's OKC. There are people Ive spoken to who haven't lived in or been to OKC in more than a decade. The city they left behind was one of economic disaster (oil bust of 1983-1987) high vacancies and limited to no career opportunities. Just like the old joke I remember... who ever's last out of the city, be sure and turn the lights out.

I believe Oklahoma City's most trying times, however, came in the late 1990's. It was then that limited concert venues killed our local music scene since the Civic Center was closed for renovation and the then Myriad no longer qualified for big name concerts. Performing artists came once in a blue moon. The attitude of city residents only exacerbated the situation. I Guess many assumed concerts stopped coming because there was no money instead of anticipating better concert venues with the future opening of the Ford Center and Civic Center. But even then, MAPS was facing problems and people got very skeptical, wondering if MAPS would even work. This was, of course, before the Ballpark opened.

Then came the all-time low. The late OCAF (Oklahomans for Children And Families) humiliated the city with an huge cultural blow. They approached the police and a local judge claiming the "Tin Drum", a German-made film, had content that they said constituted as child pornography. Alas, the OCPD made a big but thankful mistake in wrongfully seizing a rented copy of the film from the home of Michael Camfield an ACLU attorney, who in turn sued the OCPD over the mishap. But OCAF made matters worse. They took the matter to national television, embarrassing Oklahoma City to the point where local residents didn't even want to be associated with this city. The nation laughed at us. OCAF had already given us a bad name, a year before the Tin Drum fiasco. They were responsible for the closing of one of the nation's best comic book stores... Planet Comics. OCAF accused the store of carrying child pornography illustrated in adult comic books, claiming children "will see these books and become exposed".

After Tin Drum, when all was said and done, Oklahoma City ended up forking over more than $600,000 in taxpayer money for wrong-doings of the Oklahoma City Police Dept. After the settlement hit the news, people got ****ed, and OCAF was the original source of the problem.

Because of a local religious group (I thought their purpose was to help children and families in need, but their agenda was to stamp out porn and gain political ground, to hell with children and families), OKC was seen as a cultural backwater, and taxpayers paid for it. OCAF was advised by their attorney to stay out of sight, and they later disbanded. It's amazing how such a small interest group could put such a dent in our city's people. It wouldn't have been so bad had they not gone to the national press, but they did.

Our mission now is to attract and attract back creative people and enhance our diversity by celebratring it. In seven years time, I believe Oklahoma City has gained the ability to shun intolerance. Indeed, in some ways it is still here, but us Oklahoma Cityans are on a mission to change our city. So my message is to you folks who plan to start something like OCAF... don't. Take my advice, don't do it Oklahoma City will no longer welcome special religious groups who have a political agenda, because we'll throw you out, and then we'll go to work on you.

I am not particularly a fan of porn, pretty much all of it is repetitive anyway, and I do not tolerate child porn, but there is a big difference in child porn and a foreign made film that tells a story of a child growing up during Hitler's regime in Germany. I watched the scene in the movie that was the center of debate.

Yes, this is not the Oklahoma City of yesterday. It is the Oklahoma City of tomorrow, and if we become a liberal island in a conservate state like Seattle and Austin (as mentioned in last week's Oklahoma Gazette), then it will be of no surprise, and I hope people will be more exited about living here. I hoped for years this age would come, and it looks like our new era has finally arrived. After all, if city leaders embraced Richard Florida's ideas, then we a getting somewhere.

[Keith]

Yes, when things go wrong in Oklahoma, the usual groups that get blamed are the "religious groups," and the groups that promote safe and healthy lifestyles for children and families, such as OCAF. No, OCAF did not humiliate the city in any way. What they did was try to take porn off the streets that was trying to disguise itself as art. Then you have the anti-American association, the ACLU, that has to put their two cents worth into everything. That's the only reason this situation got so blown out of proportion....the ACLU. They like to get attention. They are nothing but a bunch of worthless babboons. Their main goal is to sue Christian people, and groups that promote morality, and it shows.

For those who want to start up a religious organization, such as OCAF, go for it. In my opinion, you are very welcome in OKC, because we have some backwoods thinkers that are brainwashed that need their tails kicked and some sense knocked in their heads. There is nothing political about OCAF. They are here to help protect families and children. They aren't democrat or republican, they just want to see the morals returned to this state.

You can call porn anything you want to, but it is still porn. Exploiting children in movies, although a true story, is still porn. My message is, if you defend all the porn and smut, then you will have one big battle on your hands.

Oklahoma is a great state to live in. I guess if you don't like the things that are going on in our state, you can stay where you are. Life is full of choices.

I'm sure to get a few replies on this, so since I have given my two cents worth, I won't post again on this subject. I'm not here to start any arguments, I am here to give my point of view.

[downtownguy]

In the "old" Oklahoma City, this was a big issue. And on the "old" chat boards, this would have quickly turned into a flame war. Here's my best shot at trying to prove we've advanced since then.

I would argue you're both right, to some extent. Some would say OCAF had good intentions that went astray. And if you drive through other major cities, there is an overkill on adult entertainment that ends up in your face (a dozen XXX bookstore billboards on a two mile stretch of Texas roadway, etc). So why not let the anti-pornography activists continue to surpress such activity where it's too mainstream, while letting those who prefer to allow some adult oriented entertainment continue to enjoy it - but not where it's in everybody's face.

Let Oklahoma City be the family town that also features the best of what a big city has to offer. It might be a difficult balance to reach - a city that caters to conservatives and liberals - but why not try to have it all?

Prove I'm right - and don't let this thread disintegrate into okctalk's first flame war.

- The Downtown Guy
www.downtownguy.blogspot.com

[Patrick]

Downtownguy, I think the compromise that you propose is great. It still allows adult entertainment for those that want it, but it keeps it from being in everyone's face (like on billboards) where children and families can see it. By not allowing advertising for it on billboards and the like, it keeps the family atmosphere in tact in our city.

[mranderson]

Downtownguy: I do not know if you have read about my adult entertainment campus proposal, however, it would solve the problem.

How to advertise it. Billboards are the only answer. You must advertise in order to attract business. What would the billboards say? I am not sure how to answer that one and keep the religious conservatives happy. Well, really there is no way to keep them happy. If THEY are against it, they think no one should have the right to enjoy it. I think someplace the Bible talks about selfishness. Think about that.

[downtownguy]

It's been two decades since my "wild" college days, but I sincerely doubt the average customer of an adult establishment needs the help of billboard advertising to find their way to seeing a naked woman. As for the "campus" idea, not sure if this city will go for that... but the concept of such businesses locating in industrial areas, or off the beaten path, wouldn't be too difficult to imagine happening.

[mranderson]

Let me refresh you. The campuses would not be in the urban areas. There would be four of them statewide. One each in the Oklahoma City and Tulsa metro areas, and one each in southern Oklahoma, one Northern.

Yes. Word does get around. However, in a state that is seen by the majority of the country as prudeville and over religious, the need for advertising is needed. Maybe similar to booze ads. "Oklahoma City Adult Themepark (then directions), over 18 only."

To get in, you would have to prove your age and sign a statement. If you faked it, you would be arrested. Plus, guards similar to a prison.

The only reason I propose this concept is to pasify the prudish and selfish.

[Patrick]

Well, I don't think these businesses should be kept from advertising, but their content should be screened before it's allowed to go up. Does OKC currently have any laws in effect? If not, we need to create some ordinances limiting what can and cannot be posted on a billboard.

And I do agree with downtownguy that most college students don't need the help of a billboard to find an establishment. The Red Rooster is the favorite hangout among my fellow medical students. The Red Rooster doesn't advertise because they don't have to.

For those that wanted to advertise....well, we have the Gazette!!

[mranderson]

Patrick: You have displayed the courage to be open minded on this and I appreciate it. He is another question that falls in that same area.

Yes. We could advertise the campuses in the Gazette and competing newspapers, and ad a website. However, how do you attract the tourist trade passing through the state. People who might want to experience the NEW, 21st century Oklahoma in an adult way?

Of course, word of mouth from truckers helps, but not everyone who would shop the campus are truckers.

[Patrick]

Like I said, I guess billboard are okay (now that I rethink the issue), but their content needs to be screened. Take Covergirls for instance......they have billboards but they're not distasteful. They don't have rated X images or anything like that. So maybe the same should apply for other adult entertainment venues. Allow them to advertise, but set up ordinances restricting what can and cannot be advertised.

[mranderson]

Restrictions. (Some obvious) No nudity or extreemly lowcut clevage, no fould language or popular euphinisms for sexual acts, no product names.

Allowed: Adult entertainment, over 18 only, (website name) www.Oklahomaadult.(whatever), exotic dancing, escorts.

Somehow you would have to imply that adult videos, no holds barred strip clubs, legal brothals, and homosexual bars are in the campus. It would be dangerous to say see website for menu.

Yes. The restrictions would be such that only people who wanted some action would really see through the lines.

[Patrick]

That sounds reasonable. If it were allowed, I think the number of billboards contaning such content should be limited as well. I think it would be horrible if every billboard on I-40 was for an adult entertainment club.

[Luke]

Interesting topic.

So, what is the hypothesis here? If adult campuses are created in Oklahoma, then more people would...

Would more people move here? Would more residents stay here? Would more tourists visit?

What's the point of an adult campus? (Aside from the obvious)

If this is a proposal just to get the stigma of prudeness off of Oklahoma, then what does it matter? You think a sizeable amount of tourists specifically DON'T visit Oklahoma because we don't have a massive sex industry? Or people choose not to move to Oklahoma for the same reason?

No flames here, just wanted to be the devil's advocate (how's that for an oxymoron?)

I believe the more important issues are luring businesses, professionals, creatives and forward thinkers to OKC. That'll get us going in the right direction.

Luke

[mranderson]

Would more people move here? Probably not for that reason. We would have some people move here to own and run the brothals and higher class working girls might move here to be alongside the ladies that would work in the brothals. Some adult production companies might bring some productions here.

Would more toutists visit here? Maybe not because of the right to play. For casino's yes. Maybe a few for legal brothals but not a noticable amount.

That is not the point, however. The right to buy adult related products IS the point. The prude, selfish people losing a battle is also the point.

Why the campuses? Simple. The religious movement headed by Forrest Claunch would fight to the death to stop the venues in town. Maybe by bringing them into a sealed campus that is difficult to get in, and away from the population, then maybe he would lose.

He is already trying to cost us jobs by fighting against casinos and the lottery. His selfishness and prudeness have made this state a laughing stock.

We are one of only about five states at the most that ban the sale of adult material. Even states that you think are hard line Baptist consrvatives have allowed them. Tennessee is an example. So is West Virginia.

We would be the second state to say as long as health issues are resolved (condomization and strict health checks and licnses) it is allright to pay for play. Plus, the transaction would only be leagal on the campus. As far as the public is concerned, that buxom blonde you are with at the Renaissance is your girlfriend or wife. It is none of their business that you paid her a grand for an all night "party."

Plus. I do not like tatoos, however, I would vote to allow them in Oklahoma because that is the right of the people who want them.

All I am saying is stop being selfish and prude. You do not have to go into these places. However, If I want to buy "Debbie Does Dallas Ten" THAT is MY right.

If we have to compromise and make people drive past Harrah to do it, then that is acceptable as long as we get our rights.

[floater]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but all this talk about adult businesses in OKC isn't far off from the current situation. Sexually-oriented businesses (popularly referred to as "SOBs" in land use law) have their place in OKC, and there is minimal sign advertising for it. The only two I can think of are on I-35, the Covergirls billboard and the "XXX" establishment (seen well on I-35 N-bound) around SE 59(?). Moral decency concerns and SOBs have coexisted, mostly peacefully. Economically and socially, a sign ordinance would not have that much impact. We all find out about the birds and the bees eventually.


Nobody has made the argument that these SOBs will lure in the workers OKC needs. And in terms of an adult campus, we already have one; it's called Valley Brook. As long as police prosecute real crimes instead of curbing SOBs operations, OKC should be OK.

But I must admit, I was very embarrased about the Tin Drum incident. Not so much that it happened, but that it made national news. That's why, to be frank, I like having that Covergirls sign there. It counters such a square national image.

Finally, I too, would allow tattoo parlors. It would make a huge statement to young people. Really, they are getting tatoos anyway, and I doubt you will see a massive wave of tatooing. And tattoos are not like sex (for those who would debate that "they're doing it anyway" argument); not everybody needs them or cares for them.

[okcpulse]

Keith, I do apologize for giving the wrong impression on my last post, but as passionate as I am about our wonderful city, I sometimes get carried away.

Yes, OCAF did have good intentions, and rightfully so. People were so angry and mixed up about the whole incident that the emotion drove me to frustration. If OCAF's purpose was to protect children from XXX porn, then OCAF could have gone after the source of the problem... educating the parents that pick the smut up from Texas and stash it in their bedroom, which we all know is the place where children get snoopy. OCAF could have educated teens on what happens in to the lives of people who star in porn videos, and why that career is not a good choice. I just feel going after a comic book store and an old foriegn film just wasn't the way to make a difference. I never sided with the ACLU, but not being careful cost us $600,000, enough to replace several miles of county road.

I agree that everyone is welcome to express their ideas here in Oklahoma City, but I just hope that their cause has a positive effect on our community.

[Keith]

Thanks, and I understand. I realize that both of us have a passion for OKC, just in a different way. I, also, sometimes type quicker than I think, so sometimes I go out of control because of my passion. I don't mean to offend anyone because of my position on issues, but like you, It really gets me heated up when things happen in the city that show a negative impact on us.

We want to stay on the positive side of things........and sometimes we all get carried away with what we say. Just ask Patrick...I have a special pair of shoes, just in case I put my foot in my mouth.

[Patrick]

LOL Keith. You're right though. We all get carried away at times, and I'm probably one of the worst.

[mranderson]

Organizations like OCAF want to brainwash you into believing what they believe. They are quite biased and do not tell you BOTH sides of the story.

Yes. "The Tin Drum" fiasco was an embarrasment. However, so is anyone trying to take away the first amendment. That is where the right to adult materials lies. We all have the right to view them if we wish or not view them. If you think of them as "pornography," that is your right. However, do not be fooled into thinking that all people that work in the adult entertainment industry are molsted drug addicts who have low self esteem. Many are just the opposite and are in the profession because they want to be. They enjoy their work and are paid quite well for it.

On a weekly basis and before starting production on a picture, a performer must be tested for HIV and other STD's. Over the history of the industry, only a very small handfull of people been diagnosed with HIV. Two that i can think of have died. The recent "rash" of people only had four. That is out of probably thousands of people. The industry ranges from stripping to adult video performers to call girls.

It is no longer the day when some cigar chomping fat guy rammed a camera in two peoples faces while some ugly guy had sex with a woman that looked like her face had been through a blender. Nor are the legal working girls like that. Most are very attractive and very highly paid for their services. The managers treat them as a member of their families. In fact, one of the better known houses has women call from all over the country asking about working there. The clients are required to wear condoms, and the girls must be licensed by the state of Nevada and be tested weekly. NOT ONE case of aids has been diagnosed since the services were leagalized. If a girl has an STD, she is sidelined until it is cured.

The days of the drug infested "porn stars" is over. Very few have died of drug overdoses. Two or three have commited suicide, a small number have been murdered, some died naturally, and one or two died in traffic accidents. NONE except maybe the aids cases were related to the profession. In fact, legalizing the profession REDUCES aids. Plus it allows the police to do their job and arrest REAL criminals.

Do not let these "religious" organizations fool you. No. They are not telling both sides. Watch programs on the subject such as HBO's "Cathouse." They will show you one side. Did you notice that when the religious people talk about this and show it, they show you the worked over street walker and never show legal brothals or high class girls? Why? Brainwash. They only want you to see one side of it. They do not support their claim with the fact that most legal workers are clean, that they are frequently tested, must comply with state laws on health issues, and they no longer look like the tramps of the past. In fact, if I remember right I think Mary Magdline was a prostitute and Jesus has his time with her. I know of no place in the bible where it talks about the work prostitute as a sin. I could be incorrect, however, I do not know of any.

Before you make a descision, look at both sides of the story with an open mind. No, I am not telling you to go to the nearest adult store and buy a bunch of videos. I am just asking you to open your mind and take both sides of the issue into account. And realize, the opposition does not tell you about the leagal side's safeguards. They only tell you what THEY WANT to tell you to slant their position.

[Keith]

You asked for a verse.....you got it.

I Corinthians 6:15....."Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never!"

I Corinthians 6:18..." Flee from sexual morality. All other sins a man committs are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body."

Also, you are very incorrect about Mary Magdalene and Jesus. Jesus was perfect and without sin. To even suggest what you said He did with her is way out of line .

[Patrick]

Here's some more:

Ezekiel 16 basically gives a description of God's view of prostitution. Simply, God calls it wicked.

Ezekiel 16

An Allegory of Unfaithful Jerusalem

1 The word of the LORD came to me: 2 "Son of man, confront Jerusalem with her detestable practices 3 and say, 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says to Jerusalem: Your ancestry and birth were in the land of the Canaanites; your father was an Amorite and your mother a Hittite. 4 On the day you were born your cord was not cut, nor were you washed with water to make you clean, nor were you rubbed with salt or wrapped in cloths. 5 No one looked on you with pity or had compassion enough to do any of these things for you. Rather, you were thrown out into the open field, for on the day you were born you were despised.
6 " 'Then I passed by and saw you kicking about in your blood, and as you lay there in your blood I said to you, "Live!" [1] 7 I made you grow like a plant of the field. You grew up and developed and became the most beautiful of jewels. [2] Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare.
8 " 'Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love, I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness. I gave you my solemn oath and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Sovereign LORD , and you became mine.
9 " 'I bathed [3] you with water and washed the blood from you and put ointments on you. 10 I clothed you with an embroidered dress and put leather sandals on you. I dressed you in fine linen and covered you with costly garments. 11 I adorned you with jewelry: I put bracelets on your arms and a necklace around your neck, 12 and I put a ring on your nose, earrings on your ears and a beautiful crown on your head. 13 So you were adorned with gold and silver; your clothes were of fine linen and costly fabric and embroidered cloth. Your food was fine flour, honey and olive oil. You became very beautiful and rose to be a queen. 14 And your fame spread among the nations on account of your beauty, because the splendor I had given you made your beauty perfect, declares the Sovereign LORD .
15 " 'But you trusted in your beauty and used your fame to become a prostitute. You lavished your favors on anyone who passed by and your beauty became his. [4] 16 You took some of your garments to make gaudy high places, where you carried on your prostitution. Such things should not happen, nor should they ever occur. 17 You also took the fine jewelry I gave you, the jewelry made of my gold and silver, and you made for yourself male idols and engaged in prostitution with them. 18 And you took your embroidered clothes to put on them, and you offered my oil and incense before them. 19 Also the food I provided for you-the fine flour, olive oil and honey I gave you to eat-you offered as fragrant incense before them. That is what happened, declares the Sovereign LORD .
20 " 'And you took your sons and daughters whom you bore to me and sacrificed them as food to the idols. Was your prostitution not enough? 21 You slaughtered my children and sacrificed them [5] to the idols. 22 In all your detestable practices and your prostitution you did not remember the days of your youth, when you were naked and bare, kicking about in your blood.
23 " 'Woe! Woe to you, declares the Sovereign LORD . In addition to all your other wickedness, 24 you built a mound for yourself and made a lofty shrine in every public square. 25 At the head of every street you built your lofty shrines and degraded your beauty, offering your body with increasing promiscuity to anyone who passed by. 26 You engaged in prostitution with the Egyptians, your lustful neighbors, and provoked me to anger with your increasing promiscuity. 27 So I stretched out my hand against you and reduced your territory; I gave you over to the greed of your enemies, the daughters of the Philistines, who were shocked by your lewd conduct. 28 You engaged in prostitution with the Assyrians too, because you were insatiable; and even after that, you still were not satisfied. 29 Then you increased your promiscuity to include Babylonia, [6] a land of merchants, but even with this you were not satisfied.
30 " 'How weak-willed you are, declares the Sovereign LORD , when you do all these things, acting like a brazen prostitute! 31 When you built your mounds at the head of every street and made your lofty shrines in every public square, you were unlike a prostitute, because you scorned payment.
32 " 'You adulterous wife! You prefer strangers to your own husband! 33 Every prostitute receives a fee, but you give gifts to all your lovers, bribing them to come to you from everywhere for your illicit favors. 34 So in your prostitution you are the opposite of others; no one runs after you for your favors. You are the very opposite, for you give payment and none is given to you.
35 " 'Therefore, you prostitute, hear the word of the LORD ! 36 This is what the Sovereign LORD says: Because you poured out your wealth [7] and exposed your nakedness in your promiscuity with your lovers, and because of all your detestable idols, and because you gave them your children's blood, 37 therefore I am going to gather all your lovers, with whom you found pleasure, those you loved as well as those you hated. I will gather them against you from all around and will strip you in front of them, and they will see all your nakedness. 38 I will sentence you to the punishment of women who commit adultery and who shed blood; I will bring upon you the blood vengeance of my wrath and jealous anger. 39 Then I will hand you over to your lovers, and they will tear down your mounds and destroy your lofty shrines. They will strip you of your clothes and take your fine jewelry and leave you naked and bare. 40 They will bring a mob against you, who will stone you and hack you to pieces with their swords. 41 They will burn down your houses and inflict punishment on you in the sight of many women. I will put a stop to your prostitution, and you will no longer pay your lovers. 42 Then my wrath against you will subside and my jealous anger will turn away from you; I will be calm and no longer angry.
43 " 'Because you did not remember the days of your youth but enraged me with all these things, I will surely bring down on your head what you have done, declares the Sovereign LORD . Did you not add lewdness to all your other detestable practices?
44 " 'Everyone who quotes proverbs will quote this proverb about you: "Like mother, like daughter." 45 You are a true daughter of your mother, who despised her husband and her children; and you are a true sister of your sisters, who despised their husbands and their children. Your mother was a Hittite and your father an Amorite. 46 Your older sister was Samaria, who lived to the north of you with her daughters; and your younger sister, who lived to the south of you with her daughters, was Sodom. 47 You not only walked in their ways and copied their detestable practices, but in all your ways you soon became more depraved than they. 48 As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD , your sister Sodom and her daughters never did what you and your daughters have done.
49 " 'Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. 50 They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen. 51 Samaria did not commit half the sins you did. You have done more detestable things than they, and have made your sisters seem righteous by all these things you have done. 52 Bear your disgrace, for you have furnished some justification for your sisters. Because your sins were more vile than theirs, they appear more righteous than you. So then, be ashamed and bear your disgrace, for you have made your sisters appear righteous.
53 " 'However, I will restore the fortunes of Sodom and her daughters and of Samaria and her daughters, and your fortunes along with them, 54 so that you may bear your disgrace and be ashamed of all you have done in giving them comfort. 55 And your sisters, Sodom with her daughters and Samaria with her daughters, will return to what they were before; and you and your daughters will return to what you were before. 56 You would not even mention your sister Sodom in the day of your pride, 57 before your wickedness was uncovered. Even so, you are now scorned by the daughters of Edom [8] and all her neighbors and the daughters of the Philistines-all those around you who despise you. 58 You will bear the consequences of your lewdness and your detestable practices, declares the LORD .
59 " 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: I will deal with you as you deserve, because you have despised my oath by breaking the covenant. 60 Yet I will remember the covenant I made with you in the days of your youth, and I will establish an everlasting covenant with you. 61 Then you will remember your ways and be ashamed when you receive your sisters, both those who are older than you and those who are younger. I will give them to you as daughters, but not on the basis of my covenant with you. 62 So I will establish my covenant with you, and you will know that I am the LORD . 63 Then, when I make atonement for you for all you have done, you will remember and be ashamed and never again open your mouth because of your humiliation, declares the Sovereign LORD .' "