Dwellings at SoSA

[dwellsokc]

Why, all of a sudden, is Mickey Clagg against "density" in the corner of the district that is furthest from his interests? I wonder if Steve Lackmeyer knows anything.

[LakeEffect]

Why, all of a sudden, is Mickey Clagg against "density" in the corner of the district that is furthest from his interests? I wonder if Steve Lackmeyer knows anything.

Yeah. That development is peculiar.

[Urbanized]

Here is the full protest letter:

http://www.okc.gov/AgendaPub/cache/2...5091714267.PDF

[LakeEffect]

The opposition to this saddens me. I don't know how, or why, people have come to expect that single family should be prioritized in an area that is part of the urban core. The protest letter from property owners notes "to ensure compatible development with
existing traditional mixed residential uses" in the first paragraph or so. These are the same people that tear down existing housing stock to build contemporary homes that are NOT compatible with existing traditional mixed residential uses.

I really hope Planning Commission does not bend on this and goes with staff's recommendation.

[bchris02]

The opposition to this saddens me. I don't know how, or why, people have come to expect that single family should be prioritized in an area that is part of the urban core. The protest letter from property owners notes "to ensure compatible development with
existing traditional mixed residential uses" in the first paragraph or so. These are the same people that tear down existing housing stock to build contemporary homes that are NOT compatible with existing traditional mixed residential uses.

I really hope Planning Commission does not bend on this and goes with staff's recommendation.

Its understandable that the existing homeowners want to protect their skyline view.

However, people thinking that single family should be prioritized is simply a product of three generations of suburban auto-centric development. People don't know or expect anything different. As the core re-urbanizes, there is going to be some growing pains and pushback and this is an example of that. Density is what will take the urban core forward. Hopefully the planning commission makes the right decision.

[okatty]

Here is the full protest letter:

http://www.okc.gov/AgendaPub/cache/2...5091714267.PDF

Might just be my Ipad but can't get that link to work. I'd like to see this if you happen to have another way to view or link..thanks.

[wsucougz]

Try this:

http://www.okc.gov/AgendaPub/view.as...fileid=2922709

May take a minute to load.

[okatty]

^ Got it! Thanks!!

[Spartan]

Trust me, I would absolutely prefer to live downtown…but not for the 2x to 4x difference we're talking about, it's just a hard move to justify when I couldn't live my preferred lifestyle without owning an automobile (regardless if I only had to drive 3,000 miles/year) and especially when public transit access to downtown is going to get much better in the next 5-10 years (heck, even this upcoming year when Route 005 starts running at night).

Plus the growth potential is not nearly as high downtown as it is to the North. I mean, buying downtown is still a great investment. I still expect a 25% increase in home-value over the next 5+ years. But I think there are so many places to buy all around the core that have 50% to 125% growth in front of them in the next 5+ years. Couple that with the lack of upfront capital needs, I think having to spend an extra 30 to 60 minutes in my car every week is worth it.

My real question is this: What price per square foot do downtown homes need to start hitting before developers take notice? Or maybe the better question is, what's the best equilibrium for developers to build 50/50 Lease/Sale housing in terms of pricing per square foot. If Lease prices are $1.75/sf, do for sale need to hit $350/sf to be enticing?

Why do things have to be cheap?

[LisbonLofter]

Seems at that a guy making money creating apartments in the surrounding area wouldn't be against density.

[no1cub17]

Why do things have to be cheap?

Exactly - they don't. We just need more supply of quality housing stock - and it'll be cheaper/more affordable, even in downtown. Except apparently our esteemed city leaders insist only on "low density" residential development downtown? What a joke!

[no1cub17]

The reason that there is so little for sale vs. rent is because property values downtown are rapidly appreciating and developers want to buy and hold, not sell off.

Also, it's been crazy easy to get loans on apartments because they have done so well, while condos historically have been very hit and miss in OKC.

I had one developer of a large urban project tell me that you almost have to go with local lenders and most of them are skeptical of condo projects.

I could see how that last part could've been true a few years ago - but I don't think that's the case any longer. When I moved into the Lofts, half of the building (give or take) was unsold. In the 6 months afterwards, the building sold out, it seemed, in a jiffy. Look how quickly The Hill is selling - and it frankly is about as un-urban as you can get - compared to most of the other downtown for-sale housing. I'm really curious how the Browntones would do if they were introduced 2-3 years ago and not when they were. If cities like Milwaukee can have block after block of lakefront condos, why can't we have even one or two more projects with skyline views? I don't get it. There are so many young professionals/students living downtown now, most of whom love it. These people are prime candidates to buy when they start their real jobs. Let's not force them to go to Edmond!

[soonerguru]

The pomposity and hypocrisy of this is astounding. I like many of the individuals involved in this, too. It's just very disappointing all around. It's no wonder it seems like collectively we are trying to push a one-ton boulder up hill to see any completed areas of urbanity in this city.

Unless I'm missing something, this seems like a quality use of land. The fact that it will be owner-occupied makes it even better. This development would improve, not hamper, property values.

SMDH

[Teo9969]

Why do things have to be cheap?

Huh?

[dwellsokc]

The pomposity and hypocrisy of this is astounding... Unless I'm missing something, this seems like a quality use of land. The fact that it will be owner-occupied makes it even better. This development would improve, not hamper, property values.
SMDH

Well said.

Yesterday's Planning Commission decision was continued for 2 weeks because there wasn't a quorum... 5 votes for, 2 against, 2 absent. Only one more vote is required for approval.

It'll pass.

[LakeEffect]

Well said.

Yesterday's Planning Commission decision was continued for 2 weeks because there wasn't a quorum... 5 votes for, 2 against, 2 absent. Only one more vote is required for approval.

It'll pass.

Who voted against, and did they say why?

[Pete]

This project received unanimous approval today from the Planning Commission, with one abstention.

Now, all systems are go. Should be starting soon.

[LakeEffect]

This project received unanimous approval today from the Planning Commission, with one abstention.

Now, all systems are go. Should be starting soon.

Does that mean the two no votes flipped, or were they just not present?

[Pete]

Does that mean the two no votes flipped, or were they just not present?

Of the two previous 'no' votes, one flipped and one abstained.

[LisbonLofter]

Good news. Hopefully the Hawes Brothers try to get their development on 8th going again. With this precedent maybe the density argument will not hold them back this time.

[Plutonic Panda]

Any news on this?

[Pete]

In fact, they plan to break ground within 2 weeks.

Just talked to the developers yesterday. Have sold all but one of the first phase units.

[Plutonic Panda]

So glad to hear that!

[Pete]

Work has started:

[Plutonic Panda]

badf#ckingass! This will be a super cool project. Hopefully they will redo the streets soon.