Omni Hotel

[Laramie]

Laramie, do you have any idea how much of each hotel was paid for by tax payers and what the builders paid?

The biggest issue you are going to come up with is the KC hotel was built for $150,000,000, that is true, but it was built in 1980. What would that translate to in 2018-2020 numbers?

Doubt if any taxpayer funds were involved.

Figures probably represent the original cost. The Jacksonville Hyatt Riverfront went into foreclosure last year and was sold for $53 million; the debts on it were $195 million.

Hyatt in Downtown Jacksonville sold for $53 million - Jacksonville Business Journal

IMO: Oklahoma City will probably have to sweeten somebody pot to lure a major reputable hotel chain here to construct a project of that magnitude. Let's hope we can save that $30 million in the MAPS III contingency fund for a future investment; an investment that could jump start the convention center--our central location is going to be a plus.

These figure probably represent the original cost; you talking about $400-450 million range for the 733-room, 45 story Sheraton Kansas City Crown Center if built after 2014; the calculator link below was used. Inflation appears to climb at 1% a year.

Inflation Calculator | Find US Dollar's Value from 1913-2014

"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.

[warreng88]

From the gazette:

To build or not to build?

Oklahoma City faces multiple decisions on a proposed hotel that’s tied to a new downtown convention center.

BY BEN FELDER

EDITOR’S NOTE: This is part two of a two-part story about the proposed MAPS 3 convention center and related hotel. Find part one at okgazette.com.

Seven years after its grand opening, the Renaissance Grand, a nearly 1,000-room convention center hotel in St. Louis, closed one of its buildings as $98 million in bonds used to help construct the hotel went into foreclosure.

The hotel, which opened in 2002 and went through foreclosure proceedings in 2009, was recently sold to a group that plans to renovate it under a new financial package that will see the city of St. Louis take a reimbursement hit on loans it issued to help pay for the hotel development.

It’s a cautionary tale that opponents of a potential convention center hotel in Oklahoma City can point to as a reason the city would be foolish to help support a similar hotel as part of a planned $250 million convention center. But in the same way OKC’s future convention center is a different project than those in other cities (see last week’s Oklahoma Gazette for more), a new convention center hotel in Oklahoma City, if one is ever built, would also follow a different path than ones built in cities like St. Louis, Boston and Nashville, where original occupancy estimates have not been met.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is it feasible?
A new convention center, which was approved by voters as a part of the 2009 Metropolitan Area Projects Plan 3 (MAPS 3), is coming to downtown. However, there are some who believe the success of the new convention center will depend on whether a large anchor hotel is also part of the project. The proposed hotel isn’t part of the MAPS 3 project, so city management is studying the best ways to attract possible investors.

“It will work without a hotel,” said Cathy O’Connor, president of The Alliance for Economic Development of Oklahoma City. “But it won’t work as well as it’s able to. We will not be as competitive without [a convention center hotel].”

The Oklahoma City Council is waiting for another report on the feasibility of a publicly supported hotel. O’Connor said the report, which is due this summer, will outline the options available to the city to help fund a hotel that could have as many as 775 rooms.

The convention center will work without the hotel, but the hotel won’t work without public assistance, O’Connor said.

“Full-service hotels are hard to do without public help,” O’Connor said. “If you look around, we have a lot of hotels being built in Oklahoma City right now, but not a full-service hotel. The Embassy Suites is the closest, but it is getting some [public] help. It’s a tough environment for those big hotels.”

More than just rooms
The number of hotel rooms a city has is often viewed as a benchmark for attracting convention traffic. However, the total number of rooms is not always the most important factor, but rather how many of those rooms are within just a few hotels, convention center officials say.

For example, Nashville, which is rated as a top 15 convention destination by the event and survey firm Cvent, has a total of 20,373 hotel rooms. That is 18,000 fewer rooms than St. Louis, which does not have as strong a convention industry. However, the difference between the two cities is that Nashville has a few larger hotels that are desirable for conventions that wish to locate the majority of their guests under one roof.

Cash or credit?
Oklahoma City’s proposed convention center is the most expensive MAPS project to date, but at an estimated $250 million, its price tag is only a fraction of those recently built or proposed in other cities. Also, the convention center is being built with money generated through sales tax, which makes the project less of a financial risk.

Public assistance for a new convention center hotel could be achieved through a variety of methods, O’Connor said, including through tax increment financing, also known as TIF, or creating a nonprofit that owns the hotel.

“The hotel is going to be riskier [than the convention center] just from that perspective,” O’Connor said about the funding options the city will face. “How much riskier? I don’t know. I think there are things that you can do to mitigate that risk, and those are some of the things the city council will want to look at. You certainly structure these things so the financial risk is not bore by the city.”

O’Connor also adds that the city has a track record of conservative funding practices when paying for large projects.

“Just general financial management in Oklahoma City is much more conservative than you will see in some other places,” O’Connor added.

In the coming months, the city council will be presented with a detailed study on the funding options that exist for supporting a convention center hotel, and there will most likely be a vote on whether or not Oklahoma

I am not sure what happened at the end. It just cut off both online and in print. Just a gazette error, I guess.

[Plutonic Panda]

Thanks for posting that. I have confidence that the city will make the right decision and do a great job with this.

[Swake]

Just to compare, Tulsa's convention center has two connected hotels, a 450 room DoubleTree and a new 180 room aLoft for a total of 630 rooms.

[mkjeeves]

The Oklahoma City Council is waiting for another report on the feasibility of a publicly supported hotel. O’Connor said the report, which is due this summer, will outline the options available to the city to help fund a hotel that could have as many as 775 rooms.

Who is the consultant?

[Plutonic Panda]

Just to compare, Tulsa's convention center has two connected hotels, a 450 room DoubleTree and a new 180 room aLoft for a total of 630 rooms.

Double Tree is Hilton right?

[Laramie]

Double Tree is Hilton right?

Hilton Brand...

[Just the facts]

Just to compare, Tulsa's convention center has two connected hotels, a 450 room DoubleTree and a new 180 room aLoft for a total of 630 rooms.

How are they doing in helping Tulsa land major national conventions? Looking at their convention calendar it doesn't appear that much.

[TheTravellers]

Thanks for posting that. I have confidence that the city will make the right decision and do a great job with this.

Why do you believe that? Is their track record good for this kind of thing (or anything similar)? Be nice if the right decision was made and a good job was done, but I'll believe it when I see it... At least the state's not in charge of it. :-P

[Plutonic Panda]

Why do you believe that? Is their track record good for this kind of thing (or anything similar)? Be nice if the right decision was made and a good job was done, but I'll believe it when I see it... At least the state's not in charge of it. :-P

Well, you have a good point. Perhaps it's just wishful thinking more than anything.

[Spartan]

A study showed that Oklahoma City could support a convention center hotel with a capacity of 735-rooms. We should be pushing for 700-900 room range to allow for 10-20 years of future growth.

He are two cities which possess hotels which might fit into that category:

Kansas City:

Sheraton Kansas City Hotel at Crown Center

Rooms: 733
Suites: 39
Height: 504 feet, 45 stories
Value: $150 million

Jacksonville, FL Hyatt Regency Riverfront Hotel

Rooms: 963
Height: 19 stories
Value: $200 million

"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.

KCMO just went pretty far into the hunt for the GOP convention but ultimately fell short with hotel count.

[soonerliberal]

JW Marriott Indianapolis, $450 million
JW Marriott Indianapolis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Westin Charlotte, Adjacent to Convention Center
Westin Charlotte - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Plutonic Panda]

I like the first one better

[Just the facts]

That Hyatt in Jax is a mile from the convention center. The nearest thing Jax has to a convention hotel is the Omni but you have to take the Skyway train to get to the cc.

Btw - that yatch in the picture at one time was the 17th largest in the world. In person it is freaking huge.

[HOT ROD]

yep, I think the KCMO hotel is nice to emulate; maybe 900 rooms though to give OKC flexibility for single large conventions, NBA Finals/All-Star games, or multiple smaller events.

One other idea is - maybe build two convention hotels (ala Tulsa), both being about 500 rooms or whatever. Let them have some architectural and retail significance to enhance the convention centre. Both hotels would have to be highrise given the limited footprint available - which would further add to OKC's skyline and give the city flexibility (large vs. multiple small events, big ticket/dollar vs conservative funded). This would also enhance OKC's business hotel offerability without impacting existing hotels too much.

I honestly like the idea of some sort of significant highrise hotel/office tower to be built WITH the Chesapeake Arena. Anyway, definitely some great ideas to be had and some Sim City ala OKC.

Good times indeed.

[bchris02]

The Westin Charlotte is a very nice hotel. A JW Marriott is a step above though. Isn't OKC supposed to be getting a full-service Marriott downtown anyways? That seemed to be the indication from Steve's chat last week and then Pete confirmed.

[Just the facts]

Just to throw a question out there: Are there any large American cities where the convention center is in a suburb?

Orlando

http://www.occc.net/

[warreng88]

Orlando

Welcome to the Orange County Convention Center

To be fair, the convention center in Orlando is not technically in a suburb, but it is not downtown. But, I guess I take Orlando as an exception because their main attraction is Disney and the convention center is closer to that than downtown. Most city's main attractions are their downtown because that is where most of the hotels/restaurants/sight-seeing areas are.

[Just the facts]

To be fair, the convention center in Orlando is not technically in a suburb, but it is not downtown. But, I guess I take Orlando as an exception because their main attraction is Disney and the convention center is closer to that than downtown. Most city's main attractions are their downtown because that is where most of the hotels/restaurants/sight-seeing areas are.

It is actually in unincorporated Orange County. It has an Orlando mailing address but is not in the city limits.

Every city limit in the US
http://www.maptechnica.com/us-city-b...cityid/4055000

[BoulderSooner]

It is actually in unincorporated Orange County. It has an Orlando mailing address but is not in the city limits.

Every city limit in the US
Oklahoma City, OK :: Boundary Map and Geodata for the City of Oklahoma City in Oklahoma, U.S.A. :: MapTechnica

It is in the "subburbs" the same way the stockyards is. That is to say it is not

[warreng88]

It is actually in unincorporated Orange County. It has an Orlando mailing address but is not in the city limits.

Every city limit in the US
Oklahoma City, OK :: Boundary Map and Geodata for the City of Oklahoma City in Oklahoma, U.S.A. :: MapTechnica

Technically, Disney is in Lake Buena Vista, FL, but if you asked anyone where Disney World was, they would say Orlando.

[Just the facts]

It is in the "subburbs" the same way the stockyards is. That is to say it is not

I was using the term 'suburb' in the sense of the development style. The OCCC is in the land of curvelinear streets, cul-de-sacs, expressways, surface parking lots, and large setbacks. Very few people are walking to a convention at the OCCC.

[JoninATX]

Something like Austin new JW Marriott will look good in the OKC skyline



Hotel in Downtown Austin | JW Marriott Austin

[zookeeper]

Something like Austin new JW Marriott will look good in the OKC skyline



Hotel in Downtown Austin | JW Marriott Austin

Seriously, besides the Ritz-Carlton, the JW Marriott's are as nice a hotel as one can find in the states. The service is several steps above the average Marriott hotel as well.

[JoninATX]

I never stayed at a JW Marriott, but had heard great reviews.