Lake Hefner at record low water levels, when will city buy Canton water?

[law]

[QUOTE=ljbab728;633079]As usual, the facts don't support your theories.

No theories stated, just the facts.

I talked to two of the top fisheries guys late last week. That is exactly what they said.

I talked to the business people here and in nearby towns every day. That is what they are saying.

Here's the mesonet 3-day accumulation chart, you can look at the monthly totals there also. Mesonet | 3-day Rainfall Accumulation

Since it is raining, I wouldn't think OKC would have a "need" to run their sprinklers.

[ljbab728]

No theories stated, just the facts.

I talked to two of the top fisheries guys late last week. That is exactly what they said.

I talked to the business people here and in nearby towns every day. That is what they are saying.

Here's the mesonet 3-day accumulation chart, you can look at the monthly totals there also. Mesonet | 3-day Rainfall Accumulation

Since it is raining, I wouldn't think OKC would have a "need" to run their sprinklers.

Your conversations with various people don't change the facts in the charts and don't support your statements with facts. Please provide varifiable facts if you want to be taken seriously. If your chart about rainfall accumulation is supposed to prove something, I have no idea what it is.

Have you been scouting sprinklers in OKC? I haven't seen one being used in the last couple of days.

You have a history of making false statements in this thread which leaves anything you say open to question.

[1972ford]

I used my washing machine water to keep my lawn green over the last couple years ran washer drain into a barrel half filled with sand then pumped with sump pump into another barrel of sand and stored in a tank that I buryied in the ground holds around 600 gallons I also collect runoff from my roof in said container I then pump the water onto the lawn when needed or when full like ill be doing this weekend to make room for next weeks rains. I'm thinking about adding another storage tank but I need to find another container I can bury I'd like to have a storage capacity of 2500 gallons been thinking about running the shower drain straight to the 600 gallon tank and using that water to fill the toilet tank. Maybe run a sump pump from storage tank to a barrel in the attic to reduce energy use on moving the water

[Teo9969]

I used my washing machine water to keep my lawn green over the last couple years ran washer drain into a barrel half filled with sand then pumped with sump pump into another barrel of sand and stored in a tank that I buryied in the ground holds around 600 gallons I also collect runoff from my roof in said container I then pump the water onto the lawn when needed or when full like ill be doing this weekend to make room for next weeks rains. I'm thinking about adding another storage tank but I need to find another container I can bury I'd like to have a storage capacity of 2500 gallons been thinking about running the shower drain straight to the 600 gallon tank and using that water to fill the toilet tank. Maybe run a sump pump from storage tank to a barrel in the attic to reduce energy use on moving the water

Damn...That's straight impressive.

[Romulack]

I used my washing machine water to keep my lawn green over the last couple years ran washer drain into a barrel half filled with sand then pumped with sump pump into another barrel of sand and stored in a tank that I buryied in the ground holds around 600 gallons I also collect runoff from my roof in said container I then pump the water onto the lawn when needed or when full like ill be doing this weekend to make room for next weeks rains. I'm thinking about adding another storage tank but I need to find another container I can bury I'd like to have a storage capacity of 2500 gallons been thinking about running the shower drain straight to the 600 gallon tank and using that water to fill the toilet tank. Maybe run a sump pump from storage tank to a barrel in the attic to reduce energy use on moving the water

So if I bring you a few coconuts and some parts off a wrecked boat, could you build me a computer?

[CaptDave]

I used my washing machine water to keep my lawn green over the last couple years ran washer drain into a barrel half filled with sand then pumped with sump pump into another barrel of sand and stored in a tank that I buryied in the ground holds around 600 gallons I also collect runoff from my roof in said container I then pump the water onto the lawn when needed or when full like ill be doing this weekend to make room for next weeks rains. I'm thinking about adding another storage tank but I need to find another container I can bury I'd like to have a storage capacity of 2500 gallons been thinking about running the shower drain straight to the 600 gallon tank and using that water to fill the toilet tank. Maybe run a sump pump from storage tank to a barrel in the attic to reduce energy use on moving the water

That is pretty darn impressive. I am still fooling around with how to best use a rain barrel I bought last year.....

[BBatesokc]

Just an FYI, Oklahoma - like I assume all states - has regulations for how 'gray water' is disposed.

I know some bill made it through the house in 2011 that relaxes private use/dispersal of gray water, but those looking to do the same thing may want to just make sure you're in compliance.

UPDATE: I did find this interesting link.... Gray Water Harvesting | Keep Oklahoma Beautiful

[law]

[QUOTE=ljbab728;633079]As usual, the facts don't support your theories.

As usual, is that really the best comment you have to add to the discussion?

[ljbab728]

[QUOTE=law;633811]

As usual, the facts don't support your theories.

As usual, is that really the best comment you have to add to the discussion?

At least I'm not making false statements here. LOL

Pointing out your inaccuracies absolutely does add to the discussion.

[law]

[QUOTE=ljbab728;633814]

At least I'm not making false statements here. LOL

Pointing out your inaccuracies absolutely does add to the discussion.

And what do you think is inaccurate?

[ljbab728]

[QUOTE=law;633816]

And what do you think is inaccurate?

I have made several posts in this thread pointing out inaccuracies. You're welcome to go back and read them. I'm not going to post them again.

[law]

[QUOTE=ljbab728;633819]

I have made several posts in this thread pointing out inaccuracies. You're welcome to go back and read them. I'm not going to post them again.

I made four statements that you implied were not true... which one is not true?

Most has been absorbed by the soil, and much of the run off is being held in farm terraces and stock ponds.

The OK Wildlife Fisheries people estimate the current depth of Canton Lake to be 5-12 ft. They expect about 5 ft of evaporation this summer. The fish are not safe. Predictions for a major fish kill have not changed.

Businesses here are reporting 2/3 drop in sales compared to last year at this time. Canton and nearby businesses are not safe. Tax revenues are down accordingly.

OKC residents should not need to run their sprinkler systems.

[ljbab728]

[QUOTE=law;633822]

I made four statements that you implied were not true... which one is not true?

Most has been absorbed by the soil, and much of the run off is being held in farm terraces and stock ponds.

The OK Wildlife Fisheries people estimate the current depth of Canton Lake to be 5-12 ft. They expect about 5 ft of evaporation this summer. The fish are not safe. Predictions for a major fish kill have not changed.

Businesses here are reporting 2/3 drop in sales compared to last year at this time. Canton and nearby businesses are not safe. Tax revenues are down accordingly.

OKC residents should not need to run their sprinkler systems.

I already stated that in my previous posts. I'm not going to rehash the points again.

[law]

[QUOTE=ljbab728;633823]

I already stated that in my previous posts. I'm not going to rehash the points again.

There are only four statements. You cannot disprove any of them because they are 100% true.

[ljbab728]

[QUOTE=law;633825]

There are only four statements. You cannot disprove any of them because they are 100% true.

LOL, you're cherry picking your statements. Try going back and reading post 583.

As for your listed statements, what I asked was for you to provide verifiable proof due to a history of inaccurate statements.

[law]

I have no history of inaccurate statements. You have a history of making unfounded accusations.

The water in Canton Lake is so shallow the Corps will not allow any boats of any kind on the lake.

You can think what you want, but OKC drew the water too soon. They have endangered (maybe destroyed) Canton Lake and limited their own water supply. If they had waited for the spring rains, they would have saved the water stored in Canton for future needs. OKC is committed to this path for better or worse.

[ljbab728]

I have no history of inaccurate statements. You have a history of making unfounded accusations.

The water in Canton Lake is so shallow the Corps will not allow any boats of any kind on the lake.

You can think what you want, but OKC drew the water too soon. They have endangered (maybe destroyed) Canton Lake and limited their own water supply. If they had waited for the spring rains, they would have saved the water stored in Canton for future needs. OKC is committed to this path for better or worse.

Obviously you didn't go back and review my post 583. There is nothing unfounded at all about what I said. The evidence is in the video. You may have forgotten that I told you more than once that I was not saying you had no reason to be concerned. I just didn't like inaccurate statements being used to express your concerns.

[law]

Obviously you didn't go back and review my post 583. There is nothing unfounded at all about what I said. The evidence is in the video. You may have forgotten that I told you more than once that I was not saying you had no reason to be concerned. I just didn't like inaccurate statements being used to express your concerns.

My statements are not inaccurate. Have you read the OCWP Executive Report? Do you know what the Water for 2060 Act is? Have you personally heard presentations about the drought by the USGS? OWRB? Ok Dept of Wildlife? Do you know how much water OKC uses each week? Do you know the inflows for Canton Lake? Do you know the stream inflows for the Beaver and North Canadian? Any meetings with Marsha Slaughter or the Corps of Engineers? If you want to get into real nuts and bolts of water resources, we can do that. Most here could care less. They are only interested in their personal faucet. If water comes out when they turn it on, they are good to go. Water is a finite resource, especially now, with our current situation. It is my hope and prayer that there is enough rain this summer to keep the fescue growers happy. The fish in Canton will not have a chance unless Canton rises several more feet. Maybe not then. There are many variables, especially wind and temps. Even if they make it thru the summer, they may die in the winter.

You would think we asked that you quit growing grass, cut down your trees, stomp on your shrubs, and crack your foundations. No one asked for anything like that. All we asked was that you try to conserve some water and wait as long as possible to draw the water. Give the spring rains a chance, because others are giving up everything so you can water your stupid fescue in the middle of a drought.

If you think I'm abrasive, you are 100% correct.

[ljbab728]

My statements are not inaccurate. Have you read the OCWP Executive Report? Do you know what the Water for 2060 Act is? Have you personally heard presentations about the drought by the USGS? OWRB? Ok Dept of Wildlife? Do you know how much water OKC uses each week? Do you know the inflows for Canton Lake? Do you know the stream inflows for the Beaver and North Canadian? Any meetings with Marsha Slaughter or the Corps of Engineers? If you want to get into real nuts and bolts of water resources, we can do that. Most here could care less. They are only interested in their personal faucet. If water comes out when they turn it on, they are good to go. Water is a finite resource, especially now, with our current situation. It is my hope and prayer that there is enough rain this summer to keep the fescue growers happy. The fish in Canton will not have a chance unless Canton rises several more feet. Maybe not then. There are many variables, especially wind and temps. Even if they make it thru the summer, they may die in the winter.

You would think we asked that you quit growing grass, cut down your trees, stomp on your shrubs, and crack your foundations. No one asked for anything like that. All we asked was that you try to conserve some water and wait as long as possible to draw the water. Give the spring rains a chance, because others are giving up everything so you can water your stupid fescue in the middle of a drought.

If you think I'm abrasive, you are 100% correct.

I provided you with verifiable proof of inaccurate statements you made. If you want to overlook that, it's up to you. Being abrasive won't change that. Please note that I never said everything you say is inaccurate, but past inaccuracies call your comments into question without proof.

[RadicalModerate]

so, law, are you a torea clone?
please sound a train whistle/horn if so.
if not then don't

=)

[OKCisOK4me]

The last 10 posts....classic. Law with the run around and ljbab with the 'shut yo mouth' routine!

I'm on lj's side. Law...just buck up to the facts. You and the other guy from Major County need to chill the f out. Yeah, we know that Canton has only filled 13% of what OKC took on the draw. We know that it killed your tourism (which doesn't really matter because you've based that tourism on a market that shouldn't have been applicable to what the lake was built for in the first place AND whether that was for Enid or OKC, you locals should have never expected the lake to be at capacity 247-0365 whether it was a 580 or a 405 code, lololol)!

[kevinpate]

I do not know much about fish in general. In my limited understanding, fish either need water to live in, or to be steamed in, or at a minimum to somewhat help hold the egg mixture so they can be breaded and fried.

So, if the live in part is in question due to evaporation, draw down, etc., what prospects exist to harvest the fish for eating (I'm assuming they aren't really pet material, but hey, if that's wrong, let's add pet pools to the mix.)

Seems a shame for the fish to go to waste instead of waist if it can be avoided, or to lil billy and susie Q's tanks if they are the cute variety in some manner.

[OKCRT]

I do not know much about fish in general. In my limited understanding, fish either need water to live in, or to be steamed in, or at a minimum to somewhat help hold the egg mixture so they can be breaded and fried.

So, if the live in part is in question due to evaporation, draw down, etc., what prospects exist to harvest the fish for eating (I'm assuming they aren't really pet material, but hey, if that's wrong, let's add pet pools to the mix.)

Seems a shame for the fish to go to waste instead of waist if it can be avoided, or to lil billy and susie Q's tanks if they are the cute variety in some manner.

I still say that everyone in OKC should go to Draper lake and fill a jug for Canton. We can all be repaid in fish.

[kevinpate]

I was by Draper on Wednesday, simply because I hadn't slipped by there in a while. Like many bodies of water in Oklahoma, Draper it looked like it still could use a few donated jugs rather than send some on to others.

[RadicalModerate]

Also Spracht Midtowner (apparently, one of the so-called "Liberal Elites"):

I disagree. I will water multiple times a day, law permitting this Summer to ensure a velvety carpet of thick, dark green fescue in my shaded back yard, with a solid stand of bermuda in the front yard receiving a similar amount. As a side bonus, the ground around my home will remain wet and my foundation will be more likely to remain in tact. We will pay our water bill dutifully. Do you know how great fescue feels on the feet in the summer months? Silky and cool. Love the stuff.

If Canton is drawn down so my yard can stay green, so be it. Just so long as my yard doesn't revert to the nasty red clay it was when I moved in.

I swear.. those folks never watered.

OKC does have a long term water plan. I honestly don't think any of you have a freaking clue what you are talking about. Between the Cantonites (Cantonians?) incessant whining and the constant speculation about how many acre feet the next rainfall is going to bring either lake's level up or lack thereof will bring it down or others' crazy alarmist statements prognosticating doom and gloom and strife because of a lack of a plan for the city's future needs, this discussion is just silly. Hefner is only one tiny piece of OKC's long-term water plan, and yes, that may very well involve a lot of draw downs of Lake Canton, which now exists only to provide Oklahoma City water and to provide for flood control in NW Oklahoma. No one has the right to ski and fish at Lake Canton, we allow you to use it for that simply because we have nowhere else to put the water.

Canton just really doesn't have room to gritch here. You have a free lake. If you have a business which depends on that lake, boy you sure look dumb for having your business depend on something not happening which was inevitably going to happen--a draw down during a drought. Who could ever have seen that coming in a state which just under 100 years ago had the freakin' dust bowl

God's blessing? It's a man made lake. Are you suggesting now that the Army Corps of Engineers is composed of choirs of angels? That hasn't been my experience. And for what it's worth, I'm a great neighbor. I don't leave my dog out at night barking, I keep my yard cut and my flower beds nice and we don't have cacti or succulents or any of that hippy stuff growing in our neighborhood. Just good old fashion suburbia.

I suspect he is storing up wampum to make sure that neither he nor his precious lawn get scalped.
BTW: It's xeriscaping, not zero scaping. Perhaps if you would share the address of your pet lawn a "piss-in" could be organized to help keep it green. =)