Wheeler District

[Bullbear]

I mean the one in London is bigger

[Bellaboo]

The High Roller in Vegas is 50 feet taller than the Chase Tower..think about that......tallest in the world.

[2Lanez]

Ferris Wheels are "the thing" now. Santa Monica, and London's are the most recognized and now Orlando, Miami, and another US city(I forgot which one) is getting them in addition to Las Vegas--which I believe is currently the largest in the world--and that isn't including the international cities that are getting them or already have them.

If memory serves right, the UAE or Saudi Arabia will have the largest one in a few years.

That's not bad company...

[jerrywall]

I was in Branson over Memorial Day weekend and they just got a new Ferris Wheel that is 2-3 times bigger than Wheeler's. Not to be a downer, but perhaps this project isn't as unique as we once thought.

As others have pointed out, there's more to this than size. However, if you're talking about the wheel they got from Chicago earlier this year, it's not 2-3 times the Wheeler's district wheel. It is larger, but not even twice as large.

[Dustin]

As others have pointed out, there's more to this than size.

Exactly. This is anchoring a neighborhood. Plus, our ferris wheel has history.

[Urbanized]

Good grief. This is to be an exceptional walkable, mixed-use neighborhood that happens to have a ferris wheel as an amenity and bookend, NOT a giant amusement that happens to have a neighborhood nearby. peoples' priorities get so out of whack on here sometimes.

[Urbanized]

Is this a pissing contest to see who has the bigger ferris wheel?

It is definitely unique in that it was the original ferris wheel from the Santa Monic Pier amusement park. Also... Why would anything going on in Branson be a valid comparison for developments in a large city?

I wouldn't waste my time. He has some sort of allegiance to the "Strawberry Fields" idea that was mentioned online a few months ago, and has been nitpicking Wheeler at least since that point. I stop short of calling Strawberry Fields a development or a plan, because to date all that has shown up is a website with some photos of other places; sortof an inspiration board I guess. To date I'm not aware of an actual plan of any type. Not that it matters; there is plenty of room for both and no reason to pit them against one another. Just saying that I think you're shouting into the wind if you're trying to reason or debate with him on the topic of Wheeler.

[krisb]

A few comments in response to the Ferris Wheel dialogue:
1) The Wheeler District is great and I would love to live there someday. Because I care about this project, I reserve the right to have an opinion about their marketing/PR efforts as well as the size and scale of the landmark Ferris Wheel.
2) You're right, Branson isn't a big city (although Branson Landing has several blocks of New Urbanist development that would make Blair Humphreys drool). So why do they have a much larger Ferris Wheel than we do? Of course ours has history (so does Branson's, used to be at Navy Pier in Chicago) but no one is really going to know or care about the history just passing through. At first glance it's pretty small and, as I said, perhaps not quite as exciting or unique as we once thought (the Ferris Wheel itself, not the entire development). That's not to say that it isn't going to be super cool. And size does matter when so many other cities have Ferris Wheels on a much larger scale. Remember all of the discussions on here about the height of the Devon Tower and what it means for our status as a city?
3) I'm not sure what "allegiance" I have to Strawberry Fields other than I thought their website was more informative and inspiring than Wheeler's. Again, we're just sharing thoughts and perspectives. There is no need to frame these discussions as some kind of personal, adversarial debate. That's overkill, don't you think?

[krisb]

The project is more than a Ferris wheel.

Indeed. I was only referring to the Ferris Wheel project within the larger project :-)

[dcsooner]

Indeed. I was only referring to the Ferris Wheel project within the larger project :-)

Don't hold your breath for the rest of it. No disrespect to BH, don't know him but he appears to be a honest and sincere man who loves OKC , but he doesn't impress me as a big time developer capable of seeing this entire project to fruition .

[krisb]

Good grief. This is to be an exceptional walkable, mixed-use neighborhood that happens to have a ferris wheel as an amenity and bookend, NOT a giant amusement that happens to have a neighborhood nearby. peoples' priorities get so out of whack on here sometimes.

No one is questioning the potential awesomeness of the neighborhood. Most people, however, will not live in or visit the neighborhood itself. Their only interaction will be driving from the suburbs to take their kids to the Ferris Wheel or passing through on I-40. The Chamber and City will brag about the Ferris Wheel as a city landmark and the neighborhood will be a footnote except to discerning urbanists like yourself. Most people are content to take pictures of the Brooklyn Bridge without actually going to Brooklyn.

[catch22]

Don't hold your breath for the rest of it. No disrespect to BH, don't know him but he appears to be a honest and sincere man who loves OKC , but he doesn't impress me as a big time developer capable of seeing this entire project to fruition .

He'll get it done.

[Urbanized]

Don't hold your breath for the rest of it. No disrespect to BH, don't know him but he appears to be a honest and sincere man who loves OKC , but he doesn't impress me as a big time developer capable of seeing this entire project to fruition .

Funny how "I don't mean any disrespect to.." Is usually followed by something that diminishes someone else.

Blair is more than honest and sincere; he has a master's degree in urban planning from M.I.T. and was founding Director of the OU Institute for Quality Communities. And despite the fact that he is the development lead on this project his father - an experienced real estate developer and former mayor - is deeply involved, and he has the support and experience of his brother, who is somehow managing to build a successful New Urbanist community on the shores of Lake Eufaula.

His master plan is from Dover Kohl Partners, probably the most preeminent urban planning firm in the country. And as has been previously mentioned, other experienced builders and developers are also involved, including Richard McKown, who has build highly successful multi-family mixed use downtown and whose family business is Ideal Homes, which last I looked was the largest Oklahoma-based home builder, with developments across the state.

They have exceptional financial resources available. They have the support of the City. So...what exactly about this equation leads you to believe the project won't be seen through?

[David]

Don't hold your breath for the rest of it. No disrespect to BH, don't know him but he appears to be a honest and sincere man who loves OKC , but he doesn't impress me as a big time developer capable of seeing this entire project to fruition .

Oh yeah, can't trust that Humphreys family to do anything big.

[Bellaboo]

The Pacific Wheel did get an upgrade in lighting, with thousands of LED's. Should look great on the water. We should know in about a month.

[catcherinthewry]

So...what exactly about this equation leads you to believe the project won't be seen through?

Maybe the fact that they are 10+ years in and all they have to show is a ferris wheel and a metalic OKC. Not exactly moving fast on this development.

[catch22]

Maybe the fact that they are 10+ years in and all they have to show is a ferris wheel and a metalic OKC. Not exactly moving fast on this development.

Rome was not built in a day. We seem to forget that we criticize so many developments for taking the fast-build, and not looking to the future. This development is taking the long-approach, seeing what works and what doesn't. They want the plan to change for the better as they build. If they wanted to plop 350 houses, and 4 mega apartment complexes down at once, they could do it. But the result may not be something that actually functions how they intend it to.

[Urbanized]

Maybe the fact that they are 10+ years in and all they have to show is a ferris wheel and a metalic OKC. Not exactly moving fast on this development.

Wow. The Wheeler plan - and Blair's leadership of the project - is two years old. You're going to go all the way back to when Kirk bought the land as a speculative investment (and clearly stated ther was no plan yet for it)? Seems pretty intellectually dishonest to me.

[Urbanized]

By the way, this is the downside of so much publicity, public involvement and transparency. If this was a gated subdivision in Deer Creek or Mustang, we would all be blissfully unaware as the developer acquired the farmland on which he planned to build, had it rezoned, had engineering work done, infrastructure work done, contracts let. That whole process might take a couple of years, but we wouldn't know about it, because it is mostly out of the public's eye. And of course, THAT developer might have owned the raw land for years, too. But who would care?

Some of us MIGHT know there was an addition coming when we drove past as they started to cut streets, but likely wouldn't know exactly what was going on. And many STILL wouldn't notice until the houses started framing. Even then, it likely wouldn't be evident to anyone not driving past. It might have a thread in a community forum on this board, but not too many people concerning themselves with it.

And then one day you might drive past, see a dozen homes up and say "hey! When did THAT happen?" All the while not knowing that it took years to get to that point.

But Wheeler is under a microscope. Even the original speculative real estate transaction garnered press (and a thread on this board). Not to mention that this development has all sorts of complexities that a farmer's field in Deer Creek would never have. Significant exceptions to standard zoning. Pushback from Public Works on narrowing streets. Homes built using materials and techniques not as familiar to local tradespeople. It involves removal of old infrastructure and probably some hazardous materials/environmental remediation.

It also involves multi family and mixed use, AND commercial, which basically NEVER happens in the aforementioned subdivisions. It involves planning for a school.

All of these things require TONS of work behind the scenes, yet we are sitting here behind our keyboards expecting houses to magically start popping out of the ground like we THINK they do in the suburbs. And denigrating the developer when they don't.

[Rover]

Urbanized, you are correct. So many want to be "in" on everything, but most have no idea all that goes into development. Everyone should be glad it's being done in the right way.

[Urbanized]

By contrast, someone just posted in the Steelyard thread and commented on how fast that development is coming together. It was announced over a year before Wheeler even hosted its design charrettes, and though it had similar (if not more pronounced) environmental, regulatory and public financing challenges, it is also a fraction the size and has nowhere near as many moving parts as Wheeler.

Chisholm Creek, a much more straightforward commercial development, was also announced three years ago, and is still in its infancy from a completion standpoint. And rest assured the planning for Chisholm Creek was probably going on behind thes scenes for a year or two before plans were made public.

[catcherinthewry]

Wow Urbanized, feeling a little sensitive about this project? You asked what might lead one to believe that this project might not be seen through and you get an answer you don't like then you get all defensive. Am I wrong that this project is moving slowly? Here's a quote from The Oklahoman from 10+ years ago:

Grant Humphreys said they envision a mixed-use master-planned development that could include offices, housing, hotels and retail. He said a master planner will be hired within the next year.

So the Master Plan is "only" 2 years old, what happened in the 7 years between hiring a master planner and the master plan? Is it really intellectually dishonest to think that is moving slowly? Heck, the Devon Tower was announced 2 1/2 years after this and has been occupied for four years now. Plus how many projects over the last 10 years have been announced in OKC and never came to fruition? Quite a few, right? It is only natural to think that there may be problems with such an unprecedented project of such magnitude when it is moving so slowly.

I, personally, am a big fan of this project and think it would be great for the city, but am doubtful that the original master plan will ever be realized for this reason - the time line for this project is so long that there will be many of unforeseen events that will affect its development. That doesn't mean that Humphreys can't adapt and adjust his plan, it just means that it very probable that the end product looks quite a bit different than the proposed product.

And you would have to have your head in the sand not to admit that this project may not even come close to being finished. I drive through neighborhoods every day that have streets blocked off that were supposed to lead to rest of the master plan, but were never finished. And those neighborhoods were a lot less ambitious than the Wheeler District.

Like I said before, I like the plan and applaud Humphreys for his ambition and his vision, but I doubt he foresaw a Great Recession and oil prices bottoming out and the loss of so many high paying jobs. Things happen that we have no control over so if you're going to get so defensive when you get a plausible answer to why this project might not be seen through maybe you shouldn't ask that question.

[Teo9969]

Catcher,

If I'm not mistaken they came out at some point and pretty well said that they were shifting their attention to other projects around the time of the economic downturn in 2008 (which, by the way is "what happened in the 7 years between"). They, like many developers/ments got back on track around 2011/2012.

[Laramie]

Ten year ago was 2006. We all know what happened 2 year later around 2008; many projects were shelved and some done away with altogether.

What's important, the former downtown air park will begin its development transition and construction with a Ferris wheel that will be flashed during Oklahoma City Thunder NBA nationally televised games.

Oklahoma City continues to build despite the energy sectors downturn. Next year, you'll see the 27 story BOK Park Plaza Tower 'top off' next to the Devon Energy Tower (fuller panoramic skyline) along with the color of the Ferris wheel & Skydance Bridge.

OKC continues its Big League transition...

[PhiAlpha]

Don't hold your breath for the rest of it. No disrespect to BH, don't know him but he appears to be a honest and sincere man who loves OKC , but he doesn't impress me as a big time developer capable of seeing this entire project to fruition .

Why is that?