I just got back from San Francisco a few weeks ago and it's still bothering me. I've never seen so many homeless people in my life. It's so sad...

What do you think can be done to help these people? And I don't need to hear the typical Oklahoma responses like "get a job" or "quit drinking". Most of these people were mentally ill. It was pretty obvious. The lazy people can stay homeless as far as I am concerned. But watching all of these people sleep outside because the shelters were full...

It really just blows my mind that we are the richest country in the world and this goes on.

We can't lock them up unless they're a danger to themselves or others.

It is generally their choice to be on the streets... and yes, "get a job" and "quit drinking/doing drugs" are also two viable alternatives for most of them.

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i have a modest proposal.

-M

The fact that you saw so many homeless people in San Francisco is because the city is somehow condusive to having them be there. It is not just something in the water. I was there in 1996 and had the same reaction as you - it just blew me away that there were so many. Other cities manage to avoid having that many lying in the streets and parks and I am willing to wager that it is not just because mental illness is more prevalent in the Bay area.

San Francisco is a very socially liberal and wealthy town. If, indeed, those multitles are mentally ill, the city is set up to provide services if it wants to do so. Frankly, I suspect that the reason you saw so many is precisely BECAUSE the city provides services that other towns do not.

Probably 75% of the mentally ill could be helped with appropriate medication (I am making up the statistic but I know it is high) but many won't take it, which is frequently part of the disease. Most of them would be eligle for SSI if they are diagnosed with a serious mental illness and that would cover their medication costs. My guess is that the city probably offers some "incentives" beyond medical. Maybe they consider themselves to be a santuary city for the mentally ill as they are for illegal aliens. If that is what they are doing (and I am only wondering), and not moving them along on vagrancy charges, I don't think they are doing those poor souls any favors. The mentally ill on the street are lambs for the predators. No one wants to criminalize mentally ill people but warehousing them in the parks (and that is what they are doing) is just a low-cost way to... well... warehouse them.

It is sad but the fact is, they are probably there because it is the most advantageous place they've found. Short of locking the mentally ill among them up in an institution, which is how they would have been treated 100 years ago, this may be the best they can hope for if they won't take their meds.

It is a tragedy. And a disgrace.

Well said, East Coast Okie. No one seems to know what to do with the mentally ill. With so many mental health funding cuts, it feels like we'll never be able to provide the help these individuals need.

I live in San Diego,CA. We have a moderate problem,
Our city is not as bad as San Franfreako YET.
They are a homeless sanctuary city.
The board there, (city Council) has passed many ord. to keep them around.
In an effort to be C o m p a s s i o n a t e.
I n reality they are hurting the health and well being of all of the citizens on San Fran freako.
The city can not keep up with the demand.
Human pigeon's is what one person called the Mayors plan.
It is symbolism over substance.

Oh Obviously! What? Just because someone doesn't act like you or make the same choices as you doesn't necessarily make them mentally ill.

Because homeless people are lazy? No... Wait... All lazy people are homeless? ... No... Wait... that doesn't work either.

Let's ask Chris Gardner whether he was lazy or just down on his luck.

Guess you've never been homeless. Getting a job without one isn't a truly viable alternative.

Guess you've never been addicted to drugs/alcohol. Stopping isn't all that easy, especially when you are homeless.

Some empathy, please, people....

There are plenty of jobs you can get without experience. Sure, they're not sexy jobs, but if folks can cross the border, not even speaking english and get jobs, then so can our homeless folks.

Not easy for someone with no self-control, self-respect or self-discipline.

At some point, someone else's problems have to be someone else's problems. I have my own problems to be responsible for, my own debts to pay. All I ask is that people be responsible for themselves. If they fail to do that, why are they suddenly entitled to my "empathy"?

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<evil laugh> Mwaaahahahah haaa! </evil laugh>
I was just trying to explain Swift's essay to one of my youngun's. He thinks I made it up.

Services are available to these people. Some choose to get help and some don't. If you are interested in helping them, go tour the City Rescue Mission or the Salvation Army facility downtown. They always have needs that someone with financial resources could meet or volunteer opportunities if you are so inclined.

The idea that the "homeless problem" is something that could be solved permanently is erroneous. America's personal freedoms and liberties mean that if someone wants to stay drunk and sleep under a bridge they can usually continue to do that until they kill themselves. It makes me sad, too.

It was pretty obvious when they talked to the birds flying by, ranted about the end of the world, etc. Defintely not all, but most. Some could be under the influence of drugs/alcohol.

I feel like I have lived a sheltered life after seeing that. Until you see people living like that in person, it's easy to generalize and stereotype. Just makes me realize how good I have it.

Bretthexum.
Now you have it.
Be thankful for every day your vertical.
Living in SoCal. We have our share, this is why I miss OKLA. so much.
It is great there.
I have helped at the Father Joe's Mission here and tried to speak to many of the people who they help. There is a man in our church who used to be one of those guys.
He told me it is a choice you make.
He knew it was a choice.
He chose Meth. He chose to walk away from it and live again.
It Is a Choice. We are still pro choice right?

There used to be services and shelter available to the mentally ill. The Reagan administration decided they were either all faking or being punished by God, so they were literally turned out on the street.

A lot of people thought that was a great idea until the people being cut off from those services and medication started living in the alleys and porticos of their businesses.

Talking about the situation does no good, if it makes you feel good then get after it. If not jump in there and help. Not all homeless people are addicted to Drugs and/or alcohol nor are they Mentally Ill. A lot of them (high percentage) have made bad choices in life and "stumbled". They don't know how to get up and try again due to embarassment, Cleanliness Challenges, Clothing that is not Garage Sale Trash....they need a little help. Now, don't get me wrong there are plenty of weirdos on the streets but even they deserve to be treated kindly. The men of our Church try to help where ever they can. I don't mean the "Bleeding Hearts" club. I'm talking about the men that just want another chance....Wouldn't you want another chance if you made mistake? If you feel for this, go and buy some clean socks and underwear and give to someone living on the streets....I'm saying money nor just taking them in your home.......Just give them a chance...Spend $ 10.00 at Wal-Mart and watch there eyes light up......They need help not Talk.

See ya next time:.... Oh yeah, if you want to bash me go ahead but come down and help...

Another real way to help (even though it's a tiny drop in the bucket) is to carry boxes of granola bars in your car. When you see someone panhandling on the corner give them a granola bar.

I was speaking to a former homeless person and asked his opinion on that. He said that a granola bar would have done him real good many times.

2 cents...

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Wrong! The House decides creates all spending bills, not the president. By the way, democrats ruled the house of mis-representatives during that time. They found more important pork barrel projects to spend away the nearly tripled revenues from those wonderful tax cuts.

I wonder what would happen if all the people who are so worried about the derelicts and transients walked the talk? That is, put their money where their mouth is. I've certainly done my share.

Was it the democrat convention in Boston 2004 when the dems had the transients and derelicts moved to another street so they wouldn't be seen and bother the attendees?

I have no idea if you are a Christian or not... which is going to be exactly my point: I've noticed too many people out there, so-called CHRISTIANS even, saying this kind of thing. "God helps those who help themselves." Really... what verse is that again? I hope to God someone gives of his or her time, money and love to help people who have little to no direction in their lives.

That verse isn't in the Bible, maybe you implied. Ben Franklin said it. God doesn't help those who help themselves. It's a misconception.

So-called Christians aren't Christians. People will say they are because they aren't hindi or buddhists or something.

There are many opportunities for us to give of ourselves and our resources. Give to a local food pantry, go to a shelter and serve and stop thinking it's the governments job.


Walking the talk is the first step.

There is really no comparison between the poor of Biblical times and the poor of today. In those days, poverty was an accident of birth. You were born into a poor family, or to the wrong ethic group and you were poor, a slave, or worse. The difference between the poor of yesterday and the poor of today was that the poor of yesteryear had no impact and could have no impact on their societal standing. Education and opportunity did not exist.

Today, in the United States, our poor suffer from an obesity epidemic. They are afforded free health care, free education, dozens of programs, a G.I. Bill if they choose to go that route, dozens of scholarships to help those in worse-off socio-economic and racial situations get a leg up. If they do not avail themselves of these things, that is their problem, it shouldn't be mine.

In the good 'ol days, the government didn't take from the rich and provide social services, it figured that starvation was as good as any way to go, and that if nothing else, it was a good motivator for someone to find work or join the army.

To say that the Bible's definition of "poor" has any bearing on the poor in the United States is obscenely short-sighted and ignores quite a bit of history.

American poor bitch about not being able to afford the service plans for the Iphone. That is not poor.

As for the homeless, they are merely the poor who of their own free will chose not to avail themselves of the opportunities in one of the most opportunity-laden economies in the world. That's right -- their problem, not mine.

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This is so ironic.
Swear this is true.
Went to lunch here on the left coast, late today.
There is a guy who stand near the trolley stop who limps when he approaches the cars, has the sign Vietnam vet anything can help....
A Lincoln SUV pulls up, does not give him money, he walks (without limp) gets in another guy with cardboard sign gets out. They drive off.
Could not believe it.
I am going to get a camera in the next day or to in order to prove this.

Sorry I failed to include this part, still worked up.
I told the owner of the deli what happened. He has seen that too, says he sees the guy riding his bike on weekends.

Statistic after statistic tells us that many of the homeless are mentally ill. There is a huge difference, to my way of thinking, with someone who has an organic brain disease like extreme bi-polar or schiezophrenia. Neither one of those conditions springs from lifestyle choices or substance abuse (although certainly, substance abuse, i.e., self medicating, tends to exacerbate their condition). When they are talking to birds and so forth, it is a safe bet that they are probably schiezophrenic or something equally nasty, poor things. These are exactly the souls who used to be institutionalized for most of their lives even as recently as the early 1900's. Psychotropic medications are sometimes wonder drugs for those folks.

These people have my complete compassion. I don't think you can compare them to drunks, addicts, bums or the like. I am not saying that you shouldn't have compassion for the drunks and addicts, but I can understand why some might feel that way. A drunk or an addict has some control over the situation, if only enough control to ask for help. Those with cognitive mental illnesses and extreme bi-polar are at the mercy of a malfunctioning brain. They are genuinely stark raving mad in the classic sense of the word. There is no more a moral component to that than someone who has epilepsy.

Oh, and let me mention that they did a documentary on some bum in DC a number of years ago. He would come beg during tourist season. He had a complete pension, was NOT mentally ill, and was bringing down over $100,000.00 a year. This guy was a complete scam artist. He gives real bums a bad name.

My husband passes the L'Enfant Bum, daily (he has staked out a spot in L'Enfant Plaze in DC) . He has been there for longer than my husband has worked here (ten years). Husband hears him ask tourists to help a poor homeless man out and he rakes it in. Husband hears him talking in his "down time" with his buddies about all the music equipment he has in his apartment. He is no more homeless than I am. He is just a con.

Now, the guy that doesn't wear pants in the area? I 'spect he really is a bum.

I looked up 2 Thessalonians 3:10 and it says:

While we were with you, we gave this order: "If anyone doesn't want to work, he shouldn't eat." (International Standard Version)

For even when we were with you, we used to give you this order: if anyone is not willing to work, then he is not to eat, either. (New American Standard)

For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat. (King James)

For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, If any will not work, neither let him eat. (American Standard)

I think this is the Christian response - at least it is biblical, anyway.

See this link: 2 Thessalonians 3:10

Did you know that street beggars can make $75,000 a year and not have to pay taxes? It's big business. Try asking one of them if they want to work or offer to take then to lunch. They won't leave that corner for anything. Just going to lunch could cost them $100. Imagine what going to work would do.

About 25 years ago there was an evening news item (See BS or ABC etc...) about the street/subway musicians in NYC and DC. Almost every one of them said they made between 30K to 50K and didn't pay taxes.

That was 25 years ago. I wonder what they're making now?

I have been thinking east coast and prune,
I was going to dress down and get a sign, Desert Storm Vet...
to see how people treat me and how much I can make, I will donate it.
Don't know if I can muster the courage to do it.
It flies in the face of everything my parents put in me.

Home is where the heart is, so if they have a heart they are not homeless. If they don't have a heart, they are zombies.. kill them.

Problem solved.