Suprised no one had started a Biden thread yet. What are your thoughts on him? As a conservative, I love it. Big time lib. His age will nuetralize the," McCain is too old" strategy.

He's perfect. He can run a hell of a good "dirty" campaign while allowing the savior-in-chief to keep his hands clean.

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I thought about starting this thread this morning, but got sidetracked and forgot. While my preference would have been for Bill Richardson, Biden is also a good pick. As said, he knows how to pick a fight, and win it. But more than that, he is a great diplomat, and will offer a boost to Obama's lack of foreign experience. On the downside, he has been a senator for a long time, and kind of negates the "Change" platform..

McCain will attack as hard as possible now, because Biden is going to bring the Rust Belt into play much more so than before. I too would have like Richardson as the VP...but I really think he will be the first choice for Secretary of State.

Obama needed an attack dog, he got the best right now. McCain will keep pulling out old quotes to put a split between then, but it doesn't really look like that will be a problem.

We'll need to see who McCain picks. If he plays to the base and takes Romney or another ultra conservative, he's done. If he takes Lieberman, its game on.

Either way this is going to be a fun campaign to watch. Bidon eases my mind on the foriegn affairs front, and also gives Obama someone who will keep him in check and call him out. McCain is a different story. I say there is a 60% chance he is only going for one term...so who ever his VP is, is actually getting a 4 year head start.

Colorado, Nevada, and Virginia look like this year's toss ups. If things remain trending like they are, that means Obama needs either CO or VA, or NV plus one of the others to win.

Either way, the polls are going to be crazy the next two weeks. Obama likely will get a bump today, and then the typical convention bump this week. McCain will get a bump Friday with his VP announcement, and then a bump the following week after the RNC.

About the only thing certain...Oklahoma will be red this year. LOL Other than that, it's going to be fun going forward.

I'll be watching the conventions as much as I can, then go through each of the key issues and see who stands where and then make a decision. Imagine if every voter do that instead of just blind party voting or based off what the guy next to them said.

Biden, Helps in some states.
Hurts in some ways, met him and worked around him on some projects.
I am certain I will have to explain to some knee jerk liberals.
He actually opens the door for McCain if he is smart enough to recognize it.
Currently it is the all Senate boys club.
I was looking forward to Hillary. Although many know I am a conservative the election is now poss. not a slam dunk for B. Obama.
Here is a great pick for McCain, (watch this freak the Conservs)
Joe Liberman, He negates the East coast pull Biden has.
He pulls Hillary supporters in areas, pulls the Jewish vote, takes away the change line. McCain would be the guy offering across the party line change.
just some thoughts that will get both sides fired up. I am not trolling. I have working relationship with both the Senate and House.

I think if he does go for Joe, we may end up seeing a very strong divide of the GOP. Really the two current parties have stood pretty damn long, so we are about do for some changes.

The problem with coming from the Senate — and this applies to both Biden and McCain — is that somewhere in the record, there will always be votes that a candidate wishes he could undo, or that can be presented in a misleading way that embarrasses the candidate.

Personally, I think it's more important to have a Secretary of State and National Security Adviser with international affairs expertise, and I'm more interested in Obama's cabinet choices than his v.p.

Although Biden is 65, he 'acts' younger — more like a guy in his forties and fifties. Lieberman has turned in a scolding old granny, regardless of his age. A McCain/Lieberman ticket is going to look like the remake of "Grumpy Old Men."

Wow. The whole appeal of Obama was that he was a different kind of politician, one who was civil and above the frey. I appreciated that - I just hate the hypocritical, mean spirited, partisan crap we are deluged with. Although I have far more conservative views than Obama, what he has seemingly brought to the table has intrigued me. My thought, until now, has been that if he is elected our next president, there are a lot of down sides but potentially, a whole lot of good sides and I can live with it and support him as my president.

I was really unhappy to hear the old-time partisan, hateful comments coming from Biden. Same old, same old. The unique attributes of Obama that I really admire and have thought would be so good for this country if he is elected no longer exist. I just feel like in choosing Biden, he threw away everything that made him different. I am disappointed because I think he sold out. All that is left is a far left liberal with little experience who is just as willing to get mean and hateful to get what he wants as the next guy. By choosing Biden, he adopts Biden's pitbull, partisan stance. Obama can't stand back and sic him on others and still keep his hands clean. I keep hearing that the "role" of the vice presidential candidate in an election is to be the mean one which allows the presidential candidate to remain above it all. Isn't that just the same old/same old? Doesn't that just say that Obama is just like the other politicians? And to hear Biden attack a FRIEND for political purposes... Hard to get to inspired over that.

At the same time, I don't know who would have been a better choice. There is not much to choose from, given the type of politician Obama claimed to be. No matter who is elected, I will support him. All the same, my sense that "no matter who is elected we will be okay," is gone. Let's see if I get back my optimism over the next couple of months.

> see if I get back my optimism

Good luck with that. my optimism left long enough ago it doesn't even send me postcards anymore.

Biden was the perfect pick. While he is a long-time senator who is the Senate's foremost expert on foreign policy, he has an outsider's appeal. He doesn't have a Washington house. He commutes on public transportation everyday from his one home in Delaware. He is the outsider's insider, which is a perfect pick for Obama's message.

ECO I have a few of the same concerns you do. I'm not sure it can really be avoided. McCain has been slamming him nonstop for the last few weeks - so much for no negative campaigning. The poll numbers showed his lead falling, so a call had to be made. Unfortunately negativity and fear still wins elections. We'll see how this goes...but I too was excited to see a campaign of issues and not slams.

Fox News is so stupid. They did speak out to say what their message was, F*** Fox News. America would be much better off without Fox News.

That's awesome. Pure attention and raitings stunt. Fox News is always viewed as the ultra-right biased news wing...the others on the left...and one of their reporters think that the ultra liberals will really want to talk to them?

'Oh no, I can't believe they are being like that.' 'They want freedom of speech but won't talk to us.' 'Why won't they treat us with respect.'

Personally... Bill O should have been out there, I would pay money to see th reaction he would have got. LOL

They did talk to them though, they said "F-YOU!" That is a totally valid point.

Fox News just wouldn't listen.

Oh ya, and not everyone there is ultra-liberal... that is just what Fox News wants you to think. I would be there in Denver now, but I have too much stuff to be doing at work right now.

Yea, I agree. Anyone who dissents from the left wing democrat talking points should be banned!! Hitler would be so proud!! Diversity?? I think CNN, NBC, ABC, MSNBC, CBS are all in the tank for Obama but I don't want them off the air. Just be objective journalist and report the news. For the most part part the majority of the time they are cheerleaders for any democrat. Hear much about Mark Foley lately? They pounded that negative story every night leading up to the election and mission accomplished the democrats took over congress with a handful of 'conservative' democrats. I am sure the old media has a "Mark Foley" they will pull out come October. Foxnews??? Give me a break!!

Nice Godwin there.

Been awhile since we had a Godwin instead of a Kernhart.

Nobody from the media put a gun to Mark Foley's head and forced him to hit on recently-graduated House pages. That was his own decision.

Nobody from the media forced Newt Gingrich or Bob Livingston — or John McCain — to cheat on their wives. Nobody from the media forced Bill Bennett to blow EIGHT MILLION DOLLARS on Atlantic City slot machines.

Nobody from the media forced the White House to give a press pass to a prostitute and let him pose during presidential press conferences as a 'conservative' reporter.

Nobody from the media forced Ted Haggard to buy methamphetamine from a prostitute.

These self-styled moral imperators churned all this up on their own. The ironic part is that the Republican party has demonstrated over the past twelve years that it is the most morally bankrupt and hypocritical organization in this country, and yet evangelicals and social conservatives keep sucking up to it in the hope that some day, one genuine theocrat will emerge to give them their Iran-style republic.

As for that live shot... that looked like some sort of Steven Colbert skit. I don't which is funnier... chipmunk reporter Griff Jenkins 'confronting' the 'extreme leftists,' or the anchordroid back in the studio attempting to make this half-baked street theater look like an urgent news event.

Lol, it is some sort of technique they use bornhere.

There is another clip where Fox News "taking fire" from Russian soldiers in Georgia. It was obviously over dramatized and there was no gunfire or soldiers in any of the footage.

They try to make people look bad by acting like they are being victimized. He talked about being roughed up in the clip but if he was roughed up and they had cameras, why didn't they show it to us?

My ex-wife does the same thing in court... "He scares me", etc.

Bornhere, I was talking about media bias and slanted coverage of events. Not hypocritical politicians. The Democrats have their share. You know all the names. I am disgusted with the Republican Party and have not sent them a dime this election cycle. That said, Obama scares the hell out of me. Toadrax, I believe all media tends to sensationalize events and sometimes blow them out of proportion for ratings. I was only responding to your statement America would be better w/o Fox. They are an alternative to the old media which leans to the left. Is it possible for any liberal to respond to a conservative without arrogant condescension? You can only hope one day all of us can be as "intelligent".

The White House isn't telling any of the other stations what to report and what the talking points should be.

Fox isn't news, it is propoganda.

But certainly not CNN (Communist News Network) or PMSNBC, right?

Those stations are biased, but they at least have news.

Maybe you never took a journalism class so you miss the point... if the government sends you something you simply say, "We received this from the government." and it is no big deal. Fox doesn't do that. That is what makes it propaganda.

Imagine if Brad Henry was telling the Daily Oklahoman what articles to put in the paper..

"Maybe you never took a journalism class so you miss the point... if the government sends you something you simply say, "We received this from the government." and it is no big deal. Fox doesn't do that."

So, because some Scott McClellan says to Chrissy Matthews (the guy who says Obama gives him a thrill up his leg) on PMSNBC says that FOX News gets information from the White House you automatically assume it's true? Didn't you see where Scott backtracked and admitted he wasn't totally truthful when he told Chrissy that?

Here is the full interview he gave on Matthew's show and the his backtracking as well that was posted on the National Review website Media Blog on National Review Online

Tuesday, July 29, 2008

McClellan Flips and Flops [Greg Pollowitz]
On Friday, Scott McClellan let loose on Hardball with this bombshell allegation:

MATTHEWS: Did you see FOX television as a tool when you were in the White House, as a useful avenue for getting your message out?

MCCLELLAN: Well, I make a distinction between the journalists and between the commentators. Certainly, there were commentators and others, pundits, at FOX News that were helpful to the White House.

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLELLAN: Certainly, we got talking points...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLELLAN: ... those people.

MATTHEWS: Did people say, call Sean, call Bill, call whoever? Did you do that as a regular thing?

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLELLAN: Certainly. Certainly. It wasn‘t necessarily something I was doing, but it was something that we at the White House, yes, were doing and getting them talking points and making sure they knew where we were coming from.

MATTHEWS: So, you were giving them talking points...

(CROSSTALK)

MCCLELLAN: But I would separate the journalists.

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: No, no, this is important.

MCCLELLAN: Yes.

MATTHEWS: You were using these commentators as your spokespeople?

MCCLELLAN: Well, certainly. I mean, certainly. I think that happens to both ways, when people go on other networks, as well, that are—that are favorable towards Democrats and so forth.

Olbermann jumped all over it:

OLBERMANN: That Rupert Murdoch put neocons on the air under the leadership of GOP operative Roger Ailes is no secret, but FOX has always maintained with more or less a straight face, that it was striving for some sort of journalistic objectivity.

Over the phone tonight, Scott McClellan told us it was done frequently, especially on high-profile issues and COUNTDOWN asked whether FOX ever gave the White House its results. Scott said, “Yes.”

We asked the White House about McClellan‘s statements on HARDBALL, current press secretary, Dana Perino said, quote, “I‘m not aware of that” and declined to comment further.

Now, it seems, McClellan is backtracking:

The newest wrinkle to the Scott McClellan-talking points story twists the whole situation 180 degrees. McClellan now says FNC anchor Bill O'Reilly never received White House talking points.

Johnny Dollar has the audio from today's Radio Factor, in which McClellan appeared as a guest. "The truth is I messed up. I was specifically not trying to single anyone out, including you," said McClellan. "There were people, not you, but there were people."

As for the response to his comments: "Some people tried to paint it in a black and white term to their preconceived notions," said McClellan. "I should not have left it open to interpretation."

Regarding MSNBC's Chris Matthews, who conducted the original interview, O'Reilly said, "Matthews played you. He played you."

Well, Scott, did Keith Olbermann, when he called you, confuse you as well?

What's really remarkable is that neither Matthews or Olbermann felt the need to question this latest bombshell. The obvious questions of, "why wasn't it in his book?" and "why wasn't it brought up in any interviews prior to Friday?" should have been asked immediately.


You've been spending too much time getting brainwashed on the Democratic Underground and Daily Kos forums. Those hate filled forums are nothing but a bunch of loony left wing nuts who hate everything America stands for. Nothing would please them more than for America to surrender to our enemies so we can be loved by people in other countries. Certainly you're not one of those loony people are you?

The irony of Biden...He was wanting and willing to be McCains VP.
Now an attack hack for the DNC and B. Hussein.

If only the sun could explode between now and election day. Either one of these clowns is going to make living in America a pain in ass for the next four years.