Don't worry, the title is just for laugh's, but the media IS throwing around that title. Anyone see Oklahoma County's push for a new jail? Don't get me wrong, I do think we need one, and I hope they do move it away from downtown. I know this has been talked about for years and they have been looking at land in the east county, but before it was supposively going to cost more to build new. Now the estimates are coming in cheaper to build new than to renovate our poorly built county jail.

Thoughts?

The Journal Record - Article

New Oklahoma County jail could cost $390M or more
by Sean Murphy
Associated Press July 16, 2009

OKLAHOMA CITY – A new jail could cost Oklahoma County more than $390 million, and renovating the facility that has been troubled by inmate escapes, suicides and violent clashes among inmates could cost even more, architects told county officials Wednesday.

An architectural firm hired by the county told commissioners a new 3,376-bed jail built on a 50-acre site would cost an estimated $391 million and require at least 300 new jail employees.Officials with Frankfurt-Short-Bruza also told commissioners that renovating and expanding the nearly 20-year-old jail would cost about $436 million and require about 400 additional employees.
“It’s certainly significant numbers, significantly more than we anticipated,” Oklahoma County Commissioner Ray Vaughn said. “We always talked about the possible renovation and annex costing somewhere around $120 million. This obviously blows that number right out of the ballpark.”

The 13-story building in downtown Oklahoma City has had problems since it was built in 1991. Within a year, at least a half dozen inmates escaped by pushing out decorative glass blocks and using bed sheets to climb down brick walls.

But the push for major upgrades grew after the U.S. Justice Department issued a scathing report on the facility last year. The report, which cited lax supervision, inmate violence and excessive force by guards, threatened a federal lawsuit if a resolution wasn’t reached.

Oklahoma County Sheriff John Whetsel, who manages the jail, said major changes have been made since the report was released, including increased training for officers and more scrutiny on every incident involving force. But Whetsel conceded the facility’s design is not ideal for housing the more than 2,200 inmates kept there.

Curtiss Pulitzer, an architect hired by FSB who specializes in the design of jail facilities, agreed with Whetsel.

“Physically, the place is clean and they run it well,” he said, “but the staffing needs are just tremendous because it’s a poorly designed facility.”
Pulitzer said the housing units are not designed to allow direct supervision of inmates by jail staff, who instead monitor inmates from control rooms where it’s difficult to see and interact with prisoners.

“Direct supervision results in much calmer institutions with fewer assaults on staff, fewer assaults on inmates, just a better operation all around,” Pulitzer said.

Vaughn said commissioners will work with FSB over the next few months to see what costs can be cut before the firm issues its final report in September. But something has to be done with the current jail, he said, describing it as “woefully inadequate.”

“We need to address that issue or we face the possibility of a federal lawsuit and the possibility of a takeover of our facility by the federal government,” he said.

Vaughn said he favors a countywide sales tax to help fund improvements or the construction of a new facility.

“Oklahoma County has no county sales tax, so I think it’s reasonable to look at that as a source,” he said.

A 1-cent countywide sales tax would generate about $120 million annually, although Vaughn said he would propose something less than that to pay for a new jail.

I'm sorry, but I'll be voting no on a new prison. The current prison isn't that old, and although it has its problems, why do we need to spend more tax dollars for a nicer prison? The one we have will work for the inmates.

You mean "NO"? Well for one it is over-crowded and has no room for future growth. Unfortunately crime isn't dying out anytime soon. It's an eyesore for downtown, poorly built, etc.

I know the county jail has it problems. Its ugly, it was poorly built (or designed) and its to small to house the current, let alone future inmates. How did a boondogle like this ever get built? Who was the general contractor for the current county jail? And why was it so poorly built? Decorative glass blocks......gimme a break.

I understand that a prison is going to cost much more than an average retail or commercial building but $391,000,000.00? Are you kidding me? Even harder to figure still is the cost to renovate and add on to the current jail at $436,700,000.00. Are the bars made of gold? Do the "decorative" glass blocks have diamond chips in them? Heres a list of comparissons for other notable projects.

Comparing project costs
→Proposed new Oklahoma County jail: $391.1 million
→Proposed renovated/expanded Oklahoma County jail: $436.7 million

→Existing jail: Completed in 1991 for $52 million

→New Cleveland County jail under construction: $45 million

→Bricktown Ballpark: Completed in 1998 for $34 million

→Ford Center: Opened in 2002 for $87.7 million

→MAPS for Kids: More than 100 school projects for $470 million (scheduled for completion in 2012)

I have absolutely no compassion for career criminals who probably make up the majority of the current jail population. I dont think you end up there for minor or first time offenses. How about charging them rent.

The costs as mentioned are mind-blowing.

westside, can you compare the costs to other similarly sized jails in other metro counties? Comparing it to Cleveland County or the Bricktown Ballpark, is apples and oranges.

I'm not opposed to building a new prison, but I think these prices are astronomical. I'd rather throw more money at the local school system than fund a new prison. Unfortunately, MAPS for kids isn't going to completely revitalize the OKC Public Schools like originally promised. They still need more money.

Nope....at least not right now. I got those figures form this mornings story in the Daily Oklahoman. I should have mentioned/given them credit for that. My bad. And yes, comparing Cleveland counties jail with the one in Oklahoma county is a strech.

I read that story first thing this morning and it blew my mind. Decided to put down the paper til I was in a better mood. lol I really dont have much experience in construction other than being on the blue collar side of it when I worked for an electrical contractor. But Im eager to learn just why it does cost so much? Any ideas Metro?

To be honest I couldnt care less about prisoner comfort.

I think we should build down one a large secured building above ground, the prisoner is secured till the building is secured. then elevator him/her down.
and for 20 floors or whatever there they are no way for escapes.
As for the cost its either we do something or the feds/state takes over and build a new county jail and no oversight by local administration and they will tax us with no recourse by county citizens, which I think Caddo County and one other that doesnt come to mind right now.

So let the feds/state build it. And a 20 story underground prison would be VERY expensive.

Put them in Crossroads!

Not a bad idea actually!

Patrick, its not going to be built for free, the feds will just levy it on taxpayers.

Yeah, but they'll cut costs. I doubt they would be building a $300 million + facility.

must i mention the 500$ hammer? lol

I remember when the current facility was being built in the late 80's and how incredibly sad it was that the only construction of any type in downtown was for a jail.

How things have changed!

Thank god! eh

I remember how many people call it The Money Pit ,and to this day thats how I see it

lol. Can we build a acid filled moat around it? Crossroads actually sounds like a good name for a jail too.

I keep thinking of Escape from New York and The condemned YouTube - Movie Trailer - The Condemned Now all we need is an island and a network sick enough to show the series. Whats one more sick reality show.

Hmmm ppv could pay for the construction costs!!!

I guess Im still confused on how the Sears-Willis Tower can be renovated for $350,000,000 and the new 50 story luxury hotel planned beside it would cost $225,000,000. Just what is so expensive in a jail as opposed to a luxury hotel?

They are I believe. There was some law in 06 or 07 that has them charge a daily fee if the person is convicted.

How about changing the laws a bit so we don't incarcerate so many people in the first place.

Incarceration Rate - Kaiser State Health Facts

As it is, Oklahoma ranks 4th per capita in incarceration rate. Also, the US incarcerates more people than any other nation on the planet.

Something doesn't sound right.

Another thought... privatize the prisons. It's working elsewhere. It could work here and save us money.

It would be nice to see a breakdown of what crimes the current jail population is incarcerated for. Any stats like that available?

Seems that a feasable solution would be to spend a little upgrading the present facility as needed plus build a smaller one to increase capacity.
If not that, then put the money into increasing the capacity of the state prison at Mcalister.

Seeing as how I actually know something about this subject (for once), I'll chime in. There are a lot of misunderstandings floating around in this thread, and I'll try to clear them up. I go inside the county jail two or three times a week to see clients, so I'm fairly familiar with it and the problems it has.

First, don't refer to it as a "prison". It's a county jail. The difference is this. A prison is where people go after they've been convicted of felonies. A county jail is where you stay while you're waiting for your trial (or where you serve out a misdemeanor sentence). The people in the jail are generally not serving out a sentence, they are normally awaiting their day in court and have not been convicted. They're generally the very poor, people who can't afford to make bond (only a small handful of people are held without a bond).

Second, the Oklahoma County jail is woefully unsafe. It's unsafe for the prisoners, it's unsafe for the guards, and it's unsafe for those of us who go in there to talk to people. Whatever you think about the safety of the prisoners, I didn't commit any crimes, and I deserve to be safe when I do my job. The problem is that the jail is so poorly designed that the guards can see maybe 2% of the floor at any one time. There are numerous blind spots, places where a guard might only be fifteen feet away, but he can't see what is going on. That's bad design, and it leads to increased prisoner violence. It makes the guards feel unsafe, and so they're more likely to be violent (and the guards who are less... savory... know they can get away with more). It is unsettling to go into the jail to see a client and find that you're in a room with someone who might just be a murdering rapist, and the door has locked automatically behind you, and the nearest guard is sitting in a near-soundproof room with no windows halfway down the hall. A few years ago, a pregnant woman who was incarcerated in the jail died when she were left handcuffed to a railing in an out of the way place and then went into labor. Guards forgot she was there and left her there for several hours.

You know it's overcrowded, right? It's so overcrowded that they have to keep the male sex offenders housed on the women's floor of the jail. Oh, they keep them in a seperate wing, but those wings all empty out into the same hallways.

The jail needs to be useful. People have to come to and from the jail every day. Each day, inmates are taken out of their cells, transported to the courthouse, and then sent back. Each day, attorneys, families, psychiatrists, probation officers, and the cute little chicks who work for the court services office go into the jail to meet with various inmates. There's a LOT of people going in and out every day. There are also a lot of people who move about from floor to floor of the jail. You've got medical staff, guards, the chaplain, various inmates being moved from one floor to another, people bringing meals, etc, who all have to go back and forth throughout the building. And the problem is, the jail isn't useful. It can take twenty minutes to go from the second floor to the fourth floor. This costs county taxpayers money, because everything takes longer.

We do not have an option to simply not fix the jail. If we do that, the feds will come in, they won't be concerned with "cutting costs" (why would they? they won't be paying for it), and they'll build a new one.

Why are the costs so high? The Sears Tower renovations covered about 3 floors, as I understand it. The problem with the jail is it needs to be secure. It can't just be any old building. Crossroads? There's no way they could have any safe oversight of that building.

How in the world was it allowed to be so poorly designed in the first place?

For starters, the folks of Oklahoma County need to fire wingnut Wetzel's ass. He's in charge, the federal findings fall squarely at his feet. In addition to that, he's the guy that tried to do an end-run around the city council a few years ago to get a new jail built. I have no doubt he's at the center of the current effort.

It makes no sense. The jail's problems are personnel related. They are trying to justify spending a huge amount of money on a new jail so that they can keep track of the prisoners with the number of jailers they have.

Here's a thought: if you quadruple the number of jailers and employ them for ten years I guarantee you that those costs WILL NOT EXCEED $400 MILLION. That being the case, there is no freaking way that this proposal makes any sense whatsoever from a return on investment standpoint. It's nuts.