Public Schools or Private Schools?

Okay, this question applies to both secondary schools and universities. Do you think going to a private school is worth the added cost? I'll comment later! I want to hear your opinions.

[mranderson]

If I could afford it, private all the way.

For Oklahoma City, Heritage Hall, then Harvard or Yale. Nothing less. The kids deserve a chance to make it big. These give them the best opportunities.

The responsibility of parents is to help their kids gain every advantage (ethacally) for the best life humanly possible.

I've known students that went through both Harvard Medical School and OU Medical School. Actually OU med students are more highly sought after. Unfortunately, many Harvard students just don't learn how to deal with diverse patients. I really don't see a difference in education though. Doctor's at both schools seem to be just as qualified.

I think it's kind of like comparing brand names to generic. Getting a degree from Harvard looks better, but I don't necessarily think it gives you any more qualifications than a graduate from OU, OSU, or UCO.

Standardized tests show that.

[mranderson]

"I think it's kind of like comparing brand names to generic. Getting a degree from Harvard looks better, but I don't necessarily think it gives you any more qualifications than a graduate from OU, OSU, or UCO. "

Let me give you an example. You are hiring an attorney. Say a Corporate Attorney. You interview one from OU and one from Harvard. Keep in mind, Harvard has the reputation of the best law school in the United States. OU, although some feel is good, is not as prestiqious. The score equally on the interview (in your opinion). Which one do you hire? Now. Replace attorney with Physician and Harvard with Johns Hopkins. Same question.

Personally, I choose Harvard and Johns Hopkins. More clout. More business owners are going to listen to a Harvard grad over one from OU.

[windowphobe]

Unless, of course, said Harvard grad wants too much money by dint of his Crimsonness.

(Steven Wright: "I studied carpentry at Harvard. I make cabinets that cost $58,000.")

Actually, last year, many OU med school grads were chosen over John's Hopkin's grads for residency programs out of state. Why? OU Med School offers a more patient friendly, interview-focused curriculum. Yeah, graduates from Harvard or John's Hopkins may be more intelligent, but that doesn't always mean they can appy thatknowledge in the clinical setting. I think personal communication skills are jsut as helpful in the clinical setting. You have to have both though.

[mranderson]

Originally Posted by Patrick

Actually, last year, many OU med school grads were chosen over John's Hopkin's grads for residency programs out of state. Why? OU Med School offers a more patient friendly, interview-focused curriculum. Yeah, graduates from Harvard or John's Hopkins may be more intelligent, but that doesn't always mean they can appy thatknowledge in the clinical setting. I think personal communication skills are jsut as helpful in the clinical setting. You have to have both though.

Yes. in THIS state. However, there are, afterall, 49 more states, and I bet most would choose Johns Hopkins over OU.

[El Gato Pollo Loco!!!]

Actually I'd rather have a University of Michigan doctor myself...but really if I'm about to croak from a sucking chest wound, am I really gonna give a rip on what piece of paper the doc taking care of me has on their wall?

[Midtowner]

Actually, most professionals in HR positions, or executives in charge of hiring, etc. will tell you that they don't give a rip about the paper on the wall. They are far more interested in experience. Don't believe me? Go look at monster.com. Almost ever single job that requires a degree also requires a certain amount of experience.

That being said, as far as the experience that those pieces of paper on the wall grant you, I'd say that (as an example), if I were in charge of hiring doctors for a hospital, I'd certainly give the OU grad a really close look if I were looking to fill a position in my trauma center. I don't know what Harvard Medical School is good at (I do know that they publish a heck of a journal), but if I were looking for a doctor that could conduct research for me, the Harvard grad would get a good look.

I think each of the degrees have things that they emphasize. I may be totally off on my examples.

Having looked more at law schools, if I were the hiring partner for a firm here in OKC, I'd probably take a graduate from OCU over someone from Duke, etc. for litigation work -- the faculty at OCU are all trial lawyers, whereas the faculty at Duke are professional instructors that don't practice law anymore. Conversely, of course, I'd give the Duke grad a look if I were looking for someone to do research, write briefs, etc.

[mranderson]

I really do not know what business people you are in contact with, however, nearly every business person I have known (and I have known a lot of them, many world famous like Ross Perot, a friend of my dad's), have said they would trust an attroney from Harvard LONG before they would trust anyone else.

Other examples besides Ross Perot of the people we have known. (mostly my dad, however I have met many of these) Boone Pickens, The original Mathis Brothers, and many many more. The list is long and many names escape me at this point.

mranderson, actually my post said OUT OF STATE! NYU last year chose 3 OU students over students from John's Hopkin's. Why? The clinical experience offered by the OU program compared with the John's Hopkin's program.

[mranderson]

Originally Posted by Patrick

mranderson, actually my post said OUT OF STATE! NYU last year chose 3 OU students over students from John's Hopkin's. Why? The clinical experience offered by the OU program compared with the John's Hopkin's program.

Sometimes I miss part of a post. Especially when I post from work. Sorry.

My point is still the same, however. Most prefer the services of an Ivy League graduate over a University with less prestige.

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by mranderson

Sometimes I miss part of a post. Especially when I post from work. Sorry.

My point is still the same, however. Most prefer the services of an Ivy League graduate over a University with less prestige.

Is that your experience in customer service at Dell?

Patrick and I are arguing essentially the same point. Different schools have different strengths and weaknesses. OU, for example has a great degree in meteorology. Most people would hire the OU meterology major/PhD before they'd hire one from an Ivy League school simply because OU's facilities and physical exposure to various forms of weather offer a better potential for instruction.

If I needed an attorney for civil litigation actually in the courtroom, I'd be reluctant to use an Ivy League attorney (at least a recent graduate) because their law school instruction is done by professors that don't practice law and in most cases, haven't for years -- now, if I needed someone to write briefs in complex litigation, the Ivy Leaguer would be my obvious choice.

I don't know how many Ivy League grads you know -- my cousin with a Harvard MBA actually made decent money out of college. I'll also make really good money (probably more than he did) once I finish law school. The point is though that every program has its strengths and weaknesses. Most people in the business world recognize that when looking at experience. In fact, these days, business people will tell you that actual experience matters far more than education.

[mranderson]

You may be different than most people, and that is your choice.

However, most people, myself included, would rather have someone with a higher end education than a state University like OU. They get more accomplished and usually result in higher reward.

Oh. By the way. I do not know what you meant by the Dell remark, however, try reading a message and hearing a phone call come on your line at the same time.

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by mranderson

You may be different than most people, and that is your choice.

However, most people, myself included, would rather have someone with a higher end education than a state University like OU. They get more accomplished and usually result in higher reward.

Oh. By the way. I do not know what you meant by the Dell remark, however, try reading a message and hearing a phone call come on your line at the same time.

Who are most people?

Appeals to anonymous authorities won't get you very far in life.

[mranderson]

Originally Posted by Midtowner

Who are most people?

Appeals to anonymous authorities won't get you very far in life.

Most: The majority, above 50%.

[Ms.Relaxationstation]

Originally Posted by Patrick

Okay, this question applies to both secondary schools and universities. Do you think going to a private school is worth the added cost? I'll comment later! I want to hear your opinions.

Let's say it like it is, money talks; experience succeeds.

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by mranderson

Most: The majority, above 50%.

The majority of all people say this? I was not aware.

Listen, you continue to say these things without having a single thing to back you up. You say this because you think it. Feel free to say that you "think most people would agree with you", however when you tell me that they do in fact agree with you, you are in fact telling a lie. You don't know that to be true.

You're making quite outlandish claim. I can say that the businesspeople that I associate with (and in my line of work, we deal with many such people, many of our clients are CEO's and owners of large and mid-sized companies) don't give a rip what law school their lawyer went to. They want to know what kind of cases they have tried and what cases they have won -- i.e. their experience.

I will admit that my sample is just as unrepresentative as yours and that until some factual evidence is provided, we're just stating our opinions and arguing about them -- an asinine excercise to say the least.

I also question the statement that over 50% would favor an Ivy league graduate over a state school graduate. In today's society, I'm not even sure if the school's diploma makes a difference. Seems like so many people are wanting experience. I bet an experienced attorney from OU would be chosen over a younger attorney from Harvard any day. If you're comparing equal experience, I'm not necessarily sure the school you attended makes a difference. Seems like a lot of employers now-a-days just want you to have a degree...they could careless where it's from.

Hmmm.....wonder if the Dallas Cowboys would rather hire someone from OU or Harvard? lol!

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by Patrick

I also question the statement that over 50% would favor an Ivy league graduate over a state school graduate. In today's society, I'm not even sure if the school's diploma makes a difference. Seems like so many people are wanting experience. I bet an experienced attorney from OU would be chosen over a younger attorney from Harvard any day. If you're comparing equal experience, I'm not necessarily sure the school you attended makes a difference. Seems like a lot of employers now-a-days just want you to have a degree...they could careless where it's from.

Ah, but individuals who have jobs that require High School/GED diplomas would tell you otherwise! Perhaps they should be discussing whether their employer would choose a Casady graduate over someone who went to U.S. Grant?

Absolutely right though.

[mranderson]

Originally Posted by Midtowner

Ah, but individuals who have jobs that require High School/GED diplomas would tell you otherwise! Perhaps they should be discussing whether their employer would choose a Casady graduate over someone who went to U.S. Grant?

Absolutely right though.

Funny you should use Casady vs. US Grant as an example, when it is common knowledge I went to Grant.

Grant was by choice. I could have chosen Heritage Hall or Casady.

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by mranderson

Funny you should use Casady vs. US Grant as an example, when it is common knowledge I went to Grant.

Grant was by choice. I could have chosen Heritage Hall or Casady.

Actually, I just randomly thought of an underachieving OKC High School. But the fact that you went here does make it better, doesn't it? Did your employer care where you went to High School? Or just that you had your diploma?

Would you say your experience played a greater role in securing your job? Or was it where you went to HS?

I do understand that you have a college degree, so feel free to think of your coworkers that do not when you are answering this question.

[mranderson]

Actually, as a graduate of the largest graduating class in the history of US Grant, I would hardly say it was an "under achiever," during the 70's. Plus the accusation of under acheivement was made by someone who was not even alive during the majority of the 70's, so, how would that person know. He does not.

Not only was Grant an achiever, it was also a premier high school with a very high number of students that came from upper income families. Plus, some very prestigious families had US Grant graduates. Carl Purser is the son of the late IG Purser, and Rodney Heggy (forgot the spelling) is the son of Tom Heggy. Both IG Purser and Tom Heggy were former chiefs of police in Oklahoma City, and IG Purser was also a city council member. Assistant police Chief David Shupe was a fellow graduate of the class of 1973. Rodney Heggy is now an attorney. Many of the families owned their own businesses including Jeff Burt who owns Suburban Home Furnishings (founded by his dad), my family, and many more. You can add Elmer Humphries who's dad was one of the executives of Mathis Brothers. This is just a small list of the many affluent people who were educated at Grant. Oh. I should add district 91 state represenitive Mike Reynolds.

Personally, I graduated seventh in a class of over 700.

I will admit, Grant is not what it once was, however, John Marshall is not either. Both now have primarily middle to lower income families now. John Marshall and US Grant were both equal in snob appeal. Both are being rebuilt. Yes, Marshall is being relocated, and Grant probably would have been, however, there is not enough available land in the Grant district and it is not feisable to relocate the district unlike Marshall.

Capitol Hill and Southeast were the low income high schools during the 70's. And they still are... Especially Capitol Hill. Grant was high income. Income of families usually tells the "achievement" level.

In short, what I am saying is to please not comment on the achievements of a school of which you have no real knowledge.

Now. Please. I request getting back on topic.

[Midtowner]

Originally Posted by mranderson

Actually, as a graduate of the largest graduating class in the history of US Grant, I would hardly say it was an "under achiever," during the 70's. Plus the accusation of under acheivement was made by someone who was not even alive during the majority of the 70's, so, how would that person know. He does not.

Not only was Grant an achiever, it was also a premier high school with a very high number of students that came from upper income families. Plus, some very prestigious families had US Grant graduates. Carl Purser is the son of the late IG Purser, and Rodney Heggy (forgot the spelling) is the son of Tom Heggy. Both IG Purser and Tom Heggy were former chiefs of police in Oklahoma City, and IG Purser was also a city council member. Assistant police Chief David Shupe was a fellow graduate of the class of 1973. Rodney Heggy is now an attorney. Many of the families owned their own businesses including Jeff Burt who owns Suburban Home Furnishings (founded by his dad), my family, and many more. You can add Elmer Humphries who's dad was one of the executives of Mathis Brothers. This is just a small list of the many affluent people who were educated at Grant. Oh. I should add district 91 state represenitive Mike Reynolds.

Personally, I graduated seventh in a class of over 700.

I will admit, Grant is not what it once was, however, John Marshall is not either. Both now have primarily middle to lower income families now. John Marshall and US Grant were both equal in snob appeal. Both are being rebuilt. Yes, Marshall is being relocated, and Grant probably would have been, however, there is not enough available land in the Grant district and it is not feisable to relocate the district unlike Marshall.

In short, what I am saying is to please not comment on the achievements of a school of which you have no real knowledge.

Now. Please. I request getting back on topic.

Okay, thank you for your tour of the completely irrelevant.

If it makes you feel better, let's take a graduate of Western Heights vs. Bishop McGuinness. They are both 25 years of age, neither with post-HS education.

They are applying for the same position.

Do their HS educations -- one obviously better than the other even enter into the picture?